Highland Airways
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Highland Airways
Does anybody know what kind of roster/pay/per diem/travel etc a typerated captain may expect when joining Highland Airways
and of course is this company any good?
SOAB
and of course is this company any good?
SOAB
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Money about average, £38k for a Capt. No per diems, although there is an allowance if you are away from base over 8 hours. Staff travel within the route network is limited to the islands, but we get Touchdown.
Biggest issue is the roster - which is unstable at best, dreadful at worst. Away from base all the time, not rare to spend 3 weeks each month away. self drive positioning around the country i hire cars before and after duty. An example: Drive INV-Abz, duty out of abz then drive back to INV. Leave INV @7am get back@1930. All for 1hr50 flying time. Aparently its legal so we can do it. Average 400 hours per year but duty max always reached. Ok for captains but Fos take years for promotion. Company hate having to pay overnights or any kind of allowance so will do anything to stop it.
Biggest issue is the roster - which is unstable at best, dreadful at worst. Away from base all the time, not rare to spend 3 weeks each month away. self drive positioning around the country i hire cars before and after duty. An example: Drive INV-Abz, duty out of abz then drive back to INV. Leave INV @7am get back@1930. All for 1hr50 flying time. Aparently its legal so we can do it. Average 400 hours per year but duty max always reached. Ok for captains but Fos take years for promotion. Company hate having to pay overnights or any kind of allowance so will do anything to stop it.
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Highland Instructor I can't help but notice you've made a grand total of 4 posts in your posting career to date, all 4 of which are dedicated to slagging off at Highland. I don't know what your particular problem is but if you're so unhappy there why don't you go and talk to them directly and voice your problems, rather than running the place down on PPRUNE to everyone who'll listen. Highland is unique in that you CAN go at any time of day you like straight into the senior management offices and talk to them about whatever's on your mind. Alan, Linton, Julie, Paul G, Nick VdM - they're all right there and every one of them are reasonable and approachable people who'll listen to what you've got to say, if you don't get on with one then go find other. You might not appreciate what that's worth until you've moved on to bigger things one day and find out what it's like to be a very small cog in a very large machine. Hats off to Linton and Julie, they listened to my moaning and complaining on more occasions than I could count and they didn't always agree with me but they did always listen, and on many occasions changed things to my satisfaction.
However you should also be warned (and you can take it first hand from me as well)that you will sooner or later find yourself upstairs in Sutherland or Kerrowgair on the receiving end of a well deserved bollocking from Captain C., should your natural exuberance lead you to excessive PPRUNEing, stirring the pot or engaging in trash talking amongst your fellow pilots. They are very aware of what goes on. Take it from me I know (my goodness do I ever know!) how easy it is to slide into negativity and bitchiness when you're in the day to day grind of the Highland operation and the Scottish winter, but you might want to be a bit more careful - there can't be that many "Highland Instructors" in the RHS and the management do read PPRUNE you know. (And they all know exactly who I am, so I've got no axe to grind!)
Back to the question at hand Mr Beech. With the benefit of a couple of years of rose tinted hindsight, I'd recommend Highland as one of the most enjoyable little turboprop operators in the world. As for the money, as INV based J31 captain, maybe expect to take home +/- 100 either side of £2600 per month depending on how the roster and allowances pan out in a given month. No point in describing specifics of rosters these days because they vary so widely according to where you're based (something that was not really apparent in my day) so the life of a Warton or Cardiff based pilot is going to be completely different to that of a INV one. Do you know where they want to base you?
They do roster up to the max legal duty there's no question about that - but show me a company who doesn't, these days.
The southern based pilots tend to have more stable rosters, only work 3 or 4 days a week between monday and friday, they hardly ever work weekends apart from occasionally ferrying a plane up north for maintenance, and they're at home most nights. Obviously that's got a lot of appeal for many people. However, they also have to sit around in crew rooms for countless hours all day, which can be like watching paint dry (especially in the RAF bases), and the flying is all boring IFR airways.
