Leaving the Airlines for something simpler.
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Krug departure, Merlot transition
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indie cent
Add in swell, constant crosswind..."
...in a float-plane???
Last of the problems I'd have expected!!
...in a float-plane???
Last of the problems I'd have expected!!
) with any significant swell (which will usually be perpendicular to the wind) it is preferable to land aligned with the swells... thus the crosswind.I think...
Anyway, back on topic, I've always thought THIS job must be cool:
http://www.airliners.net/open.file?i...sok=&photo_nr=
Join Date: Jul 2005
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Interesting thread. The theme of floatplanes keeps arising.....
Back in 2005 I did my ASES training at Browns - probably one of the tiny minority who actually get to use the rating - have a 1946 J3.
Anyway, there were 4 of us on the course - as a humble PPL I challenge anyone to find another place where you can learn, as comparative equals, alongside a Space-Shuttle pilot, a South-West Airlines Captain and a North Sea oil rig helicopter F/O. What struck me most was that all 3 of these professionals to a man stated that they did the seaplane course solely to get back to the basics of airmanship, stick 'n' rudder, no-computers, simple joy of flying. Really makes you think.
So, can you combine the simple life with the pay and benefits of a senior post in a main line operation? Almost certainly not. Not unless you own the operation. What you have to decide is how much $ is enough personally (you'd often be surprised how little you actually need, compared to what you think you need) then take the step. If you don't think you can do it, then you can't.
As they say 'life is short and when standing before St Peter, no-one regrets not putting in more time at the office'.
Back in 2005 I did my ASES training at Browns - probably one of the tiny minority who actually get to use the rating - have a 1946 J3.
Anyway, there were 4 of us on the course - as a humble PPL I challenge anyone to find another place where you can learn, as comparative equals, alongside a Space-Shuttle pilot, a South-West Airlines Captain and a North Sea oil rig helicopter F/O. What struck me most was that all 3 of these professionals to a man stated that they did the seaplane course solely to get back to the basics of airmanship, stick 'n' rudder, no-computers, simple joy of flying. Really makes you think.
So, can you combine the simple life with the pay and benefits of a senior post in a main line operation? Almost certainly not. Not unless you own the operation. What you have to decide is how much $ is enough personally (you'd often be surprised how little you actually need, compared to what you think you need) then take the step. If you don't think you can do it, then you can't.
As they say 'life is short and when standing before St Peter, no-one regrets not putting in more time at the office'.
Main Dog & Indie,
Your have hit the nail on the head, in any open water operations you must always parallel the swell. Or you will simply bash the aircraft to death very quickly.
Floating hull types (Mallard/CL415 et al) are a little bit better suited to open water ops but still must parallel the swell same principals apply.
To answer Hunterboy… well I am not complaining just trying to highlight the grass is definitely not greener. Hands down the stick and rudder flying is unsurpassed, luckily my career has covered gliders, single and multi helicopters, single and multi pistons and turbines, medium bizjets to Boeings, and on every continent except Antarctica and South America. But from a flying perspective for me nothing beats the hands on nature of float ops.
Everything is different in its own way and I have yet to experience anywhere near the constant risk assessment and re-evaluation of flight/ground safety that I did in 3 years on, open water floats.
I have never had to swim out to a Boeing at 0530 morning to start it and move it to the terminal! But that is par for the course if you are sitting in the left seat of a TwinOtter Floatie when the boat driver does not show.
Commercial Float & Rotary ops share many common attributes when it comes to off strip and confined area ops, with many shared principals. However it stops once on the water where you now become a boat.
So if you have entertained the idea of swapping seniority, a roster and stable income. For hard work, random challenging events, and pure exhilaration of conquering the elements with a unique combination of man and machine, there is no better place to cut your teeth than on floats.
The challenge is simply unique.
Airline pilots, PPL’s and Space Shuttle Skippers cant all be wrong
Can they?
Your have hit the nail on the head, in any open water operations you must always parallel the swell. Or you will simply bash the aircraft to death very quickly.
Floating hull types (Mallard/CL415 et al) are a little bit better suited to open water ops but still must parallel the swell same principals apply.
To answer Hunterboy… well I am not complaining just trying to highlight the grass is definitely not greener. Hands down the stick and rudder flying is unsurpassed, luckily my career has covered gliders, single and multi helicopters, single and multi pistons and turbines, medium bizjets to Boeings, and on every continent except Antarctica and South America. But from a flying perspective for me nothing beats the hands on nature of float ops.
