Rules regarding strike breaking France
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Rules regarding strike breaking France
Hi
I wonder if anyone has any definitive advice regarding strike laws in France a colleague of mine working for an Orange airline has just had a radical change made to their roster positioning them out to France to then operate a duty day that co insides with a planned SNPL pilots strike. My colleague is employed on a UK contract and under that contract can be asked to work anywhere on the company network. The striking pilots are on French contracts although all are employed by the same company. So question is is it legal for the company to send him to France to cross a French picket line and Strike break and are there any other legal issues they should be aware of, because as it stands my friend looks like being press ganged in to crossing a picket line and all the stress that will involve then forced to operate as a strike breaker in a country who's legal system specifically employment law he has no knowledge of?
I wonder if anyone has any definitive advice regarding strike laws in France a colleague of mine working for an Orange airline has just had a radical change made to their roster positioning them out to France to then operate a duty day that co insides with a planned SNPL pilots strike. My colleague is employed on a UK contract and under that contract can be asked to work anywhere on the company network. The striking pilots are on French contracts although all are employed by the same company. So question is is it legal for the company to send him to France to cross a French picket line and Strike break and are there any other legal issues they should be aware of, because as it stands my friend looks like being press ganged in to crossing a picket line and all the stress that will involve then forced to operate as a strike breaker in a country who's legal system specifically employment law he has no knowledge of?
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Best get there and asses the situation, if he feels that his personal safety is under threat then he can just walk away.
No company would take action against a contractor under those circumstances as it would cost them very dearly in treasure and reputation should it come to court.
No company would take action against a contractor under those circumstances as it would cost them very dearly in treasure and reputation should it come to court.
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picton - this is nothing new regarding easyJet and you have no standing so your 'colleague' will have to take their medicine and just go and do what they are paid to do.
UK pilots have always been called out at very short notice to cover the foreign bases whenever the fellow bretheren could not be bothered to turn up for work, for whatever reason..!
Andy Harrison used to send out lovely warm emails to the pilot and CC workforce every time the Frogs went on strike (2007/2008/2009/2010....get the picture) informing that it was mandatory to go and then went in to the legal coverings as to why you could not say "Non..!"
Enjoy - lovely cheese platter in The Sheraton
UK pilots have always been called out at very short notice to cover the foreign bases whenever the fellow bretheren could not be bothered to turn up for work, for whatever reason..!
Andy Harrison used to send out lovely warm emails to the pilot and CC workforce every time the Frogs went on strike (2007/2008/2009/2010....get the picture) informing that it was mandatory to go and then went in to the legal coverings as to why you could not say "Non..!"
Enjoy - lovely cheese platter in The Sheraton
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Zoso - get real - been there - covered for you. Have a nice 'break'.
When was the last time the French striked in Winter?
You can't challenge me here Zoso - take a back seat and keep face
When was the last time the French striked in Winter?
You can't challenge me here Zoso - take a back seat and keep face
Last edited by Craggenmore; 12th Aug 2012 at 21:44.
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Not me, you moron. You'd be perfectly happy to let the management shag you up the arse until there's nothing left, huh? Or, if you were able, would you make a stand to stop the rot?
Still you are able to legally strike at short notice so carry on. Did the Brits not ride to the rescue twice in the last century?.....
What goes around comes around guys.
Your eagerness to dilute your colleagues ability to strike, as is their right,
Will also enable foreign Easyjet pilots to operate from Gatwick to shaft you while the management laughs at your stupidity.
Remember, who ultimately wins from this situation.
Your extra few bob from working on France is chickenfeed compared to the oppertunity you have now given your management to divide and conquer.
Your eagerness to dilute your colleagues ability to strike, as is their right,
Will also enable foreign Easyjet pilots to operate from Gatwick to shaft you while the management laughs at your stupidity.
Remember, who ultimately wins from this situation.
Your extra few bob from working on France is chickenfeed compared to the oppertunity you have now given your management to divide and conquer.
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Your eagerness to dilute your colleagues ability to strike, as is their right
So waffler what is your point? We are not being divided and conquered but utilised by our management to cover a duty which has not been allocated a crew member ( for whatever reason sickness,compassionate grounds, death or in this case strike action)
Andy Harrison used to send out lovely warm emails to the pilot and CC workforce every time the Frogs went on strike (2007/2008/2009/2010....get the picture) informing that it was mandatory to go and then went in to the legal coverings as to why you could not say "Non..!"
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Waffler and Zoso
The following is from direct.gov.UK
Now I dont recall BALPA organising a postal vote. I dont recall the easyJet Crew Council informing the company about the non existant postal vote. I know the square root of F$%k All about your French trade Union representation but I am certainly not going to take one up the ass for our French Comrades when unprotected by UK legislation.
