B737 Gear, wheels uncovered when retracted
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From: australia
B737 Gear, wheels uncovered when retracted
I thought it was only the 100, 200 & 300 series that the wheel hub and part of the tyre were not covered. But after looking at the 800 in cruise, the wheels were there.
Does this keep the cost down more than the increased drag reduces economy? And do the exposted wheels get more fatigued from high airspeed and extreme cold? Just seems a little odd to me... Is the gear bay, on say a B777, pressurised?
And what is the smoke that comes from the tyres and why? I was told once but that was when I was young and did not understand things very well...
Thanks for your answers
Does this keep the cost down more than the increased drag reduces economy? And do the exposted wheels get more fatigued from high airspeed and extreme cold? Just seems a little odd to me... Is the gear bay, on say a B777, pressurised?
And what is the smoke that comes from the tyres and why? I was told once but that was when I was young and did not understand things very well...
Thanks for your answers
Last edited by LambOfGod; 25th December 2008 at 23:51.
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From: ***
None of the gearwells are pressurised, on no plane I know of. So the tyres are always subjected to the cold and pressure changes. It is amazing though to see how long the brake temp stays warm, considering how cold it is out there... I have not heard of tyres wearing down faster when not covered and I don't think it makes any difference whatsoever.
But I have no way to prove this to you...
Maybe someone else knows more
Nic
edit:
If you are talking about the smoke upon landing, it is from rubber being burnt when the wheel starts spinning. There is a lot of friction, kind of like a locked brake on a car, just the other way around...
And I have been told by engineers at my flight school, that there were experiments to get a wheel spinup before touchdown to reduce tyrewear, but the speed of the tyre would have to match groundspeed of the aircraft pretty exactly, other wise theere wouldn't be much gain. And as that iis too hard to achive, it seems to be cheaper to just have a little more wear on the tyres instead of flying spinup motors for the wheels around...
Nic
But I have no way to prove this to you...
Maybe someone else knows more
Nic
edit:
If you are talking about the smoke upon landing, it is from rubber being burnt when the wheel starts spinning. There is a lot of friction, kind of like a locked brake on a car, just the other way around...
And I have been told by engineers at my flight school, that there were experiments to get a wheel spinup before touchdown to reduce tyrewear, but the speed of the tyre would have to match groundspeed of the aircraft pretty exactly, other wise theere wouldn't be much gain. And as that iis too hard to achive, it seems to be cheaper to just have a little more wear on the tyres instead of flying spinup motors for the wheels around...
Nic
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From: flyover country USA
Of course the original 737 was built as a short-medium range ship, and I'm sure Boeing thought the wheel doors wouldn't pay off. I doubt anyone would take issue with their KISS approach in 1966.
Today is 42 years later, with the BBJ flying ETOPS several times the original -200 optimum range, & we might argue with Boeing about this. In fact this thread ran rather lengthy in pprune 2-3 years ago. Right now I can't seem to find it.
But commonality is a virtue, too.
Today is 42 years later, with the BBJ flying ETOPS several times the original -200 optimum range, & we might argue with Boeing about this. In fact this thread ran rather lengthy in pprune 2-3 years ago. Right now I can't seem to find it.
But commonality is a virtue, too.
Thread Starter
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From: australia
Yeah, I knew that some of the smoke is burning rubber. Thats why there are black marks on the runway
But, when I went to an aviation museum there was a nose gear from some sort of airliner... The guide explained that it was not completely burning rubber but gas and that the tyres need to be re-inflated before TO. Just cant remember what the gas was. I'm guessing a hard landing would increase the pressure it the tyres a fair bit so possibly there is some release valve?
And why havn't Boeing put gear doors on the 737NG?, or is there... Even an optional extra
But, when I went to an aviation museum there was a nose gear from some sort of airliner... The guide explained that it was not completely burning rubber but gas and that the tyres need to be re-inflated before TO. Just cant remember what the gas was. I'm guessing a hard landing would increase the pressure it the tyres a fair bit so possibly there is some release valve?
And why havn't Boeing put gear doors on the 737NG?, or is there... Even an optional extra
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From: Manchester
But, when I went to an aviation museum there was a nose gear from some sort of airliner... The guide explained that it was not completely burning rubber but gas and that the tyres need to be re-inflated before TO. Just cant remember what the gas was. I'm guessing a hard landing would increase the pressure it the tyres a fair bit so possibly there is some release valve?