Everything is different in its own way and I have yet to experience anywhere near the constant risk assessment and re-evaluation of flight/ground safety that I did in 3 years on, open water floats.
I have never had to swim out to a Boeing at 0530 morning to start it and move it to the terminal! But that is par for the course if you are sitting in the left seat of a TwinOtter Floatie when the boat driver does not show.
Commercial Float & Rotary ops share many common attributes when it comes to off strip and confined area ops, with many shared principals. However it stops once on the water where you now become a boat.
So if you have entertained the idea of swapping seniority, a roster and stable income. For hard work, random challenging events, and pure exhilaration of conquering the elements with a unique combination of man and machine, there is no better place to cut your teeth than on floats.
The challenge is simply unique.
Airline pilots, PPL’s and Space Shuttle Skippers cant all be wrong
Can they?
Join Date: Sep 2007
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Never made it to the airlines. When I got the call I was making more then twice their salary flying Be20 in the Arctic. Fly Caravan Amphib in Africa on 6&6 weeks sched. For real fun I fly competition aerobatics and air shows in Su 26. $$ is OK, life is good.
Join Date: Apr 2002
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Rotorua on the lake, North Island New Zealand.
Float planes and light rotary. Sadly, I was only on holiday but as I have ATPL(H) and (A), I very nearly asked if they needed an extra.
Beautiful place, looked like a great job. No swell on a lake either! It's always easy to see things as perfect when you're looking at it with your holiday goggles on.
Float planes and light rotary. Sadly, I was only on holiday but as I have ATPL(H) and (A), I very nearly asked if they needed an extra.
Beautiful place, looked like a great job. No swell on a lake either! It's always easy to see things as perfect when you're looking at it with your holiday goggles on.
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Some sunny place with good wine and good sailing
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Lets talk yachts
Well that's more or less what I've been doing for a few years!
If you want some advice on making the switch to a career on yachts send me an email, or check out my website www.yabr.net - sort of pprune for professional yachties...
BTW the Oyster skipper wasn't first name Gavin by any chance?
If you want some advice on making the switch to a career on yachts send me an email, or check out my website www.yabr.net - sort of pprune for professional yachties...
BTW the Oyster skipper wasn't first name Gavin by any chance?
Join Date: Jun 2007
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Listen Guys and Girls it all comes down to what you make of what you have!
I had a great day today for example, I did one flight and was finished by 11.30 am. I then handed over to my colleague who finished the day's work off which was another two services. Easy peasy!
What was really nice was all the little things! Glassy smooth take-off off the Loch, using cruise power only then sitting comfortably just below the cloud base and reduced visibility whilst ATC so kindly offered me a vectors for the 23 ILS with a break off for the river. I turned them down as politely as I could and continued happily to the River @ 700 ft. The leg out to the West Coast was mostly at 700 ft but with stunning views and fascinated passengers. Gorgeous blue skies and calm conditions greeted us on arrival at Ardantrive Bay. Following a pleasant 10 minutes of chatting and enjoying the fresh air we loaded up and headed off taking in the high road on the way back.
Again the day was the gift to us all and we made the best of it. ATC were without doubt the best I've seen and make what we want to do painless.
The passengers all signed up for an experience and we not in a hurry.
I've seen both ends of the stick, at Flight Levels also and am happy with where I am. I love challenges and continually learning but pay is excellent and lifestyle matches anything going here on the island.
That's my point! Experience teaches you what is good and what's not. If you've only tried a couple of jobs so far then it's hard to know for sure whether you're completely satisfied.
I've done the Whitsunday's, Sydney Harbour, Maldives, Bali, Fiji, Greece stuff and I'm happy here up north!
So long as your happy in the end! I couldn't and wouldn't recommend my path or any particular path to get to this junction either but I'd say a desire to see change and to learn has what's gotten me this far!
Cheer's,
Walu
I had a great day today for example, I did one flight and was finished by 11.30 am. I then handed over to my colleague who finished the day's work off which was another two services. Easy peasy!
What was really nice was all the little things! Glassy smooth take-off off the Loch, using cruise power only then sitting comfortably just below the cloud base and reduced visibility whilst ATC so kindly offered me a vectors for the 23 ILS with a break off for the river. I turned them down as politely as I could and continued happily to the River @ 700 ft. The leg out to the West Coast was mostly at 700 ft but with stunning views and fascinated passengers. Gorgeous blue skies and calm conditions greeted us on arrival at Ardantrive Bay. Following a pleasant 10 minutes of chatting and enjoying the fresh air we loaded up and headed off taking in the high road on the way back.
