A320 volcanic ash simulator
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Asia
Age: 49
Posts: 524
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
A320 volcanic ash simulator
Good morning colleagues,
I'd like to know how would you handle the workflow of a volcanic ash encounter with a certain dual engine flameout immediately after starting the volcanic ash QRH.
Would you go thru the QRH checklist first, or finish the dual engine flameout ECAM.
Thanks a lot
I'd like to know how would you handle the workflow of a volcanic ash encounter with a certain dual engine flameout immediately after starting the volcanic ash QRH.
Would you go thru the QRH checklist first, or finish the dual engine flameout ECAM.
Thanks a lot
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: MEXICO
Age: 64
Posts: 10
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I'm thinking about.....
Good morning colleagues,
I'd like to know how would you handle the workflow of a volcanic ash encounter with a certain dual engine flameout immediately after starting the volcanic ash QRH.
Would you go thru the QRH checklist first, or finish the dual engine flameout ECAM.
Thanks a lot
I'd like to know how would you handle the workflow of a volcanic ash encounter with a certain dual engine flameout immediately after starting the volcanic ash QRH.
Would you go thru the QRH checklist first, or finish the dual engine flameout ECAM.
Thanks a lot
If you does not leave the ash, it is worthless to try to re-start the engines.You have to turn back leaving the ash behind while completing the QRH procedure. As soon as practical, go to the ECAM to cope with the dual engine flameout procedure. Take a look at the MSA and the obstacles and make your decision on the strategy. Maybe the Vulcan it's not a solitary mountain.
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Europe
Posts: 4
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I guess you need to use common sense or good airmenship in this case. Finishing Volcanic Ash doesn't make sense without running engines, beside first part that is essentially turning back 180 and putting masks on - exiting polluted area and protecting yourself to be able to proceed.
...loosing both engines has priority.
Even in such extreme case as dual ENG failure, before ECAM, Golden rules are applicable.
Fly, Navigate Communicate will take you out of Volcanic Ash (at least initiate exiting ash area) and as soon as you do that (also first part of Vulcanic Ash check list) you need to jump on dual engine failure.
Fly, Navigate, Communicate before ECAM or QRH shall also include evaluation of obstacles - which is more important than immediately jump on ECAM.
...loosing both engines has priority.
Even in such extreme case as dual ENG failure, before ECAM, Golden rules are applicable.
Fly, Navigate Communicate will take you out of Volcanic Ash (at least initiate exiting ash area) and as soon as you do that (also first part of Vulcanic Ash check list) you need to jump on dual engine failure.
Fly, Navigate, Communicate before ECAM or QRH shall also include evaluation of obstacles - which is more important than immediately jump on ECAM.
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Uh... Where was I?
Posts: 1,338
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
You do the V Ash QRH, but if both engines flame out (that is what happens in the sim), it will happen in the middle of the QRH checklist.
Upon losing both engines, follow ECAM, set about 1º pitch down as you might experience unreliable speed as well.
The ECAM will direct you to the QRH dual engine failure c/l. Do the QRH checklist because it contains everything you need, including the aviate, navigate, communicate part!
Before focusing on engine relight follow the aviate-navigate-communicate steps of the QRH. IF at high cruising level don't haste: windmilling relight envelope starts at FL 300. there is not much hope or relighting above that. Keep your pitch, refine it with the c/l value according to weight and check if you have an unrealiable airspeed. if it happens, probably all pitot will clog simultaneously and ADRs will not detect anythings abnormal as they all agree. If there is uas, then stick to the pitch.
Once established on a HDG towards an airport within reach, ditching in the sea as close as possible to the coast, or to a suitable forced landing site, and on the pitch or speed for relight you must attempt relights two at a time (there is a trap, here. If you already pushed the WING A/ICE you should put it OFF).
Keep trying to relight engines, and start the APU when below FL 250. If no success, reduce speed to have about green dot by the time you reach FL 200. Then you can try assisted starts with the APU BLEED, one at a time now, good news is you glide some more now.
The instructor has decided before hand at what moment he will allow one engine to relight. Be careful not to mechanically make another start attempt in an engine without first checking if it did lit! Some models help with an AVAIL light, others you need to advance the levers and see.
Once you have one engine back, you can worry about the unreliable speed, but ignore the thrust settings as those are for two engines. The pitch values however should be ok.
Upon losing both engines, follow ECAM, set about 1º pitch down as you might experience unreliable speed as well.
The ECAM will direct you to the QRH dual engine failure c/l. Do the QRH checklist because it contains everything you need, including the aviate, navigate, communicate part!