The INV based guys do get a roster based much more around 7-days-a-week operations, and it's true that they're occasionally rostered for a bit of time away from home covering the crews in the other bases and doing the charters. It's also a much more physical job, when you're doing the freight runs, you will be hand loading and unloading one-and-a-half tons of Daily Mirrors a few times a week which can be bloody hard on the lower back. However, the payback is that they earn slightly better money through the allowances, and they get some of the most enjoyable and varied flying to be had on this earth. Poling around the western and northern isles VFR in the turboprop in a fine summer's day is just about as good as life gets in my opinion. INV is just a cracking place to live as well, all the outdoors lifestyle is right there on your doorstep and a lot cheaper living than down south as well. The weather's better than England believe it or not, it's not well known but that few square miles of little microclimate around the Inverness / Nairn / Black Isle area is one of the lowest rainfall areas in Britain. If they could only get some tax free salaries and big long haul jets up there, I'd go back tomorrow
However you should also be warned (and you can take it first hand from me as well)that you will sooner or later find yourself upstairs in Sutherland or Kerrowgair on the receiving end of a well deserved bollocking from Captain C., should your natural exuberance lead you to excessive PPRUNEing, stirring the pot or engaging in trash talking amongst your fellow pilots. They are very aware of what goes on. Take it from me I know (my goodness do I ever know!) how easy it is to slide into negativity and bitchiness when you're in the day to day grind of the Highland operation and the Scottish winter, but you might want to be a bit more careful - there can't be that many "Highland Instructors" in the RHS and the management do read PPRUNE you know. (And they all know exactly who I am, so I've got no axe to grind!)
Back to the question at hand Mr Beech. With the benefit of a couple of years of rose tinted hindsight, I'd recommend Highland as one of the most enjoyable little turboprop operators in the world. As for the money, as INV based J31 captain, maybe expect to take home +/- 100 either side of £2600 per month depending on how the roster and allowances pan out in a given month. No point in describing specifics of rosters these days because they vary so widely according to where you're based (something that was not really apparent in my day) so the life of a Warton or Cardiff based pilot is going to be completely different to that of a INV one. Do you know where they want to base you?
They do roster up to the max legal duty there's no question about that - but show me a company who doesn't, these days.
The southern based pilots tend to have more stable rosters, only work 3 or 4 days a week between monday and friday, they hardly ever work weekends apart from occasionally ferrying a plane up north for maintenance, and they're at home most nights. Obviously that's got a lot of appeal for many people. However, they also have to sit around in crew rooms for countless hours all day, which can be like watching paint dry (especially in the RAF bases), and the flying is all boring IFR airways.
The INV based guys do get a roster based much more around 7-days-a-week operations, and it's true that they're occasionally rostered for a bit of time away from home covering the crews in the other bases and doing the charters. It's also a much more physical job, when you're doing the freight runs, you will be hand loading and unloading one-and-a-half tons of Daily Mirrors a few times a week which can be bloody hard on the lower back. However, the payback is that they earn slightly better money through the allowances, and they get some of the most enjoyable and varied flying to be had on this earth. Poling around the western and northern isles VFR in the turboprop in a fine summer's day is just about as good as life gets in my opinion. INV is just a cracking place to live as well, all the outdoors lifestyle is right there on your doorstep and a lot cheaper living than down south as well. The weather's better than England believe it or not, it's not well known but that few square miles of little microclimate around the Inverness / Nairn / Black Isle area is one of the lowest rainfall areas in Britain. If they could only get some tax free salaries and big long haul jets up there, I'd go back tomorrow
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You used to moan Luke, I don't believe that for a second!!
Luke is pretty spot on in his summary though. Roster is very dependent upon where you are based - the guys down South have a pretty iron clad roster , with long days but not many of them, and they lack a bit in variety. Up in ye frozen north we do all sorts, some great some not so great. And it can vary greatly one week to the next. I have just had a week of blasting round the Islands, home every night with a bag of freshly caught fish from the locals. Next week I spend Monday driving to EDI, have 2 days flying, 1 day standby then drive back on Friday. That will give me my fix of ILS's and all things controlled. Then the week after that I have a few days of flying to Norway.
The beauty of it is, as Luke says, life in the Highlands is awesome. And a cracking day up here means loads of VFR flying over beaches that people from down South wouldn't believe exist in Scotland, or the Northern hemisphere for that matter!!! Yet go South and you also get that exposure to the London TMA other TP companies may not get. Thats not to mention the wide variety of ad hoc stuff, Russia, Paris, Berlin to give you an example, making you IMHO a fairly rounded, well exposed flyer.