The following is from direct.gov.UK
Dismissal and unprotected industrial action.
Official industrial action organised by a trade union is 'unprotected' if:
The trade union has failed to hold a postal ballot in-line with the law.
The trade union has not told the employer, in-line with the law, about the industrial action ahead of a ballot or ahead of the industrial action
It has been disowned by the trade union (eg because someone without authority called for the action, or because the trade union considers the dispute to be resolved), sometimes called 'repudiated action'
It is secondary industrial action (in support of workers of another employer), sometimes called 'sympathy action.'
It promotes ‘union labour only’ practices (also known as a ‘closed shop’)
It is in support of any workers who have been dismissed for taking unofficial action
other aspects of industrial action law have been breached by the trade union
Official industrial action organised by a trade union is 'unprotected' if:
The trade union has failed to hold a postal ballot in-line with the law.
The trade union has not told the employer, in-line with the law, about the industrial action ahead of a ballot or ahead of the industrial action
It has been disowned by the trade union (eg because someone without authority called for the action, or because the trade union considers the dispute to be resolved), sometimes called 'repudiated action'
It is secondary industrial action (in support of workers of another employer), sometimes called 'sympathy action.'
It promotes ‘union labour only’ practices (also known as a ‘closed shop’)
It is in support of any workers who have been dismissed for taking unofficial action
other aspects of industrial action law have been breached by the trade union
Last edited by Robert G Mugabe; 13th Aug 2012 at 14:47.
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Make me sick
I'm astonished at the amount of borderline racist comments being bandied around this thread.
World Wars and Southern African dictatorial achievements all encompassed within a short thread about Strike action in France.
Non sequitur?
World Wars and Southern African dictatorial achievements all encompassed within a short thread about Strike action in France.
Non sequitur?
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UK legislation unfortunately does not allow UK based pilots to strike or refuse a duty which covers the French strikes. To do so would expose the individual and BALPA to legal action. This is from the union. If we could support them we would. Everyone calling in sick for these duties could be seen as wild cat action. No-one likes it but if you are rostered to go to France, you go.
However this will all be at a cost to the company. Therefore the company have a tangible cost of industrial action carried out by the French pilots. I imagine it is causing quite a bit of disruption.
I think before some people throw around comments they need to investigate the legal landscape surrounding industrial action in the UK. I doubt they will do this though as they seem to be unable to even read and comprehend posts on here properly let alone something a bit more heavy.
However this will all be at a cost to the company. Therefore the company have a tangible cost of industrial action carried out by the French pilots. I imagine it is causing quite a bit of disruption.
I think before some people throw around comments they need to investigate the legal landscape surrounding industrial action in the UK. I doubt they will do this though as they seem to be unable to even read and comprehend posts on here properly let alone something a bit more heavy.
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5 RINGS (rings of the call-bell, or rings on the jacket. . . . like a Sailor. . . Whoops no, like a Capt in "certain" countries 
)
I am sure I am not alone in finding your unwillingness to listen/comprehend what is being said to you as bordering on tedious.
Are you honestly suggesting that the Easy employees on a UK Contract should breach their contract, ignore their Unions advice, and refuse/fail to show for work to support your action,the inevitable consequence being their dismissal.
It may be that your contract/legislation would allow you to reciprocate, but try, REALLY , to understand/believe/educate yourself to the harsh reality. . that theirs , does not. Send your vote of thanks for this to one Ms Thatcher.
I think you need to give yourself a reality check
)I am sure I am not alone in finding your unwillingness to listen/comprehend what is being said to you as bordering on tedious.
Are you honestly suggesting that the Easy employees on a UK Contract should breach their contract, ignore their Unions advice, and refuse/fail to show for work to support your action,the inevitable consequence being their dismissal.
It may be that your contract/legislation would allow you to reciprocate, but try, REALLY , to understand/believe/educate yourself to the harsh reality. . that theirs , does not. Send your vote of thanks for this to one Ms Thatcher.
I think you need to give yourself a reality check
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Ok 5 rings what do the unions and individuals do???? You are clearly the expert so tell us all please!!!!
As for a similar situation in the UK, the UK unions would not mind if those individuals were legally operating. Carrying out strike action is not about necessarily ruining the company financially and in the eyes of the public. It will have a financial impact and even if those flights are operated by UK crew, EZY will feel an impact!!
Therefore your point that there would be outrage from UK pilots is not valid. I am a UK pilot and I would not care. The reason I wouldn't and my colleagues wouldn't is that we are bright enough to realise that the public would be happy as the aircraft fly but the disruption and financial impact resulting from the strike would still be clearly felt by EZY!!!!!
Yes EZY are exploiting the law. There it is. You said it yourself. It's legal.