Before focusing on engine relight follow the aviate-navigate-communicate steps of the QRH. IF at high cruising level don't haste: windmilling relight envelope starts at FL 300. there is not much hope or relighting above that. Keep your pitch, refine it with the c/l value according to weight and check if you have an unrealiable airspeed. if it happens, probably all pitot will clog simultaneously and ADRs will not detect anythings abnormal as they all agree. If there is uas, then stick to the pitch.
Once established on a HDG towards an airport within reach, ditching in the sea as close as possible to the coast, or to a suitable forced landing site, and on the pitch or speed for relight you must attempt relights two at a time (there is a trap, here. If you already pushed the WING A/ICE you should put it OFF).
Keep trying to relight engines, and start the APU when below FL 250. If no success, reduce speed to have about green dot by the time you reach FL 200. Then you can try assisted starts with the APU BLEED, one at a time now, good news is you glide some more now.
The instructor has decided before hand at what moment he will allow one engine to relight. Be careful not to mechanically make another start attempt in an engine without first checking if it did lit! Some models help with an AVAIL light, others you need to advance the levers and see.
Once you have one engine back, you can worry about the unreliable speed, but ignore the thrust settings as those are for two engines. The pitch values however should be ok.
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Greensburg, PA
Age: 52
Posts: 106
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
^^^^ This....just did this in the sim myself. If you play the game correctly the ash shouldn't sneak up on you. Get the volcanic ash QRH out before you lose the engines and review it since you are flying in an area of known volcanic ash activity. When you lose both engines do the ECAM and it will lead you to the Dual Engine Failure - Fuel Remaining QRH. Do that until you get one relit and then continue to attempt the relight on the 2nd engine as you don't know how long the 1st restart will last. The ECAM also comes up with the N1 EPR Mode Fault. They will reset but we skipped them and came back to them after we got the engines running again. Have fun...
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: 'tween posts
Posts: 197
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
here is what our company write up says (same as ICAO )
hope this helps
Oxygen. Use of flight crew oxygen masks may be advisable if the dust and acrid smell is strong.
Reduce thrust. Engine core operating temperatures of jet engines must be reduced below the temperature at which silicate ash particles melt (around 1,100°C)
Reduction of engine thrust to flight idle is the only reliable way of achieving this in the absence of more precise guidance. If this action is not taken at or before the first signs of engine malfunction, then flame out is likely to follow if clear air cannot be regained.
Reverse track and descend. Clear air must be regained as soon as possible. Terrain permitting, a descending 180-degree turn is likely to be the fastest way out of the contaminated air. Under no circumstances should a climb be attempted as an escape option.
Prepare aircraft systems for recovery from potential engine failure. Follow company/manufacturer’s guidance which may include advice on increasing the flow of bleed air to improve engine stall margins, and operationof the Auxiliary Power Unit (APU) within AFM limits to provide a source of bleed air and electrical power in the event of multiple engine failure.
Monitoring. The engines will need careful monitoring,particularly the Engine Exhaust Gas Temperature (EGT) which may climb dangerously if there is significant ash contamination in the engine. Monitor aircraft attitude and airspeed remembering that airspeed indications may become unreliable if blockage of the pitot-static system occurs. Good awareness of theGround Speed and head/tail wind component can be useful to help spot if indicated trends are genuine or not.
hope this helps
Oxygen. Use of flight crew oxygen masks may be advisable if the dust and acrid smell is strong.
Reduce thrust. Engine core operating temperatures of jet engines must be reduced below the temperature at which silicate ash particles melt (around 1,100°C)
Reduction of engine thrust to flight idle is the only reliable way of achieving this in the absence of more precise guidance. If this action is not taken at or before the first signs of engine malfunction, then flame out is likely to follow if clear air cannot be regained.
Reverse track and descend. Clear air must be regained as soon as possible. Terrain permitting, a descending 180-degree turn is likely to be the fastest way out of the contaminated air. Under no circumstances should a climb be attempted as an escape option.
Prepare aircraft systems for recovery from potential engine failure. Follow company/manufacturer’s guidance which may include advice on increasing the flow of bleed air to improve engine stall margins, and operationof the Auxiliary Power Unit (APU) within AFM limits to provide a source of bleed air and electrical power in the event of multiple engine failure.
Monitoring. The engines will need careful monitoring,particularly the Engine Exhaust Gas Temperature (EGT) which may climb dangerously if there is significant ash contamination in the engine. Monitor aircraft attitude and airspeed remembering that airspeed indications may become unreliable if blockage of the pitot-static system occurs. Good awareness of theGround Speed and head/tail wind component can be useful to help spot if indicated trends are genuine or not.
Last edited by gearpins; 20th Mar 2016 at 15:14. Reason: spacing