HI your post whilst factually correct in some respects is very negative in its tone. I do find it laughable at times how people join a small outfit - and I don't just refer to HWY - and within a small period of time start slagging it off. As Luke says go speak to someone about it. Or leave.
As an aside, you're sounding very nostalgic Luke old boy - is there a wee tear dripping on your keyboard as you remember the good old days?!?! Your impending good news is obviously making you go soft!!!!
Luke is pretty spot on in his summary though. Roster is very dependent upon where you are based - the guys down South have a pretty iron clad roster , with long days but not many of them, and they lack a bit in variety. Up in ye frozen north we do all sorts, some great some not so great. And it can vary greatly one week to the next. I have just had a week of blasting round the Islands, home every night with a bag of freshly caught fish from the locals. Next week I spend Monday driving to EDI, have 2 days flying, 1 day standby then drive back on Friday. That will give me my fix of ILS's and all things controlled. Then the week after that I have a few days of flying to Norway.
The beauty of it is, as Luke says, life in the Highlands is awesome. And a cracking day up here means loads of VFR flying over beaches that people from down South wouldn't believe exist in Scotland, or the Northern hemisphere for that matter!!! Yet go South and you also get that exposure to the London TMA other TP companies may not get. Thats not to mention the wide variety of ad hoc stuff, Russia, Paris, Berlin to give you an example, making you IMHO a fairly rounded, well exposed flyer.
HI your post whilst factually correct in some respects is very negative in its tone. I do find it laughable at times how people join a small outfit - and I don't just refer to HWY - and within a small period of time start slagging it off. As Luke says go speak to someone about it. Or leave.
As an aside, you're sounding very nostalgic Luke old boy - is there a wee tear dripping on your keyboard as you remember the good old days?!?! Your impending good news is obviously making you go soft!!!!
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Just as an alternative, I fly on the Fisheries contract for Highland Airways and life is pretty much as good as it can be! The flying is outstanding and the company has allowed us to organise our own roster (2 months in advance). So despite being away from home our lives are fairly stable. Highland, can like any other company, be a little frantic at times, but there is always an open door to the management who are all approachable and very friendly. So Highlandinstructor, if you don't like it, here is not the place to air it. A better company to start your aviation career you will not find.
Navoff
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Toddler by name and toddler by nature.
How dare you threaten dire consequencies at the bosses hand in your name, you little 
?
For starters there are people reading this who operated into Inverness when you were still at school. l was one.
Get a grip you big girls blouse !
?For starters there are people reading this who operated into Inverness when you were still at school. l was one.
Get a grip you big girls blouse !
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Toddler has woken up. At least his mate told him to check my posts.
Coming to a cinema near you soon.
Highlandinstructor`s post was eminently reasonable. He slagged nobody off. He told it as he saw it ( if we can`t do that what`s left ?) but, there is always one.
This one appears to want his tongue in places decorum dictates it shouldn`t go. One professional pilot belittleing another is, dare l say it ? unprofessional.
Coming to a cinema near you soon.
Highlandinstructor`s post was eminently reasonable. He slagged nobody off. He told it as he saw it ( if we can`t do that what`s left ?) but, there is always one.
This one appears to want his tongue in places decorum dictates it shouldn`t go. One professional pilot belittleing another is, dare l say it ? unprofessional.
Last edited by non iron; 27th Jan 2008 at 13:29. Reason: added a bit more.
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maybe two then.
Gainfully employed flogging `round in a four engine jet, staggering under the weight of the gold braid.
And you Sir ? how is the used car business ?
Now listen please, bullies upset my equilibrium. And to see threats posted in other peoples names for saying what is believed to be the case gives me the. Got it ?
Threats ? if l don`t come across you at interview one of my mates will.
How does that feel ? lt isn`t in me to do that. Can`t you find an old pidgeon to kick you ?
And you Sir ? how is the used car business ?
Now listen please, bullies upset my equilibrium. And to see threats posted in other peoples names for saying what is believed to be the case gives me the
. Got it ?Threats ? if l don`t come across you at interview one of my mates will.
How does that feel ? lt isn`t in me to do that. Can`t you find an old pidgeon to kick you ?
Last edited by non iron; 27th Jan 2008 at 14:19.
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Actually non iron I just parked my A330 in Mumbai for the day, and now I'm checking my messages in the crew hotel.
