Using 737 Passenger Aircraft for Cargo.
Thread Starter
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Home
Posts: 63
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Using 737 Passenger Aircraft for Cargo.
These are unprecedented times.
To survive, passenger airlines should utilise their aircraft to carry freight (medical supplies, sanitizer, ventilators, etc). Some are already doing so.
Below are two sample loadsheets. One has 189 passengers (all seats occupied). The other has the equvalent weight of cargo on seats. This just for demonstration purposes. In both cases there is cargo in holds 3 and 4, and the crew and fuel are the same.
For spacing, every other row of seats could be removed. Nets would be used to secure the cargo, and plastic wrap as protection.
To survive, passenger airlines should utilise their aircraft to carry freight (medical supplies, sanitizer, ventilators, etc). Some are already doing so.
Below are two sample loadsheets. One has 189 passengers (all seats occupied). The other has the equvalent weight of cargo on seats. This just for demonstration purposes. In both cases there is cargo in holds 3 and 4, and the crew and fuel are the same.
For spacing, every other row of seats could be removed. Nets would be used to secure the cargo, and plastic wrap as protection.
Last edited by Dadanawa; 29th Mar 2020 at 11:03.
You should not mix passengers and cargo in the same area. Security 101.
Using cargo nets and plastic wrap among passengers is not guaranteed to be safe or secure.
Fire suppression systems for cargo would kill your passengers !
Using cargo nets and plastic wrap among passengers is not guaranteed to be safe or secure.
Fire suppression systems for cargo would kill your passengers !
I don't think he's talking COMBI just pure freight.
Some people are trying to re-invent the wheel. Mail has been carried on pax seats for years. The only consideration of concern is Dangerous Goods, and maybe damage to cabin seats and furnishings.
Some people are trying to re-invent the wheel. Mail has been carried on pax seats for years. The only consideration of concern is Dangerous Goods, and maybe damage to cabin seats and furnishings.
Channex night mail was carried in quick change freighters (bar one that was a pure freighter). Seats were palatised to fit the roller floor, and taken out in the evening and replaced in the morning, the change took 45 minutes ( hence QC or “quick change” freighters). But that stopped a few years ago and the last QC in the fleet was withdrawn from use last week.
None of them had cargo deck fire suppression but they did have cargo deck smoke detection, which is lacking in a pure passenger aircraft, but you could carry a crew member as a fire watch.
Boeing publish a rapid descent profile for freight aircraft in the FCTM, in case of smoke/ fire in the cargo bay.
None of them had cargo deck fire suppression but they did have cargo deck smoke detection, which is lacking in a pure passenger aircraft, but you could carry a crew member as a fire watch.
Boeing publish a rapid descent profile for freight aircraft in the FCTM, in case of smoke/ fire in the cargo bay.
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: ortac
Posts: 113
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The problem with your calculation is that most cargo is bulky especially what you’re taking about, medical supplies, ventilators etc, you won’t get 16 T of cargo carrying it on seats. SAS has a history of carrying I think mail bags in seat pouches I think but that’s about it I believe. Another problem is that you’ve got no main deck loading door for Hi loader so it would take a very long time to on/ off load cargo, and no fire extinguisher system or main deck smoke detection system would be available and how would you restrain the cargo on the seats, that’s why cargo conversions costs millions of pounds.
As an experienced freightdog, a fully kitted out 737 freighter with all the kit inc the above, side cargo door, and strengthened floor, and loading the cargo in main deck containers, you sometimes bulk out at 17-20 tons, carrying 16 T in a pax 737 would definitely not work unless you were carrying lead in the seat pockets. Channex 737s are the QC conversions, so can remove seats and carry cargo and are fitted with the side cargo door and are certified for this use.
As an experienced freightdog, a fully kitted out 737 freighter with all the kit inc the above, side cargo door, and strengthened floor, and loading the cargo in main deck containers, you sometimes bulk out at 17-20 tons, carrying 16 T in a pax 737 would definitely not work unless you were carrying lead in the seat pockets. Channex 737s are the QC conversions, so can remove seats and carry cargo and are fitted with the side cargo door and are certified for this use.
Just carrying cargo instead of pax does not make it a cargo aircraft. There are a lot of airworthiness requirements to carry cargo, it is in the design and structure which is why there are companies who carry out the conversions.
You can not carry cargo in the pax cabin and be either safe or legal.
I understand why people are doing it but if they carry on there could be a serious incident.
You can not carry cargo in the pax cabin and be either safe or legal.
I understand why people are doing it but if they carry on there could be a serious incident.
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Canada
Posts: 102
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I used these at a previous operator.
https://www.seatpack.net/
You don't need a 9g bulkhead or any of the other special cargo aircraft accoutrements. The cargo being carried isn't supposed to really weight more, or use up any more room then the self-loading-freight would.
https://www.seatpack.net/
You don't need a 9g bulkhead or any of the other special cargo aircraft accoutrements. The cargo being carried isn't supposed to really weight more, or use up any more room then the self-loading-freight would.
Join Date: Nov 2015
Location: Paisley, Florida USA
Posts: 289
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I used these at a previous operator.
https://www.seatpack.net/
You don't need a 9g bulkhead or any of the other special cargo aircraft accoutrements. The cargo being carried isn't supposed to really weight more, or use up any more room then the self-loading-freight would.
https://www.seatpack.net/
You don't need a 9g bulkhead or any of the other special cargo aircraft accoutrements. The cargo being carried isn't supposed to really weight more, or use up any more room then the self-loading-freight would.
Cheers,
Grog
Thread Starter
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Home
Posts: 63
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
With a fleet of grounded planes, I would not mind a few delays on loading them if I could keep a few flying and also provide relief to those that are in need.
We are at war.
We are at war.
Apart from being a pretty wide 737 (must be the NMA version ), good job on the strappings, unlike what I saw on the TV this evening with the seats just strewn with unsecured boxes!
As mentioned before, seat pack freight has been carried for decades.
As mentioned before, seat pack freight has been carried for decades.
Join Date: Feb 2020
Location: London
Posts: 0
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
On most pure freighters, main deck fire extinguishing is done by depressurizing the aircraft and maintaining at least 25,000 ft. pressure altitude (flight crew obviously on supplemental O2). This usually requires additional O2 for the crew.
Thread Starter
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Home
Posts: 63
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Air Baltic using passenger aircraft for medical supplies. "Let's Do This."
https://www.aviation24.be/airlines/a...n-airbus-a220/
https://www.aviation24.be/airlines/a...n-airbus-a220/
Originally Posted by Cashash
How do you comply with fire detection and extinguishing requirements in that scenario?. Do you still have cabin crew?
Yes, seat packs I use are limited to 225kg = 3*75kg then plus the 6kg for the bag weight you're at 3*77kg.