Ryanair current situation for DECs
Thread Starter
ECON cruise, LR cruise...
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From: MIRSI hold - give or take...
Ryanair current situation for DECs
Hi all,
Before starting any post concerning RYR, I always start with the usual disclaimers:
- I know the company well and am fully aware what I might or might not let myself in for
- I have heard all the pro's and con's a million times over, and this post is no invitation to re-hash it all - use the search function if you're of that inclination...
- This thread is FACT-finding only - so if you have OPINIONS to share, please deposit these in another thread or in Hamster Wheel on JB
OK, that's covered...
...now to the real purpose. RYR are still accepting applications from DECs.
1) Are they actually hiring - or building a hold pool?
2) If they are hiring - are they only offering Brookfield contracts?
3) What is the current basic pay on a UK contract (to compare whit when I left 2.5 years ago...)
4) Are any Irish bases open for transfer, or is it all Dubrovnik, Lodz, Almaty and Frobisher Bay?
Answers on a postcard, please
Before starting any post concerning RYR, I always start with the usual disclaimers:
- I know the company well and am fully aware what I might or might not let myself in for
- I have heard all the pro's and con's a million times over, and this post is no invitation to re-hash it all - use the search function if you're of that inclination...
- This thread is FACT-finding only - so if you have OPINIONS to share, please deposit these in another thread or in Hamster Wheel on JB
OK, that's covered...
...now to the real purpose. RYR are still accepting applications from DECs.
1) Are they actually hiring - or building a hold pool?
2) If they are hiring - are they only offering Brookfield contracts?
3) What is the current basic pay on a UK contract (to compare whit when I left 2.5 years ago...)
4) Are any Irish bases open for transfer, or is it all Dubrovnik, Lodz, Almaty and Frobisher Bay?
Answers on a postcard, please
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 1,270
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From: Cloud Cookoo Land
If you apply as DEC, I don't see them snubbing your application; unless you have some "history" from your previous tenure at FR 
The last major intake of DECs all applied through BRK. As long as PB is at the helm, then it will be a BRK only contract. I believe it is his policy to drive this way of hiring. On occasion they do offer permanent contracts, however flight deck (I've only heard of FOs) are selected for interview on the basis that they are 'deserving' and that the offer is some sort of 'holy grail' - the former may be true, however the later certainly wasn't.
That questionable memo arising from PBs office a month or so ago suggested that four OCC courses for DECs had been cancelled as they were no longer required. Believe what you like; however the vast majority of the spam can drivers here believe they were scrubbed because they couldn't fill them! Added to the fact that most LTCs who you query with regard to the last major DEC hire and training suggest that it was all a bit of a headache to put it mildly! Many were binned! Internal CUs continue at a rate of knots; however you only
have to read a few posts on here and speak to the odd jumpseating crew member to discover that new upgrade = shipped off to the land of far far away on a 5/3. As a result a number are unwilling to move to the left. (At my base
alone I know of at least 3 guys who are happy to stay in the right seat - they all exceed the hours required for command). There is also the issue of remuneration, which if you are permanent varies from base to base + 10%
"probation?!?" cut for new upgrades As you can also tell from Mavericks post, BRK Cpts rates are also being pushed back; however they were able to take advantage of a number of guys who came cap in hand after their respective
carriers went to the wall over a year or so ago.
A lot of DECs who I have flown with did get their base of choice when joining a
year or so ago, however I'm uncertain of whether there may have been a case of management conceding to desperation as they were short on numbers for summer 2010? Some have spread a theory that a number of new joiners had approached BRK with an offer to work for less on the basis that they were guaranteed their first choice base. I don't know what to believe really, however
anything is conceivable; as you well know
I think there are quite a few that hope for an "exodus" however I think it may only be wishful thinking. There is certainly a cloud of concern arising; especially if you 'read in to' PBs memo. However crewing levels will be more than adequate to ride the winter schedule. There will be guys heading to EK and I know of colleagues with interviews at both Etihad and FlyDubai which are scheduled for the winter. Almost certainly BA will look to take a number of our guys for their 737 classic fleet (I doubt they will be short on choice from the volume of applications from FR!). EI will also be recruiting for next year, however rumour is that they will be following BAs line a looking for those already rated and current the 'Bus. I have also heard that a UK carrier
(Thomas Cook anyone?) will be placing an order with Boeing for NGs, however they'll be a long time in coming and they are also most probably replacement frames. So mass exodus or continuous trickle? You tell me? I reckon all won't
be truly revealed till summer 2011. Then the outcome will become apparent.