Beats me who this fool is silverknapper, but I presume it's "Highland Instructor" using his other name. In which case you have my commiserations for having to share a flight deck with him
Now as for you mr non iron I don't know what you mean by "knobs attempting experience", but I felt that the original thread starter might actually have been looking for some input from someone who recently spent several years in a jetstream LHS with Highland. I called it exactly as I experienced it and I don't claim to represent or threaten anyone least of all the company or their management. They've all got their own PPRUNE identities and I'm quite sure they're following this thread, so I guess they are capable of issuing their own threats without help from me.
It seems to me that the score on the thread so far is 3 current or recently-moved-on Highland captains supporting my story, versus, ummm, you? Who has come charging in here like a bull in a china shop and started slinging the abuse because you, err, used to operate into INV 30 years ago? Nice one mate.
It's a shame really that this thread has degenerated so quickly into flame war with idiots but that's the nature of pprune these days. I have no doubt there'll be a few more nasty posts from yourself accusing me of all manner of terrible things but I guess I won't be contributing to this thread again unless there's constructive discussion to be had, so enjoy your little tantrum.
I aren't going to publicize my contact details on this forum but since you clearly know the place so well, feel free to ask anyone in Highland INV ops for my name and phone number, I'm quite happy to discuss any aspect of your alleged Highland Airways experience versus my own, any time you like. In the meantime, why don't you take a few hours to cool down / sober up, forget about whatever I've done to offend you, and then try to write something constructive, maybe offer your own advice to the thread starter rather than have a go at other people?
Beats me who this fool is silverknapper, but I presume it's "Highland Instructor" using his other name. In which case you have my commiserations for having to share a flight deck with him
Now as for you mr non iron I don't know what you mean by "knobs attempting experience", but I felt that the original thread starter might actually have been looking for some input from someone who recently spent several years in a jetstream LHS with Highland. I called it exactly as I experienced it and I don't claim to represent or threaten anyone least of all the company or their management. They've all got their own PPRUNE identities and I'm quite sure they're following this thread, so I guess they are capable of issuing their own threats without help from me.
It seems to me that the score on the thread so far is 3 current or recently-moved-on Highland captains supporting my story, versus, ummm, you? Who has come charging in here like a bull in a china shop and started slinging the abuse because you, err, used to operate into INV 30 years ago? Nice one mate.
It's a shame really that this thread has degenerated so quickly into flame war with idiots but that's the nature of pprune these days. I have no doubt there'll be a few more nasty posts from yourself accusing me of all manner of terrible things but I guess I won't be contributing to this thread again unless there's constructive discussion to be had, so enjoy your little tantrum.
I aren't going to publicize my contact details on this forum but since you clearly know the place so well, feel free to ask anyone in Highland INV ops for my name and phone number, I'm quite happy to discuss any aspect of your alleged Highland Airways experience versus my own, any time you like. In the meantime, why don't you take a few hours to cool down / sober up, forget about whatever I've done to offend you, and then try to write something constructive, maybe offer your own advice to the thread starter rather than have a go at other people?
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Highland - Pros and cons (as I see it)
I've been working for Highland for nearly 8 years and I am still enjoying it.
My mortgage gets paid, I have enough left over to have a life and I live in a beautiful part of the country.
I have seen many come and many go, and some of the guys I line trained are now LHS on much bigger stuff. Have I been left behind, am I the mug for staying put? Maybe, but not in my mind. I drive five minutes to get to work, no traffic problems or long commutes, I get home most nights (not the same for all, granted). I have a small aircraft hangared at the generosity of the company and have some of the most varied hands on flying in the country and beyond.
The flipside is my skills are in a limited regime, I have little glass time, no current heavy (or even medium) time, and ZERO jet time. If Highland went pop tomorrow my quals wouldn't put me ahead for my next job. So perhaps my choice to stay here may be a poor one in the long term. Of course none of us are getting younger. 33 yrs old 7000 hours, will soon be 40 with 9000. No nearer to getting a jet job, in fact if anything I could be penalised for being a limted trick pony. Those that have left and are doing bigger and 'better' things may well be better off in the long term, time will tell.
To sum up it is what it is, and for me it works. Some of facts stated in this thread are true, but times change and the current management certainly have plans for the future that may improve the lot of the line pilot.
I will sit back and watch the thread descend into the usual thread creeping sniping ( I await your latest return of fire Toddler!) but if anyone wants to PM me about the original thread please do so....
