seniority integration/ UAL/CAL...NWA/Delta
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 11
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From: USA
The CAL/UAL process begins with the compilation and verification of each groups list. (Current stage of the process) Meanwhile, a joint negotiating committee (JNC) of Continental and United pilots is working towards a joint collective bargaining agreement (JCBA). The JCBA process runs on its own timeline, and must be complete before the seniority lists can actually be integrated. The process of seniority integration is guided by the protocol agreement signed by the CAL MEC and the UAL MEC, and ALPA merger policy. In the event that the two merger committees cannot agree on a complete integration of the lists through negotiations, policy dictates that any open items be brought to a mediator who will facilitate extended discussions. If mediation cannot produce an integrated seniority list, then the process moves on to arbitration. The arbitration panel will determine the outcome of any remaining points of contention; whether those undecided items are as small as minor details or as large as the entire integration will depend on the results of the previous phases.
Last edited by Shemya; 23rd July 2010 at 12:29.
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 11
Likes: 0
From: USA
Excuse my delayed reply I have been out flying.
If I recall correctly the only merger of pilot seniority lists in the USA to go true date of hire was Frontier/Central who merged back in 1967. All other pilot mergers have used a methodology other than true date of hire.
Current ALPA merger policy in the ALPA Administrative Manual, Section 45 – Merger and Fragmentation Policy, Part 3 4.e that applies to the CAL/UAL pilot integration of seniority lists if it takes place states:
“The merger representatives shall carefully weigh all the equities inherent in their merger situation. In joint session, the merger representatives should attempt to match equities to various methods of integration until a fair and equitable integrated seniority list is reached. Factors to be considered in constructing a fair and equitable integrated seniority list, in no particular order and with no particular weight, shall include but not be limited to the following:
Career expectations
Longevity
Status and category.”
Many other factors certainly will be presented and considered by the parties participating in the CAL/UAL merger process.
If the two merger committees cannot reach a combined seniority list then mediation with the aid of a mediator will the first attempt by the CAL/UAL merger committees with an outside party/parties to produce a combined seniority list. Should that fail binding arbitration to produce an integrated seniority list takes place.
Any attempt by me or anyone to predict the final decision from the above merger process would be pure speculation.
I cannot speak to the DAL/NWA integrated pilot seniority list other than to say the process is completed and the combined list is currently in use.
If I recall correctly the only merger of pilot seniority lists in the USA to go true date of hire was Frontier/Central who merged back in 1967. All other pilot mergers have used a methodology other than true date of hire.
Current ALPA merger policy in the ALPA Administrative Manual, Section 45 – Merger and Fragmentation Policy, Part 3 4.e that applies to the CAL/UAL pilot integration of seniority lists if it takes place states:
“The merger representatives shall carefully weigh all the equities inherent in their merger situation. In joint session, the merger representatives should attempt to match equities to various methods of integration until a fair and equitable integrated seniority list is reached. Factors to be considered in constructing a fair and equitable integrated seniority list, in no particular order and with no particular weight, shall include but not be limited to the following:
Career expectations
Longevity
Status and category.”
Many other factors certainly will be presented and considered by the parties participating in the CAL/UAL merger process.
If the two merger committees cannot reach a combined seniority list then mediation with the aid of a mediator will the first attempt by the CAL/UAL merger committees with an outside party/parties to produce a combined seniority list. Should that fail binding arbitration to produce an integrated seniority list takes place.
Any attempt by me or anyone to predict the final decision from the above merger process would be pure speculation.
I cannot speak to the DAL/NWA integrated pilot seniority list other than to say the process is completed and the combined list is currently in use.
Last edited by Shemya; 23rd July 2010 at 12:29.
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 2
Likes: 0
From: New York
DAL/NWA merged lists
Hey,
The DAL/NWA merged lists were done on a relative seniority basis. That's not 100% true, but it's true enough to write here.
I'm a DAL guy, so I saw the merged list as being one that favored the NWA pilots. DAL had more wide bodies, more international flying, and better crew bases.
A huge portion of the NWA domestic guys who were waaaay far away from flying internationally before the merger can now leave that DC9 out of Detroit and fly across the Atlantic in a 767.
The good news is that the NWA guys are a good bunch. As a NY based pilot for DAL, I have more in common with them than I do with the ATL based DAL guys!
Such is life.
The DAL/NWA merged lists were done on a relative seniority basis. That's not 100% true, but it's true enough to write here.
I'm a DAL guy, so I saw the merged list as being one that favored the NWA pilots. DAL had more wide bodies, more international flying, and better crew bases.
A huge portion of the NWA domestic guys who were waaaay far away from flying internationally before the merger can now leave that DC9 out of Detroit and fly across the Atlantic in a 767.
The good news is that the NWA guys are a good bunch. As a NY based pilot for DAL, I have more in common with them than I do with the ATL based DAL guys!
Such is life.
Joined: Sep 2016
Posts: 565
Likes: 0
From: N/A
It makes me wonder who people are, and why they would ask such a question.
Maybe they are lawyers working on another American super merger?
Let’s see if my prediction of a merger between JetBlue, Frontier, Spirit and Virgin comes true.
Although Alaska thew a monkey wrench in my idea.
But they could always sell it again.
Don’t know if they would make a profit on it though, as they paid way too much.
If your not from pre merger UAL/CA or DAL/NWA then why would you care?
If you are, it’s all ‘water under the bridge’ now.
If you want a job there, the answer is ‘on the bottom’.
I remember sitting on a NWA B747 jumpseat.
Written on the flight engineer panel in grease proof pencil was.
“NO DUCKS ON WHALES.”
North Central/Republic logo was a goose.
The North West Pilots didn’t want some Republic DC9 pilot from Detroit taking a wide body position with NWA.
As the prop turns, like sands through the hour glass, so are the days of our lives.
Maybe they are lawyers working on another American super merger?
Let’s see if my prediction of a merger between JetBlue, Frontier, Spirit and Virgin comes true.
Although Alaska thew a monkey wrench in my idea.
But they could always sell it again.
Don’t know if they would make a profit on it though, as they paid way too much.
If your not from pre merger UAL/CA or DAL/NWA then why would you care?
If you are, it’s all ‘water under the bridge’ now.
If you want a job there, the answer is ‘on the bottom’.
I remember sitting on a NWA B747 jumpseat.
Written on the flight engineer panel in grease proof pencil was.
“NO DUCKS ON WHALES.”
North Central/Republic logo was a goose.
The North West Pilots didn’t want some Republic DC9 pilot from Detroit taking a wide body position with NWA.
As the prop turns, like sands through the hour glass, so are the days of our lives.
Last edited by button push ignored; 16th November 2017 at 21:54.