I'm not keen on painting all the blemishes, however you asked for transparency. I wouldn't go as far as agreeing with Maverick with regards to steering clear, however I can understand why there are many who are truly pissed at what is happening. I am still happy, however happiness can shift to dispair. I've witnessed it unfortunately. As for your Irish base, forgett it. It won't happen. I'm not even going to give you a glimmer of hope on that one.
Goodluck in the path you choose to persue. CK
The last major intake of DECs all applied through BRK. As long as PB is at the helm, then it will be a BRK only contract. I believe it is his policy to drive this way of hiring. On occasion they do offer permanent contracts, however flight deck (I've only heard of FOs) are selected for interview on the basis that they are 'deserving' and that the offer is some sort of 'holy grail' - the former may be true, however the later certainly wasn't.That questionable memo arising from PBs office a month or so ago suggested that four OCC courses for DECs had been cancelled as they were no longer required. Believe what you like; however the vast majority of the spam can drivers here believe they were scrubbed because they couldn't fill them! Added to the fact that most LTCs who you query with regard to the last major DEC hire and training suggest that it was all a bit of a headache to put it mildly! Many were binned! Internal CUs continue at a rate of knots; however you only
have to read a few posts on here and speak to the odd jumpseating crew member to discover that new upgrade = shipped off to the land of far far away on a 5/3. As a result a number are unwilling to move to the left. (At my base
alone I know of at least 3 guys who are happy to stay in the right seat - they all exceed the hours required for command). There is also the issue of remuneration, which if you are permanent varies from base to base + 10%
"probation?!?" cut for new upgrades As you can also tell from Mavericks post, BRK Cpts rates are also being pushed back; however they were able to take advantage of a number of guys who came cap in hand after their respective
carriers went to the wall over a year or so ago.
A lot of DECs who I have flown with did get their base of choice when joining a
year or so ago, however I'm uncertain of whether there may have been a case of management conceding to desperation as they were short on numbers for summer 2010? Some have spread a theory that a number of new joiners had approached BRK with an offer to work for less on the basis that they were guaranteed their first choice base. I don't know what to believe really, however
anything is conceivable; as you well know
I think there are quite a few that hope for an "exodus" however I think it may only be wishful thinking. There is certainly a cloud of concern arising; especially if you 'read in to' PBs memo. However crewing levels will be more than adequate to ride the winter schedule. There will be guys heading to EK and I know of colleagues with interviews at both Etihad and FlyDubai which are scheduled for the winter. Almost certainly BA will look to take a number of our guys for their 737 classic fleet (I doubt they will be short on choice from the volume of applications from FR!). EI will also be recruiting for next year, however rumour is that they will be following BAs line a looking for those already rated and current the 'Bus. I have also heard that a UK carrier
(Thomas Cook anyone?) will be placing an order with Boeing for NGs, however they'll be a long time in coming and they are also most probably replacement frames. So mass exodus or continuous trickle? You tell me? I reckon all won't
be truly revealed till summer 2011. Then the outcome will become apparent.
I'm not keen on painting all the blemishes, however you asked for transparency. I wouldn't go as far as agreeing with Maverick with regards to steering clear, however I can understand why there are many who are truly pissed at what is happening. I am still happy, however happiness can shift to dispair. I've witnessed it unfortunately. As for your Irish base, forgett it. It won't happen. I'm not even going to give you a glimmer of hope on that one.
Goodluck in the path you choose to persue. CK
Last edited by Callsign Kilo; 30th September 2010 at 14:12.
