Purpose of 727 rudder anti-balance tabs
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Hi Old Fella,
My memory was failing when I posted on 17th. You are correct that the rudder boost was selected on most of the time, but Boeing published VMCA figures for Boost Off (about 60 kts faster). I found a copy here:
http://www.vpiaheritage.com/707limitations.pdf
on page 10.
I seem to remember we would turn the boost off in the cruise to dampen the yaw. Happy days!
My memory was failing when I posted on 17th. You are correct that the rudder boost was selected on most of the time, but Boeing published VMCA figures for Boost Off (about 60 kts faster). I found a copy here:
http://www.vpiaheritage.com/707limitations.pdf
on page 10.
I seem to remember we would turn the boost off in the cruise to dampen the yaw. Happy days!
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Boeing found they weren't going to be able to put enough rudder on the airplane for it to be as controllable as they would like. Instead of redesigning the whole tail and increasing the size of the entire rudder them simply cut it in half (vertically) and added the tabs to increase effectiveness without increasing size.
727 Prototype Airplane Historical Photos and Data
You can scroll the the photos of the prototype here. You'll notice that on the first flight the tail and rudder all match in color, but there are photos interspersed of the aircraft at a later point with an all white rudder, which is the rudder used on the production aircraft.
727 Prototype Airplane Historical Photos and Data
You can scroll the the photos of the prototype here. You'll notice that on the first flight the tail and rudder all match in color, but there are photos interspersed of the aircraft at a later point with an all white rudder, which is the rudder used on the production aircraft.
"The INTRODUCER"
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Like i said, he's got the pictures mixed up, that's a later test flight being labelled as the first, if you look at the rollout stills and the in flight photos from the (verified) first flight (and even video if you wanna look it up) you'll see the original (off-brown) rudder, later flights had the white rudder and modified system in response to the need for more yaw control/rudder authority.
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''Dutch roll'' & B727, B727 ...
Dutch roll is a typical problem with Boeing. 
Instead of rolling right and left and right and left , Airbus is worth : the tail fin gets broken by the typical strength of the roll.
But if the dutch roll begins, it is possible to stop this crazy dynamic, with a little mathematic. I did the demonstration five times in 1992.
At the end the ''dutch roll'' is cause of many incidents and accidents, false qualified.
When will pilots get a real formation to recognize a dutch roll, and come out of it ??
('roulishollandais' is the french expression for 'dutch roll'
)
Instead of rolling right and left and right and left , Airbus is worth : the tail fin gets broken by the typical strength of the roll.
But if the dutch roll begins, it is possible to stop this crazy dynamic, with a little mathematic. I did the demonstration five times in 1992.
At the end the ''dutch roll'' is cause of many incidents and accidents, false qualified.
When will pilots get a real formation to recognize a dutch roll, and come out of it ??
('roulishollandais' is the french expression for 'dutch roll'
)
I am not sure whether the B707 ever did not have hydraulic boost to the rudder system or not.
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Aviator Extraordinaire
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The -100 aircraft we flew for training was "bent" from a prior mid-air
The reason I am asking is that I flew the old 'Hoot' Gibson -100 and it flew just like you related. It always seemed like it wanted to fly sideways and it was impossible to keep in trim.
Fortunately we only leased it for a short period, about a month.
That's a new story about the old "Boeing". EAL had a -100 that flew pretty strangely, as an F/E, I'd watch the pilots putting in trim, then taking it out, then putting some more in. I'd nervously watch fuel balance, assuming I'd screwed it up. It had been in a snow bank at some time inits life and not under control.
GF
GF
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The aircraft I’m referring to is N27, which was in a mid-air SE of Kingfisher and was recovered safely with a complete hydraulic failure (A & B system) and part of the stab missing. (They were IFR assigned in VMC and hit by a VFR GA aircraft.)
N27 was definitely “bent”.
This airplane was transferred to the Marshal’s Service. It was eventually re-designated N530KF in honor of the wife of one of the USMS pilots. She sadly died as a result the Murrah bombing.
I eventually flew this aircraft again when I transferred over to the USMS (Con-Air, Air Slammer) to escape management madness on the west side of the airfield. At this time, USMS operated two 727-100’s & one 727-200 plus two Hawker 800’s.
I believe the projected cost of a number of required AD’s for the old gals resulted in their eventual demise, and eventually 727-200’s were leased from a couple of operators, prior to converting to 737-400’s. Now they operate Mad Dogs.
I eventually ended up back on the west side in R&D and finally retired. I always highly respected the USMS/JPATS pilots as a group
N27 was definitely “bent”.
This airplane was transferred to the Marshal’s Service. It was eventually re-designated N530KF in honor of the wife of one of the USMS pilots. She sadly died as a result the Murrah bombing.
I eventually flew this aircraft again when I transferred over to the USMS (Con-Air, Air Slammer) to escape management madness on the west side of the airfield. At this time, USMS operated two 727-100’s & one 727-200 plus two Hawker 800’s.
I believe the projected cost of a number of required AD’s for the old gals resulted in their eventual demise, and eventually 727-200’s were leased from a couple of operators, prior to converting to 737-400’s. Now they operate Mad Dogs.
I eventually ended up back on the west side in R&D and finally retired. I always highly respected the USMS/JPATS pilots as a group
As for the 'Hoot' Gibson 727, we leased it from some airline, that I cannot remember the name of now, which was based at DFW. Let me tell you, after flying that hunk of junk and then got back into 530KF, you thought you were flying a brand new 727. God that thing flew horribly.
In the ten years I was with the Marshal Service I flew over ten thousand hours, 7,000+ was in the 727s. I got to where I really loved the 727-100, my God, the things you could do with those aircraft. I never really understood just why they replaced the 72s, after all, they were bought and paid for and when I was there, in great shape. So why get rid of bought and paid for aircraft and replace them them with leased aircraft, that could not do the mission profile the 727 was capable of.... Well, it just never made sense to me. Of course I heard rumors, but rumors are rumors and I never assign much credit to them.
Anyway, I'm sure we flew with a lot of the same guys there, overall I enjoyed my years with the Marshal Service, but I never looked back after I left.
Oh, the lady killed in the OKC bombing was one of my best friends and she sang at our wedding when my wife and I were married.
And finally;
The aircraft I’m referring to is N27, which was in a mid-air SE of Kingfisher and was recovered safely with a complete hydraulic failure (A & B system) and part of the stab missing. (They were IFR assigned in VMC and hit by a VFR GA aircraft.)
Aviator Extraordinaire
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One to change the bulb and four to talk about how great the old bulb was.
Did you ever have a chance to fly a -100 with MD-80 type engines?
I did once, and if you closed your eyes at the wrong moment, you'd out climb the wing in a heartbeat.
But progress is progress and life goes on, I miss flying the DC-3 as well.
Okay, not as much.
I remember Catlin Aviation from my check flying days !
The B727 was the First Jet I ever flew. It was a dream come true.
I think it was the best handling narrowbody made.
I was lucky.
The B727 was the First Jet I ever flew. It was a dream come true.
I think it was the best handling narrowbody made.
I was lucky.
