UNITE for pilots?

[flyhigh2fly]

Does anybody know if Unite represents pilots? if so how do you join?
If not why not?

I am pretty sure it will be a lot cheaper than BALPA where we pay 1% of our salary if not more.

I am also pretty sure they will do a better job of representing us.

What are your thoughts?

Thanks

[Brakes to Park]

My thoughts are that you're a deluded idiot. Look at what's going on in BA.

[flyhigh2fly]

Listen Pal, I am not even going to bother with you.
If you want to talk nonsense go somewhere else please.
This is a serious question I posted here

Thanks

[pottwiddler]

flyhigh2fly has a point though and surely there's a 'market' for two unions in any occupation. One being "a realistic and professional union but apparently impotent" one and "a neo-militant, but management ball-grabbing" alternative.

[Rushed Approach]

The fact is that no airline pilot would take your suggestion seriously, which is why this will be a VERY short thread.

[Bruce Wayne]

UNITE is a principle provider of funds to the Labour party..

Straight off, there is enough reason to kick UNITE 'into the long grass'..

Added to that, Labour is single handedly responsible for pushing through legislation that has significantly damaged the economics of aircraft operators and has failed to act to bring in legislation to prevent damage to the aviation industry.

You may as well throw money at the Labour party with note attached saying "please continue to screw the aviation industry please"

UNITE representing pilots.. its like a turkey voting for Christmas.

[beardy]

Why don't you ask the union direct instead of prevaricating on message board?

[deltahotel]

We got to a position in my airline of having enough T&G members to push for recognition. When T&G (now included in UNITE) were approached they said "not us pal, BALPA is the union for pilots". 3 or 4 years later we are now in negotiations over BALPA recognition.

[SiClick]

In BMI Baby the IPA are making a bid to provide an alternative to BALPA

[al446]

You ask a reasonable question, I have long been of the view that BALPA as a singular entity would be better if subsumed into Unite, at present just one legal finding against it could bankrupt it which may explain their timidity. As part of Unite it would also have access to greater resources of legal opinion and negotiators.

However, as things stand, any pilot wishing to join Unite will probably be directed to BALPA. It would be up to the members of BALPA to decide its future.

I know of the IPA but do not see them as serious players, their name is the same as an outfit from across the pond but they are not related, DHL recognised them but only to keep BALPA out, that may say something. I severely doubt that they could give greater representation than BALPA but have read insufficient.

Bruce Wayne - I am sure you meant "principal" instead of "principle" but maybe not, if not then excuse me for underestimating your ability to make a play on words. And there was me thinking you were just a short sighted dogmatist. However, re your dig at the Labour Party, was it not Gordon Brown who spoke out against the strike? Hardly the words of a rabid lefty I think.

[Norman Stanley Fletcher]

flyhigh2fly - you may indeed have asked a reasonable question, but it is not a sensible one. I totally agree with Bruce Wayne that Unite are not a credible union for pilots. In my experience, most pilots are more right wing in their views than left - by definition, therefore, they do not support the Labour Party. More importantly they would never contribute to an organisation who gives to the Labour Party and therefore for that reason alone they cannot ever effectively represent the pilot profession.

My first ever 'proper' job was as a bus driver in Glasgow and I was forced to join the TGWU (ie Unite) under the closed shop legislation in force at the time. It was a true eye opener to take the lid off the industrial madness that had taken over the country at the time. Love her or hate her, the day Margaret Thatcher brought in secret ballots, the T&G were finished. Intimidation on a grand scale was no longer possible and their membership shrank overnight. They have since re-invented themselves, but underneath it all are still the hard left, brain-out-the-window crowd of yesteryear. Listening to Tony Woodley spout forth to a meeting of the faithful outside Heathrow last week just took me back to the 70s and 80s. It was like a visit to the Natural History Museum, but this time a real-life dinosaur was prancing about on his hind legs and was on display for us all to marvel at. These guys are in the process of destroying British Airways and have zero grasp of the commercial realities of our world. Their company is losing a million a day (that's before the strike!) and expect to carry on with their snouts in the trough. A serious reality check is required very quickly or it will be well and truly game over. BA does not have a right to exist and Wille Walsh knows that only too well. Alas, their cabin crew, goaded on by the half-wits at Unite do not seem to realise that. I simply do not get it - how could anyone want Unite to represent the pilot community?