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 112
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From: UK
latest news is that they are just short of captains, - that command upgrades does not quite fill the need left seaters for next few months. so if you have some good contacts, or maybe even bellew might accept an email.. who knows...
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 24
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From: UK
I had a call (unsolicited) six weeks ago to see if I would be interested in coming back (I left four years ago.) They had already phoned my ex base Captain for a reference, asked when I could start, and what my notice period is. Since then NOTHING. I know of at least one other ex Captain who has had the same treatment in the last few weeks.
My conclusion would be that it is just some list of possible returnees, carried out with FR's usual flair and sensitivity.
My conclusion would be that it is just some list of possible returnees, carried out with FR's usual flair and sensitivity.
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 78
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From: Here I am
DEC
I heard from a colleague of mine that the last OCC course for this year was Sept as the Oct one was cancelled and some of them added to Sept course. This being said the colleague in question left to join FR and once he arrived they basically went back on everything they offered to get him there in the first place. Base, contract etc etc...
Needless to say he said NO and left them immediately. People always say the devil you know! I don't think anyone really knows FR and what they will do next. IMO don't go anywhere near them.
Needless to say he said NO and left them immediately. People always say the devil you know! I don't think anyone really knows FR and what they will do next. IMO don't go anywhere near them.
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 13
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From: LONDON
BOREALIS - Having attended the EK Roadshow I can confirm that PB was there.
I personally was not asked any questions by him, however I did see him chatting with guys (I say chatting as there seemed to be no sign of interrogation - guys seemed to be smiling and joking about something with him).
Good presentation by EK though. Do have to ask if so good why more aren't jumping ship to them?
Also its true what the previous statement said; DEC are no longer being accepted. Last DEC OCC course finishes this month.
Like other threads have mentioned I can confirm that the LTC's have had their hand full with some of the DEC not being up to standard, some by a long way.
I think the real story of FR and their pilot level will be seen at the beginning of the 2011 high season.
The memo sent out by PB is selectively factual - and to be honest what would you expect? Does anyone really expect to see a memo saying "High all, just to let you know we're seeing a huge increase in flight crew leaving."? Bare in mind that last years numbers where in single digits, so anything into double is an increase.
The memo covers FR contract pilots, not BRK pilots - if you inc those then the numbers are higher - however I would suggest not as high as everyone thinks. The job market is opening up nicely, however having been with FR for as long as I have, if people are thinking that better pay is on the way then I fear that they will be once again be disappointed. The number of crews that would have to leave for this to be considered, I feel, needs to be more than actually will. Its simply not in the FR Boards mindset.
Randomly to make things even slightly better all they would need to adjust is aspects of the rostering SOP's and certain members of crew control. However even that I'm sure would be shot down!
Here's to happy flying and steady work.
I personally was not asked any questions by him, however I did see him chatting with guys (I say chatting as there seemed to be no sign of interrogation - guys seemed to be smiling and joking about something with him).
Good presentation by EK though. Do have to ask if so good why more aren't jumping ship to them?
Also its true what the previous statement said; DEC are no longer being accepted. Last DEC OCC course finishes this month.
Like other threads have mentioned I can confirm that the LTC's have had their hand full with some of the DEC not being up to standard, some by a long way.
I think the real story of FR and their pilot level will be seen at the beginning of the 2011 high season.
The memo sent out by PB is selectively factual - and to be honest what would you expect? Does anyone really expect to see a memo saying "High all, just to let you know we're seeing a huge increase in flight crew leaving."? Bare in mind that last years numbers where in single digits, so anything into double is an increase.
The memo covers FR contract pilots, not BRK pilots - if you inc those then the numbers are higher - however I would suggest not as high as everyone thinks. The job market is opening up nicely, however having been with FR for as long as I have, if people are thinking that better pay is on the way then I fear that they will be once again be disappointed. The number of crews that would have to leave for this to be considered, I feel, needs to be more than actually will. Its simply not in the FR Boards mindset.
Randomly to make things even slightly better all they would need to adjust is aspects of the rostering SOP's and certain members of crew control. However even that I'm sure would be shot down!
Here's to happy flying and steady work.