Cheers.
CRX
(currently on duty for HWY sat in stormy Sumburgh)
My mortgage gets paid, I have enough left over to have a life and I live in a beautiful part of the country.
I have seen many come and many go, and some of the guys I line trained are now LHS on much bigger stuff. Have I been left behind, am I the mug for staying put? Maybe, but not in my mind. I drive five minutes to get to work, no traffic problems or long commutes, I get home most nights (not the same for all, granted). I have a small aircraft hangared at the generosity of the company and have some of the most varied hands on flying in the country and beyond.
The flipside is my skills are in a limited regime, I have little glass time, no current heavy (or even medium) time, and ZERO jet time. If Highland went pop tomorrow my quals wouldn't put me ahead for my next job. So perhaps my choice to stay here may be a poor one in the long term. Of course none of us are getting younger. 33 yrs old 7000 hours, will soon be 40 with 9000. No nearer to getting a jet job, in fact if anything I could be penalised for being a limted trick pony. Those that have left and are doing bigger and 'better' things may well be better off in the long term, time will tell.
To sum up it is what it is, and for me it works. Some of facts stated in this thread are true, but times change and the current management certainly have plans for the future that may improve the lot of the line pilot.
I will sit back and watch the thread descend into the usual thread creeping sniping ( I await your latest return of fire Toddler!) but if anyone wants to PM me about the original thread please do so....
Cheers.
CRX
(currently on duty for HWY sat in stormy Sumburgh)
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CRX in Sumburgh
First has to be first. You are better there than Tingwall l would suggest. Fish chips and cabbage did it for me. Is Crash still there ? With enormous respect Sir if you don`t know of whom l`m speaking please ask the locals.
l seem to have been put in the position of the little **** l first complained about, despite " his A330 " being parked. F/o`s do tend to get a bit heady don`t they ?
If you really get stuck there pm me and l will help. Look out for the " Shetland Roses " not the boat of WWll fame, unfortunately, but red Mckewans cans in the hedge rows. ( sorry about the spelling )
Good luck.
ps delivered 1500kg of frozen turkeys on Christmas Eve there in 1990 l think ( how they defrosted that lot in time l can`t imagine ) and one of the heli boys wrapped himself up in the cargo net and insisted that he stayed in the aircraft come what may. Abz next.
All things come to he who doesn`t bullsh*t.
l seem to have been put in the position of the little **** l first complained about, despite " his A330 " being parked. F/o`s do tend to get a bit heady don`t they ?
If you really get stuck there pm me and l will help. Look out for the " Shetland Roses " not the boat of WWll fame, unfortunately, but red Mckewans cans in the hedge rows. ( sorry about the spelling )
Good luck.
ps delivered 1500kg of frozen turkeys on Christmas Eve there in 1990 l think ( how they defrosted that lot in time l can`t imagine ) and one of the heli boys wrapped himself up in the cargo net and insisted that he stayed in the aircraft come what may. Abz next.
All things come to he who doesn`t bullsh*t.
Last edited by non iron; 27th Jan 2008 at 15:32. Reason: Forgot the turkey.
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I have stirred up a hornets nest by the look of it - your support is appreciated, but maybe a bit over the top non iron.
Thanks for your words LUKESKYTODDLER. But I have to say that I stand by my post.I think I was fair in what I say - I answered the original posters questions in a frank way. I believe what i quoted teh salary is correct, as is the staff travel. And on the Jetstream fleet the roster is terrible.
SILVERKNAPER - I would be curious to see you post how many nights away from home you spend on a month. What about the last year? how many hire car miles did you drive?How many changes do you get a month? Then tell me our rosters are stable.
And my old posts do not slag off highland LUKE. ook at them again and show me one fact which is not true.
Thanks for your words LUKESKYTODDLER. But I have to say that I stand by my post.I think I was fair in what I say - I answered the original posters questions in a frank way. I believe what i quoted teh salary is correct, as is the staff travel. And on the Jetstream fleet the roster is terrible.
SILVERKNAPER - I would be curious to see you post how many nights away from home you spend on a month. What about the last year? how many hire car miles did you drive?How many changes do you get a month? Then tell me our rosters are stable.
And my old posts do not slag off highland LUKE. ook at them again and show me one fact which is not true.