Again the day was the gift to us all and we made the best of it. ATC were without doubt the best I've seen and make what we want to do painless.
The passengers all signed up for an experience and we not in a hurry.
I've seen both ends of the stick, at Flight Levels also and am happy with where I am. I love challenges and continually learning but pay is excellent and lifestyle matches anything going here on the island.
That's my point! Experience teaches you what is good and what's not. If you've only tried a couple of jobs so far then it's hard to know for sure whether you're completely satisfied.
I've done the Whitsunday's, Sydney Harbour, Maldives, Bali, Fiji, Greece stuff and I'm happy here up north!
So long as your happy in the end! I couldn't and wouldn't recommend my path or any particular path to get to this junction either but I'd say a desire to see change and to learn has what's gotten me this far!
Cheer's,
Walu
Float-plane job in the Whitsundays.
Had a ride in the Beaver out of Hamiliton Island across to Whitehaven beach, park up on the beach next to the topless sunbathers, no traffic, no ASIC card, no whinging passengers, no security guy hassling you, no ATC, short sectors, bare feet, shorts and a white pilot shirt.
Had a ride in the Beaver out of Hamiliton Island across to Whitehaven beach, park up on the beach next to the topless sunbathers, no traffic, no ASIC card, no whinging passengers, no security guy hassling you, no ATC, short sectors, bare feet, shorts and a white pilot shirt.
It's a no-brainer 4 golds, like you I am lucky to fly a superb Jet (G550), swan around above 41,000 at Mach .85 worldwide, what do I crave? the old days low level in the C130 -my old boss (now Virgin Atlantic) told me that 'Albert' flying was the sport of kings - he was right. Military salary lousy but real friendship and a proper job!
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The low-level in the military is absolutely fantastic - however that is now a smaller and smaller part of the whole deal and the corporate bullS4i7 that is now starting to snowball makes it an RAF that you wouldn't recognise today!!!
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Let's not get away from the misty-eyed dream.
I'd like to hear from the mates driving light rotary/float planes in NZ.
Is the pay so crap? And how much? Why are you accepting that?
Then why?
Big difference between an hours builder and a soon-to-retire bloke from the airlines.
I've spent a month in NZ and have to say it is the most magical place (despite holiday goggles) I've ever visited, having actually lived in Africa (Ethiopia) and South America (Colombia), and obviously known most of Europe.
I'd like to hear from the mates driving light rotary/float planes in NZ.
Is the pay so crap? And how much? Why are you accepting that?
Then why?
Big difference between an hours builder and a soon-to-retire bloke from the airlines.
I've spent a month in NZ and have to say it is the most magical place (despite holiday goggles) I've ever visited, having actually lived in Africa (Ethiopia) and South America (Colombia), and obviously known most of Europe.
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Well I may have had it all without even realizing how good it was. Main duties included PIC on a corporate B757 and when not doing that, flying the owner's Twotter on amphip floats. Wound up with an ATP MES which is the rating I'm most proud of at this hour and no question about it, the most fun flying anyone could ask for. Really cannot consider myself an expert at this kind of flying as I left with only about 350 hours total in the Twotter. Yes...there is life after the airlines.
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well guys,
just an idea to combine both worlds, a good payjob and flying fun.
Last month I've rented a C-182 in Africa and flew around with my Mari Lou
and kids. Check it out http://www.bushpilot.co.za/
just an idea to combine both worlds, a good payjob and flying fun.
Last month I've rented a C-182 in Africa and flew around with my Mari Lou
and kids. Check it out http://www.bushpilot.co.za/
When I was flying piston twins I used to look up at the jets flying at high altitude and dream of the day I'd be doing that.
Fifteen years later on a nice day at FL350 I turn to the Captain and say "Wouldn't it be fun to be flying a C402 low level along the beach down there."
Now married with two children and the associated bills, it's not a possibility though. Prehaps when I retire a 2-3 day a week easy job will come along.
Fifteen years later on a nice day at FL350 I turn to the Captain and say "Wouldn't it be fun to be flying a C402 low level along the beach down there."
Now married with two children and the associated bills, it's not a possibility though. Prehaps when I retire a 2-3 day a week easy job will come along.
