Gear Down Landing Rate of Climb
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Gear Down Landing Rate of Climb
Boeing have in their B-777 QRH a Gear Down Rate of Climb Available; it shows the rate of climb with one engine inop, flaps at 30, speed Vref30 +5 Kts at a weight of 225 Tons.
This is the only Airplane that I have come across that have that information in their QRH and according to the information in the QRH explaining the Advisory Information it applies to an engine inoperative Autoland.
It puts a severe limitation on the use of flaps 30 with an engine shut down and I know of at least 2 other operators that do not apply that limitation
This is the only Airplane that I have come across that have that information in their QRH and according to the information in the QRH explaining the Advisory Information it applies to an engine inoperative Autoland.
It puts a severe limitation on the use of flaps 30 with an engine shut down and I know of at least 2 other operators that do not apply that limitation
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It's a very useful table on the triple.
When the runway is limiting and you are contemplating a single engine landing, if you have the performance to fly a go around from a flap 30 approach on one engine it MAY be a better decision than flap 20.
At least with reference to this table you can decide which of the options suits your situation better on the day.
If time is on your side you can never have too much information!
Jazzy
When the runway is limiting and you are contemplating a single engine landing, if you have the performance to fly a go around from a flap 30 approach on one engine it MAY be a better decision than flap 20.
At least with reference to this table you can decide which of the options suits your situation better on the day.
If time is on your side you can never have too much information!
Jazzy
I may be missing the point - are you saying you've only got the Flap 30 data?
As I understand it our manuals are pretty much straight copies of the Boeing version and they certainly have the Engine out data for both for Flap 20 and Flap 30, and as Jazzy has said the F30 data may well be of use if you're dealing with a limiting runway.
As I understand it our manuals are pretty much straight copies of the Boeing version and they certainly have the Engine out data for both for Flap 20 and Flap 30, and as Jazzy has said the F30 data may well be of use if you're dealing with a limiting runway.
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Tasmin,
In the realms of large/ medium twins I've only flown the 75 and 77 but I'm not sure how many are certified for a single engine autoland. I know the 75 wasn't.
The normal procedure, in the event of an engine failure is to perform a single engine, flap 20 autoland if the facilities allow. However with an immediate return (catastrophic engine failure, raging fire etc) it may preclude dumping to a weight that allows flap 20 to be used and maintain landing performance. On these days IF the landing climb limit data for flap 30 allows you then have the choice of a flap 30 autoland.
If the aircraft is not certified to single engine auto land the data may not have been collated as part of the certification process (I'm guessing here), and I can't remember if the 75 QRH had gear down ROC tables. However depending on what landing configs the aircraft is certified for it is nice to know what can and cannot be achieved with manual flight in limiting circumstances too.
In my opinion it allows more options to be considered, should time be on your side. You can always have a look at the table pre-take off on marginal runways, just in case. Being a pessimist I very often do have a look so I have the ballpark figures tucked away in the back of my head before we launch.
Only my opinion but happy to be corrected by a trainer.
Jazzy
In the realms of large/ medium twins I've only flown the 75 and 77 but I'm not sure how many are certified for a single engine autoland. I know the 75 wasn't.
The normal procedure, in the event of an engine failure is to perform a single engine, flap 20 autoland if the facilities allow. However with an immediate return (catastrophic engine failure, raging fire etc) it may preclude dumping to a weight that allows flap 20 to be used and maintain landing performance. On these days IF the landing climb limit data for flap 30 allows you then have the choice of a flap 30 autoland.
If the aircraft is not certified to single engine auto land the data may not have been collated as part of the certification process (I'm guessing here), and I can't remember if the 75 QRH had gear down ROC tables. However depending on what landing configs the aircraft is certified for it is nice to know what can and cannot be achieved with manual flight in limiting circumstances too.
In my opinion it allows more options to be considered, should time be on your side. You can always have a look at the table pre-take off on marginal runways, just in case. Being a pessimist I very often do have a look so I have the ballpark figures tucked away in the back of my head before we launch.
Only my opinion but happy to be corrected by a trainer.
Jazzy
Last edited by JazzyKex; 27th Apr 2012 at 08:10. Reason: To hopefully improve clarity in my rambling!!!
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On fail Operational,Flaps 30 single engine landing is allowed on B737.
Not worth it on DRY runways,unless you really are field limited by a few meters and the GA gradient limit is no issue.(2.5% for Autoland?).
Not worth it on DRY runways,unless you really are field limited by a few meters and the GA gradient limit is no issue.(2.5% for Autoland?).
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We had the same table in our 737 QRH (OEI autoland gear down flaps 30 rate of climb available). For the -800 it was in most cases a negative rate of climb which limited it to only very light weight landings (no problem on the -700 though). It has been since removed and we only have the gear up go-around climb gradient table available which allows OEI flaps 30 auto lands at pretty much every weight.
OEI autoland is mainly an issue during low vis take offs as it does away with the need of a take off alternate.
OEI autoland is mainly an issue during low vis take offs as it does away with the need of a take off alternate.
