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Terms and Endearment The forum the bean counters hoped would never happen. Your news on pay, rostering, allowances, extras and negotiations where you work - scheduled, charter or contract.

BA Direct Entry Pilot.

Old 26th Dec 2018, 21:09
  #5641 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Home
Posts: 919
When flying for GSS we occasionally used BA 744 sim, which could quite quickly be reconfigured for GE engines.
GSS used leased Atlas B774F with GE power plant.
cessnapete is online now  
Old 28th Dec 2018, 21:53
  #5642 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: UK
Posts: 85
No sim dates?

Hi all,

Hope everyone had a good Christmas and didn’t work too hard!

I did my interview / group ex stage mid November, received the “please book your sim assessment” email shortly after but still yet to have any dates populated on the careers website. Don't suppose anyone knows if they will be releasing dates soon or have they forgotten about me? 🙈

Many thanks!
crazypilot is offline  
Old 29th Dec 2018, 01:10
  #5643 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: somewhere hot and sticky
Age: 39
Posts: 270
Crazypilot, this is common. Don't worry they haven't forgotten about you, just keep checking regularly for slots to be added to the system. They get snapped up pretty quickly so don't dilly dally when you see a date that you can make. I was waiting months, but that was probably an extreme case. Good luck!
Dupre is offline  
Old 29th Dec 2018, 11:44
  #5644 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: UK
Posts: 85
Good to know, thanks!

Originally Posted by Dupre View Post
Crazypilot, this is common. Don't worry they haven't forgotten about you, just keep checking regularly for slots to be added to the system. They get snapped up pretty quickly so don't dilly dally when you see a date that you can make. I was waiting months, but that was probably an extreme case. Good luck!
crazypilot is offline  
Old 31st Dec 2018, 12:14
  #5645 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2016
Location: A castle in the sky
Posts: 22
Wondering if someone could help me out with some figures?

I am curious; what is the current basic salary for a long haul FO with 5 years seniority in the company? I've played around with the figures on ppjn and I'm guessing it is circa £78,500 gross basic pa?

How much would be paid into their pension in a year?

Is there profit sharing at BA or a share scheme?
GE115b is offline  
Old 31st Dec 2018, 12:36
  #5646 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: London
Posts: 70
Originally Posted by GE115b View Post
Wondering if someone could help me out with some figures?

I am curious; what is the current basic salary for a long haul FO with 5 years seniority in the company? I've played around with the figures on ppjn and I'm guessing it is circa £78,500 gross basic pa?

How much would be paid into their pension in a year?

Is there profit sharing at BA or a share scheme?
On top of this, would anyone be able to clarify what other payments are made? I'm aware of the 'flight pay' and 'away from base' payments. Is there anything else we should factor into our calculations, i.e overnight, overtime, disruption payments etc?

Many thanks
clvf88 is offline  
Old 31st Dec 2018, 15:29
  #5647 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: ubiquitous
Posts: 230
Originally Posted by GE115b View Post
Wondering if someone could help me out with some figures?

I am curious; what is the current basic salary for a long haul FO with 5 years seniority in the company? I've played around with the figures on ppjn and I'm guessing it is circa £78,500 gross basic pa?

How much would be paid into their pension in a year?

Is there profit sharing at BA or a share scheme?
Your figures are way wide of the mark.
Basic for LH FO at pp5/34 is just over £67K.

If you pay 6% into pension, BA will pay 15.6%.

No share scheme. There has been some profit sharing, but peanuts really compared to the £Bn profits.
Eddie_Crane is offline  
Old 31st Dec 2018, 15:52
  #5648 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Germany
Posts: 2,030
Originally Posted by Eddie_Crane View Post


Your figures are way wide of the mark.
Basic for LH FO at pp5/34 is just over £67K.

If you pay 6% into pension, BA will pay 15.6%.

No share scheme. There has been some profit sharing, but peanuts really compared to the £Bn profits.
Longhaul With 16k duty pay/allowances, not really that far off the mark. Year 3 on 75% contract I've heard a few individuals quote 4300 a month including allowances and pension/BAlpa fees deducted. As you are only removing the bit you are paying 40% tax on, the impact to net is more like a 17% reduction vice 25% gross. I think typical allowances on a 3/4 trip month longhaul on 75% contract are around 1300-1500 gross.
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Old 31st Dec 2018, 16:07
  #5649 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: The Winchester
Posts: 5,428
Originally Posted by clvf88 View Post
On top of this, would anyone be able to clarify what other payments are made? I'm aware of the 'flight pay' and 'away from base' payments.
I’ll let one of the newer joiners come up with actual numbers but general observation..

You’ve come up with the two main variables to add to basic: flying pay and time away from base payment..

Closest to an “overnight payment” is the “Daily Overseas Allowance”...which will not make you a millionare..

Overtime (if you can fit it in) is available ...but doesn’t pay a staggeringly high multiple of the normal rate.

Disruption payments (and similar such as the much lamented “lateness credit) have been whittled down over the years and on Longhaul only really starts to kick in if you are a day late back into base or more, so it is not something you can plan on as a regular top up to the income.



wiggy is offline  
Old 31st Dec 2018, 17:23
  #5650 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: London
Posts: 236
Year 5 L/H FO basic is £67658

Additional pay is as follows.

flight pay block to block £10 per hour
Time away from base (starts getting paid at check in and stops at check out in LHR) £3 something an hour of which about 30% is tax free although that won’t last much longer.

I would say factor in about another 15 to 18k a year in flight pay and TAFB pay.

Bonus forget about it, apparently there was some share scheme but I have never been paid out from it so I would write that off to.