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Fascinating Thread which I have followed with great interest
I would like to add my little bit as I am pretty much at the opposite end of the scale. I am relatively low houred compared to most of you on here (just over 1200) A while back I was desperately sending out CV's looking for that 1st jet job with no luck. I was one of those guys sitting in a Seneca below FL100 in all sorts of weather dreaming of flying something faster and higher. This to me meant either a business jet or an airliner.
One day I was introduced to a guy who owned a helicopter and he said that he was buying a light turboprop as he was fed up with airport delays and would I be interested in coming to work for him. I looked at it as a step up and accepted straight away. He then called me and invited me to dinner to discuss salary etc. I worked all sorts of scenarios of what I wanted etc and off I went. He straight away said "right, I'm not sure what figure you had in your head but the way I see it is that you will be responsible for mine and my families safety. You are the only pilot hence you should be on a captains salary. At this point I was just nodding like an idiot with possibly a dribble of saliva coming out of the corner of my mouth. To cut a long story short, I now work for this guy full time. I fly maybe 3 days a week, no sector is over 2.5 hrs I get treated like a friend and a member of the family to the point where if the other half wants to come for the weekend to the yacht in Cannes she can and to top all that off I get a salary and benefits which rivals a senior Captain at most airlines. I can hand fly or let the automatics take the load, I can fly at 2000ft or FL300 the choice is mine.
Now. My point is. There are too many people out there that think a career in aviation has to be in heavy metal or something that flys at warp speed.(Although I do realise that a lot of the time that is where the high salaries are) Flying is flying and although I know I was very lucky to end up as I am, there are more enjoyable careers out there where the lifestyle of you, Mary Lou and the kids doesn't have to change. I got an invitation from a bizjet operator last month to go and fly a hawker, which was what I thought my dream was. In fact I was considering other ratings up until a short time ago, but I turned it down as I realised I'm already living the dream.
Please don't think that I'm boasting or knocking any other kind of career choice in aviation. Its just that there is life outside the airlines and the other AOC operators and you don't have to travel to the other side of the world to find it. Granted the people like my boss are few and far between, but they are out there and can be found. Remember what it was like when we were all trying to find that first job flying? Its no harder.
Just to finish, life is way too short to be spending time doing something that is not all that appealing and I for one do not want to be the richest man in the graveyard.
Good Luck to all
I would like to add my little bit as I am pretty much at the opposite end of the scale. I am relatively low houred compared to most of you on here (just over 1200) A while back I was desperately sending out CV's looking for that 1st jet job with no luck. I was one of those guys sitting in a Seneca below FL100 in all sorts of weather dreaming of flying something faster and higher. This to me meant either a business jet or an airliner.
One day I was introduced to a guy who owned a helicopter and he said that he was buying a light turboprop as he was fed up with airport delays and would I be interested in coming to work for him. I looked at it as a step up and accepted straight away. He then called me and invited me to dinner to discuss salary etc. I worked all sorts of scenarios of what I wanted etc and off I went. He straight away said "right, I'm not sure what figure you had in your head but the way I see it is that you will be responsible for mine and my families safety. You are the only pilot hence you should be on a captains salary. At this point I was just nodding like an idiot with possibly a dribble of saliva coming out of the corner of my mouth. To cut a long story short, I now work for this guy full time. I fly maybe 3 days a week, no sector is over 2.5 hrs I get treated like a friend and a member of the family to the point where if the other half wants to come for the weekend to the yacht in Cannes she can and to top all that off I get a salary and benefits which rivals a senior Captain at most airlines. I can hand fly or let the automatics take the load, I can fly at 2000ft or FL300 the choice is mine.
Now. My point is. There are too many people out there that think a career in aviation has to be in heavy metal or something that flys at warp speed.(Although I do realise that a lot of the time that is where the high salaries are) Flying is flying and although I know I was very lucky to end up as I am, there are more enjoyable careers out there where the lifestyle of you, Mary Lou and the kids doesn't have to change. I got an invitation from a bizjet operator last month to go and fly a hawker, which was what I thought my dream was. In fact I was considering other ratings up until a short time ago, but I turned it down as I realised I'm already living the dream.
Please don't think that I'm boasting or knocking any other kind of career choice in aviation. Its just that there is life outside the airlines and the other AOC operators and you don't have to travel to the other side of the world to find it. Granted the people like my boss are few and far between, but they are out there and can be found. Remember what it was like when we were all trying to find that first job flying? Its no harder.
Just to finish, life is way too short to be spending time doing something that is not all that appealing and I for one do not want to be the richest man in the graveyard.
Good Luck to all