I have to agree you need a reality check. If individuals or unions expose themselves then it could in the worst case seriously damage the union. The union would therefore become weaker. Management would then be able to push through further reforms. This would weaken the union further and further. This "game" has to be played carefully and strategically, without exposing anyone to recourse from the courts or the company.
No the issue will not go away....which is why the game has to be played carefully!
It appears like you have a chip your shoulder. You are trying to blame uk pilots for strike breaking and in this case for not being strong enough to stand up to the company. Total rubbish. In fact it kind of comes across like you have no real point other than to moan at Brits for "strike breaking". Which as you said yourself.....they aren't, as unfortunately it's legal. Can I just point out that the thread was started as clearly the individual concerned did NOT want to strike break!!!! So what actually is your point?
As for a similar situation in the UK, the UK unions would not mind if those individuals were legally operating. Carrying out strike action is not about necessarily ruining the company financially and in the eyes of the public. It will have a financial impact and even if those flights are operated by UK crew, EZY will feel an impact!!
Therefore your point that there would be outrage from UK pilots is not valid. I am a UK pilot and I would not care. The reason I wouldn't and my colleagues wouldn't is that we are bright enough to realise that the public would be happy as the aircraft fly but the disruption and financial impact resulting from the strike would still be clearly felt by EZY!!!!!
Yes EZY are exploiting the law. There it is. You said it yourself. It's legal.
I have to agree you need a reality check. If individuals or unions expose themselves then it could in the worst case seriously damage the union. The union would therefore become weaker. Management would then be able to push through further reforms. This would weaken the union further and further. This "game" has to be played carefully and strategically, without exposing anyone to recourse from the courts or the company.
No the issue will not go away....which is why the game has to be played carefully!
It appears like you have a chip your shoulder. You are trying to blame uk pilots for strike breaking and in this case for not being strong enough to stand up to the company. Total rubbish. In fact it kind of comes across like you have no real point other than to moan at Brits for "strike breaking". Which as you said yourself.....they aren't, as unfortunately it's legal. Can I just point out that the thread was started as clearly the individual concerned did NOT want to strike break!!!! So what actually is your point?
Last edited by one post only!; 14th Aug 2012 at 11:28.
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5 RINGS
I agree with you 100% that their ability to play one workforce off against another is to nobodys advantage, and next time it will indeed probably be the "Europeans" working against the Brits.
However, I think telling someone to "grow a spine" does nothing to acknowledge that members of a Union would be very poorly placed to strike against that Unions advice & the Union would also be very poorly placed to call a strike if it couldn't be undertaken whilst respecting the law of the country in which the individuals were contracted.
Frustrating as it is for you (and as you rightfully pointed out, will probably be one day for the Rosbifs when the situation is reversed) I don't think lambasting your colleagues the other side of the Channel is the solution.
The frankly ineffectual Unions have had more than a decade to observe & react to the Ryanair situation, where effective representation has been frustrated by having people in contracts signed in different countries.
Their failure to find a solution to this, probably involving some Pan-European Union or conglomerate thereof, is the real scandal, NOT the unwillingness of any pilot body to put their head on the chopping block with no protection from their Union nor National law.
The Unity (or lack thereof) & mindless attempt to blame the UK workforce displayed here by yourself & Zoso (& indeed some of the comments from the UK contingent don't help the "entente cordiale" ) does not give me too much hope that you are any closer to Unity than your Irish flagged competitors.
"Divide & Conquer" scores another victory before the battle has even commenced.
I agree with you 100% that their ability to play one workforce off against another is to nobodys advantage, and next time it will indeed probably be the "Europeans" working against the Brits.
However, I think telling someone to "grow a spine" does nothing to acknowledge that members of a Union would be very poorly placed to strike against that Unions advice & the Union would also be very poorly placed to call a strike if it couldn't be undertaken whilst respecting the law of the country in which the individuals were contracted.
Frustrating as it is for you (and as you rightfully pointed out, will probably be one day for the Rosbifs when the situation is reversed) I don't think lambasting your colleagues the other side of the Channel is the solution.
The frankly ineffectual Unions have had more than a decade to observe & react to the Ryanair situation, where effective representation has been frustrated by having people in contracts signed in different countries.
Their failure to find a solution to this, probably involving some Pan-European Union or conglomerate thereof, is the real scandal, NOT the unwillingness of any pilot body to put their head on the chopping block with no protection from their Union nor National law.
The Unity (or lack thereof) & mindless attempt to blame the UK workforce displayed here by yourself & Zoso (& indeed some of the comments from the UK contingent don't help the "entente cordiale" ) does not give me too much hope that you are any closer to Unity than your Irish flagged competitors.
"Divide & Conquer" scores another victory before the battle has even commenced.
Last edited by captplaystation; 14th Aug 2012 at 11:24.