Pension as previously mentioned 6/15.6%

overtime will be paid at about £60 per hour of credit (which I still don’t understand properly).

As with most things at BA the rostering/Pay/contracts/agreements are so complicated it’s almost impossible to give you a straight forward answer to the question.
Enzo999 is offline  
Old 31st Dec 2018, 18:00
  #5651 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2016
Location: A castle in the sky
Posts: 22
Thanks for the figures.

Very surprising to be honest; a lot of people would be giving up commands on 737/320s if joining BA. I didn't realise that the pay cut you would have to take is so dramatic!
GE115b is offline  
Old 31st Dec 2018, 20:27
  #5652 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: London
Posts: 70
Thanks for taking the time to post the numbers gents.

GE115B - agreed.
clvf88 is offline  
Old 1st Jan 2019, 09:05
  #5653 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2018
Location: London
Posts: 69
The pay isn’t the reason to get into BA , I honestly think the main reason people want to get into this weird outfit is to “fly the flag” , “to fly to serve” . Just awful
Riskybis is offline  
Old 1st Jan 2019, 09:30
  #5654 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: The Winchester
Posts: 5,428
Originally Posted by Riskybis View Post
The pay isn’t the reason to get into BA , I honestly think the main reason people want to get into this weird outfit is to “fly the flag” , “to fly to serve” . Just awful


If you think that is the “main” reason, or has even been on the radar of any of us had for joining BA in recent years or even 20 or 30 years ago I think you are to put it very politely very very badly mistaken. If you have gathered that opinion whilst working in BA I can only think have been keeping very strange company and I won’t ask what fleet you are on.

I’ve been in BA just a few decades and In all honesty I have never ever heard any crew (pilots or cabin crew) parroting those old and somewhat dated advertising slogans as their reason for joining....at all..ever.
.
More likely reasons for joining I have heard from my pilot colleagues are things like being based in the south east U.K, being able to fly the likes of the 747, 777, 787, even the 380....In days of old people joined in part because it was a company with a decent pension scheme, and a “world leading rostering system” (stop laughing at the back) and the Aspirational bid system was and is a plus because it still allows people to dabble in Shorthaul, move to Longhaul, see the world..etc.

Just my MHO though (oh, I do agree with your comment about pay)






wiggy is offline  
Old 1st Jan 2019, 09:51
  #5655 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: UK
Posts: 94
Originally Posted by Riskybis View Post
The pay isn’t the reason to get into BA , I honestly think the main reason people want to get into this weird outfit is to “fly the flag” , “to fly to serve” . Just awful
I've just heard I've been successful in my Sim Assessment and have a start date in the Spring. I'm coming to BA from the military and of all of my friends and colleagues who have also got in, not one has stated the reasons you cite for joining. Whilst the pay isn't stellar, it's not bad and is comparable to what we get now. For us, BA represents job security, excellent training, incremental pay (as many of us have topped out in the RAF), the ability to fly LH and get a 777,787 etc type rating, the ability to settle in one location and finally travel to destinations that don't require you to live in a tent and get shot at on a regular basis.

Whilst I concede that BA isn't going to perfect (show me a job that is), it'll do for me and I'm very happy to have made the grade. In the unlikely event that I don't like it, I'll move to somewhere else (and give 3 months notice, not 12).
skaterboi is offline  
Old 1st Jan 2019, 10:06
  #5656 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: The Winchester
Posts: 5,428
Skaterboi...Firstly congratulations...

Originally Posted by skaterboi View Post
... and finally travel to destinations that don't require you to.....get shot at on a regular basis.
Well...there is the return to ISB on the 787......... ..., that aside you will find there are some “interesting destinations” with security issues at ground level, plus silly stuff like the odd scud thrown in the very general direction of RUH from time to time and at least one other occasionally “hot” ME destination where one has been known to have to take cover...but I do take your point
wiggy is offline  
Old 1st Jan 2019, 10:16
  #5657 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Germany
Posts: 2,030
Originally Posted by wiggy View Post
Skaterboi...Firstly congratulations...

Well...there is the return to ISB on the 787......... ..., that aside you will find there are some “interesting destinations” with security issues at ground level, plus silly stuff like the odd scud thrown in the very general direction of RUH from time to time and at least one other occasionally “hot” ME destination where one has been known to have to take cover...but I do take your point
Need to increase Cap to these destinations then and make them more enticing for some of those enjoying the golf too often down in Jo Berg!
VinRouge is offline  
Old 1st Jan 2019, 10:51
  #5658 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: WILTSHIRE
Posts: 82
Originally Posted by Riskybis View Post
The pay isn’t the reason to get into BA , I honestly think the main reason people want to get into this weird outfit is to “fly the flag” , “to fly to serve” . Just awful
Really - Trust me there are many/some on the SH fleet........particularly two stripers......
red9 is offline  
Old 1st Jan 2019, 11:05
  #5659 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: The Winchester
Posts: 5,428
Oh well...I stand corrected .. I’ve never witnessed that myself ....are you actually literally hearing people saying e.g. they joined “ to fly the flag” or similar... ??? I’ve never even heard the real real youngsters on the other side of the flight deck door -Mixed Fleet, regurgitate that sort of nonsense..

Maybe too much recruiting/exposure to some of our social media hero’s is causing this....I suggest we should make sure we continue to recruit more cynical/grounded old f******* The Forces used to have a few...







Last edited by wiggy; 1st Jan 2019 at 11:16.
wiggy is offline  
Old 1st Jan 2019, 12:08
  #5660 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: UK
Posts: 569
I do not think there are especially many who joined purely because they wanted to fly the flag. There are plenty who assumed the ‘national flag carrier’ would have superior terms and conditions though.
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