If I could make that bloody thing react I'd be a millionaire !!!
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From: us
the tires are filled with nitrogen and i don't think you would see it when it came out if it ever did wich it does not unless the tire blows. they are not refilled after every landing only when need be.
the outside of the main gear tires have a cover on them that helps protect them from the wind and weather when flying although the tires fit snuggly int he wheel well and do not produce much drag. the reason there is no gear doors is that is more weight and something to fail. they try to make the plane as reliable as they can. plus it just dosen't need them.
the wheel wells are not presurized becuase everytime you lowered the gear there would be a massive loss of pressure that the outflow valves would not be able to overcome. like opening a big door inflight. sometimes the gear is lowered above 10k feet to get the plane to slow down if needed.
the outside of the main gear tires have a cover on them that helps protect them from the wind and weather when flying although the tires fit snuggly int he wheel well and do not produce much drag. the reason there is no gear doors is that is more weight and something to fail. they try to make the plane as reliable as they can. plus it just dosen't need them.
the wheel wells are not presurized becuase everytime you lowered the gear there would be a massive loss of pressure that the outflow valves would not be able to overcome. like opening a big door inflight. sometimes the gear is lowered above 10k feet to get the plane to slow down if needed.
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From: In a far better place
No main gear doors mean fewer sequencing valves and system processes to raise and lower the gear… thus lower maintenance. Easier for manual gear extension versus older Boeings such as the 707 and 727 where one had to crank the gear doors open first before lowering the landing gear.
Per Ardua ad Astraeus
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From: UK
Perhaps it is worthwhile also to correct the misleading thread title? The wheels on the 737 do not 'stick out' when retracted. They are flush with the skin, but uncovered. I suspect the drag caused at this point on the airframe where I would suspect any 'laminar' flow has long since given up the ghost is not great? Therefore no 'biggie'. Also one less mechanical bit to go wrong.
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From: Belgium
And on the pressurizing of the wheel well, the differential pressure between the cabin (or possible pressurized wheel well) and the outside is about 8psi max, while the wheel is inflated to 160psi. So the pressurization would only reduce the differential by 5% (168psi in cruise vs. 160 at landing and T/O), for a whole lot of weight. Plus the cold at altitude helps too.
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From: La Belle Province
Perhaps it is worthwhile also to correct the misleading thread title? The wheels on the 737 do not 'stick out' when retracted. They are flush with the skin, but uncovered. I suspect the drag caused at this point on the airframe where I would suspect any 'laminar' flow has long since given up the ghost is not great? Therefore no 'biggie'. Also one less mechanical bit to go wrong.
That's why even with exposed wheels you'll still see an attempt to seal the tyres against the edges of the wheel well, with brush seals or similar; the extra mass of the seals is small, and the benefit woirthwhile.
Joined: Dec 2004
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From: Brisbane
Does the low temperature of the tyre have any significant influence on its pressure at touch down? Assuming the wheel is well & truly chilled in the cruise, I assume it could still be very cold at touch down, even if dangled for a few minutes on approach? But I guess there have been many landings on chilled tyres so this is not really an issue?
Thread Starter
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From: australia
correct the misleading thread title
Yeah, I changed it to "B737 Gear, Wheels uncovered during cruise" but nothing happened.
If you look under the original post you will see the Last edited part.
Yeah, I changed it to "B737 Gear, Wheels uncovered during cruise" but nothing happened.
If you look under the original post you will see the Last edited part.
Joined: Sep 2002
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From: La Belle Province
It changed the title for your post, but after a few minutes (2?5?) only a site admin or mod can change a thread title on a vBulletin forum. Nothing you can do about it now.
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From: Cheshire
Classic 737's used to have inflatable seals around the MLG doors. It didn't take long for these to be considered too unreliable/expesnsive (bleed air reqs) for them to be dropped in favour of the current rubber seals.
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From: Somewhere
The Cessna 210 used to have main gear doors, but they were done away with on later models.
No real need for them because apparently, like BOAC suggested, the airflow is not as 'critical' back there, and as such there was no real benefit of having a smooth surface for the air to flow over.
Also saved a few kilos, less to go wrong.
No real need for them because apparently, like BOAC suggested, the airflow is not as 'critical' back there, and as such there was no real benefit of having a smooth surface for the air to flow over.
Also saved a few kilos, less to go wrong.
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Cessna 210 used to have main gear doors
