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-   -   An incredible Maneuver (https://www.pprune.org/tech-log/669005-incredible-maneuver.html)

Centaurus 30th October 2025 06:18

An incredible Maneuver
 
Researching old accident reports for an article on airmanship, I chanced on this Boeing 737-200 accident in India some 25 years ago.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alliance_Air_Flight_7412.

Following an unstable approach to land because the aircraft was too high on short final, the PiC acting as PM in the right seat, orderd the PF in the left seat to make a 360 degree turn to lose height with 40 degrees of flap. With the nose high at 15 degrees body angle during the turn, the 737 stalled and crashed into a built up area with no survivors. The accident report makes startling reading

It is difficult to believe any pilot in his right mind would attempt to carry out such a dangerous manoevre instead of simply going around straight ahead.

Deep Throat 30th October 2025 06:40


It is difficult to believe any pilot in his right mind would attempt to carry out such a dangerous manoeuvre instead of simply going around straight ahead.
By seeing what has failed to work in the past 'we' learn not to do what others have failed to achieve

How many fatal turn backs do we read about and now see on YouTube each year, yet there were posters printed in WW1 "Never Turn Back"

​​​​​​​https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune....ad17530c70.png



RichardJones 22nd November 2025 09:25

What needs to be installed, from very early in a pilot's training is this.
It is the vertical deceleration that kills.
If one, contacts the ground, under control, meaning not stalled one has a great chance of survival.

Deep Throat 22nd November 2025 09:31


Originally Posted by RichardJones (Post 11993882)
What needs to be installed, from very early in a pilot's training is this.
It is the vertical deceleration that kills.
If one, contacts the ground, under control, meaning not stalled one has a great chance of survival.

Installed ..... where? :eek:

since your training is it in stil? :ok:


gradually but firmly
:E​​​​​​​

RichardJones 22nd November 2025 09:42

That info should be installed in one's brain. Only if there is a brain installed.
Please dont try and play word games with me.
Best if you leave this topic to the grownups.

Amadis of Gaul 22nd November 2025 11:50


Originally Posted by RichardJones (Post 11993893)
Please dont try and play word games with me.

Or what? You'll take your ball and leave? Also, it's "don't," not "dont."

Carry on, you grownup you...

Amadis of Gaul 22nd November 2025 11:54


Originally Posted by Centaurus (Post 11979337)
It is difficult to believe any pilot in his right mind would attempt to carry out such a dangerous manoevre instead of simply going around straight ahead.

As someone who's actually been to India, I find this is far from being the most unbelievable thing to have come out of there.

x567 23rd November 2025 17:03

Here is someone doing that type of go-round 'properly'.
As I can't post links its Youtube video code BCWbjsynDZ0 - first result
Of course at Mogadishu you really really do not want to do a standard missed approach lest you get shot at

Musician 23rd November 2025 21:39


Originally Posted by x567 (Post 11994518)
Here is someone doing that type of go-round 'properly'.
As I can't post links its Youtube video code BCWbjsynDZ0 - first result
Of course at Mogadishu you really really do not want to do a standard missed approach lest you get shot at


See also https://www.pprune.org/rumours-news/...-360-100i.html

vilas 25th November 2025 13:07


Originally Posted by Centaurus (Post 11979337)
Researching old accident reports for an article on airmanship, I chanced on this Boeing 737-200 accident in India some 25 years ago.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alliance_Air_Flight_7412.

Following an unstable approach to land because the aircraft was too high on short final, the PiC acting as PM in the right seat, orderd the PF in the left seat to make a 360 degree turn to lose height with 40 degrees of flap. With the nose high at 15 degrees body angle during the turn, the 737 stalled and crashed into a built up area with no survivors. The accident report makes startling reading

It is difficult to believe any pilot in his right mind would attempt to carry out such a dangerous manoevre instead of simply going around straight ahead.

General operating indiscipline is on view. The Captain was not authorised to sit in right seat nor was copilot cleared to fly from left seat. ATC asked them something (DME arc procedure) but without doing that they continued on their track to intercept localizer which brought them very high. The Captain wanted to do 360 copilot wanted to do something else. Obviously nobody was monitoring speed. A disaster was going to happen and it happened. A 360° turn on finals was forbidden after this crash in India. A tragedy so many people lost their lives.

Chronic Snoozer 26th November 2025 00:56

An equally incredible manoeuvre. Gulf Air GF072 in 2000.

https://skybrary.aero/sites/default/...shelf/1020.pdf

split system breaker 26th November 2025 08:55

Regarding the 727 orbit at 100’, I think this has been the subject of a previous discussion; there’s quite o lot of evidence that it was preplanned, not least the fact that it was filmed from three different viewpoints - still quite cool though, if you like that sort of thing.

Musician 27th November 2025 18:07


Originally Posted by split system breaker (Post 11995913)
Regarding the 727 orbit at 100’, I think this has been the subject of a previous discussion; there’s quite o lot of evidence that it was preplanned, not least the fact that it was filmed from three different viewpoints - still quite cool though, if you like that sort of thing.

I'm "only" counting two cameras. I did link to the previous discussion.


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