[BarrowBoy]

I too have personal expereince of BALPA & the T & G...... I was one of the many who BALPA sold down the river after 911...I wouldn't give them the drippings off my nose...

At my next company we tried to entertain the T & G as our representatives & were also told "no - go to BALPA"!!!!

Having said that I remained a member as on a personal level they put the fear of god into management. I had cause to use them & whilst their approach as a group maybe like dinosaurs on an individual basis they made mincemeat of the company & my situation went no further. I know of at least 3 occasions where they turned up (flat cap & greyhound in tow..only joking!!!) but on every occasion they were successful in their defence of the individuals circumstances.

As a group forget it....individually they are happy to represent you, forcefully & with a huge amount of resources behind them

[Caudillo]

Their company is losing a million a day (that's before the strike!) and expect to carry on with their snouts in the trough.

I simply do not get it - how could anyone want Unite to represent the pilot community?

Because if you look at where they've drawn their line in the sand for a company that is hemorrhaging cash and which offers great employment conditions - imagine where they'd draw it for a company which is making cash and which doesn't offer great employment conditions.

All the timid slowly-slowly catchey-monkey has achieved is to let the monkey grow into a silverback that is mounting you as we speak.

[B200Drvr]

My policy in life is never to be represented by someone with less than half my IQ. Being that I am not the smartest goose in the gaggle, that leaves UNITE stone cold. CMON, just listen to them

[Looker]

UNITE were briefly looked at as an alternative to BALPA at bmi Baby - but they were clearly not interested in representing a body of pilots.

I know others at Baby who are UNITE members and, as barrowboy mentioned earlier, they know their onions when it comes to representing individuals. They can go toe to toe with the HR Stasi and walk away with a result.

[Neptunus Rex]

Political Levy

It is true that Unite is a major donor to Labour Party funds. That comes mostly from the Political Levy that is taken from each member's contribution. What is not well known, and the Unions do not advertise, is that each member has the right to allocate exactly where their Political Levy is sent. You can opt for it to go to another political party, or to a charity of your choosing. There is an appropriate form to be filled out and signed and your union rep must, by law, supply them on demand.

[al446]

Political Levy

For clarification - You can also opt out of the political levy, same piece of legislation.

[UAV689]

although I am not a pro-striker I do think that aircrew need a union with teeth.

The BA CC strike over losing one member of staff on some flights is a bit pointless but I whole heartidly agree with them for striking over new comers T+C being worse than existing contracts. If only aircrew did the same, pay to fly would not exist, neither would contracting. And how much more effective would striking pilots be, they can hardly train up office staff to cover..!

Good on them for standing up for themselves. I hope the likes of EZY follow suit with their 6 months work experience type of 'work' they have been offering CTC'ers.

PS - I have greatly enjoyed honking my horn at you guys and gals round hatton x over the weekend, cheered me up seeing a bunch of lovely girlies waving flags as I was driving past

[speedbird320]

ROFL....!!!certainly made me choke on the corn flakes this am....

[Basil]

I have long been of the view that BALPA as a singular entity would be better if subsumed into Unite, at present just one legal finding against it could bankrupt it which may explain their timidity. As part of Unite it would also have access to greater resources of legal opinion and negotiators.

A good point BUT at what price to the independence of BALPA? We'd be expected to support other striking groups - no, thank you.
I saw enough of moronic left wing bully boys when I was an apprentice engineer. As has been stated, I refused to pay the political levy to the AEU.
I presume that, if BALPA were to be bankrupted, there would be nothing to prevent its members from forming another Union, say, The British Professional Pilots' Association.