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Old 15th Oct 2008, 13:15   #1 (permalink)
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Join Date: May 2006
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high level bird strike

clobbered a creature at FL80 near munich in the dark and imc the other night. Splat under neath the radome. Silly question but humour me, what would be flying around in the dark, in clouds at night at 8000ft? Was the bird lost or do birds fly around at these levels in the dark.All we know its feathers were black....authorities took a blood swap to see if it could deduce what type of bird it was.....

I heard a 74 was clobbered by migrating geese in the mid 20s.......

No damage was done but the thud certainly concentrated the minds....look fwd to replys. Thx
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Old 15th Oct 2008, 13:30   #2 (permalink)
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In the US the FAA or NOAA have a program where they have a guy in a special single otter turbo prop float plane follow some migrating cranes...

I have met this guy, while he was working , down in the desert in south California. He told me that he has seen these birds over fl 200 more than a fair few times… and those are BIG birds...
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Old 15th Oct 2008, 13:37   #3 (permalink)

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I've had damage from birds twice at night, each time at about 10,000'. Both were about 1:00 in the morning. One strike occured in a Cessna 182, and it hit square in the windscreen and did damage. The other was in a Learjet aproaching Las Vegas. I was at 250 knots. It crushed the radome and damaged the windscreen.

I don't know what type either bird was, but they were big enough to cause damage.
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Old 15th Oct 2008, 13:40   #4 (permalink)
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Turbocharged birds

In the 1970s... a USAF T-37 got severe damage with a birdstrike.
Was an altitude record... 27,000 feet.

Happy contrails
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Old 15th Oct 2008, 13:50   #5 (permalink)
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FL 140... birds broke down slats and airframe entring into the cockpit


On 2 April 2001, an American Airlines B767-300 was on a scheduled flight from Paris, France (CDG) to Miami when the aircraft experienced a multiple birdstrike during climb out at flight level 140. The crew returned to CDG. Most impacts were on the nose and wings. An impact between the radome and captain's windshield, next to the TAT probe, punctured the airframe and allowed bird debris to enter the cockpit.
Cabin depressurization was reported. The first officer was the pilot flying at the time of strike and the captain took over after putting on his oxygen mask. The engines operated normally throughout the event with the crew reporting no changes in engine parameters. After landing, inspections did not reveal any engine damage or evidence of bird ingestion. A bird stain was observed on position 1 inlet outer barrel on the left-hand side.

The French BEA conducted an investigation. It is likely that no record of this event was found in the publicly accessible online databases of the FAA or NTSB because the event occurred outside the U.S. However, shortly after the event I was sent details of the event, along with a number of photos, from someone close to the investigation. If you want to see just what you are missing from the NASA, FAA, and NTSB database, then take a look at the online gallery of photos. One of the picutures is included below.
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Old 15th Oct 2008, 13:59   #6 (permalink)
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Some Vultures can reach FL250, around Iran and sometimes in the Middle East, and Northern India, Pakistan too. They are so big if you could get a small and slow aircraft up there, maybe a glider? I am sure you could dog fight them.
I know some birds are now migrating from Europe to Northern Africa, not sure what type?
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Old 15th Oct 2008, 14:20   #7 (permalink)
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Hawks, storks and eagles. They'll be back in spring.
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Old 15th Oct 2008, 16:38   #8 (permalink)
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suasdaguna....... sounds like you are a cold hearted murderer.
Not once did you mention the poor orphaned chicks left all alone in the nest to fend for themselves with winter and christmas around the corner.
Hopefully the poor bird just picked up a flesh wound when it hit, thankfully it didnt fly into the engine (curtains I guess).
I never knew birds flew in IMC, amazing animals really!
Hey was the blood warm? Could have been a bat! Havent they got radar? That could explain the night IMC flying.
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Old 15th Oct 2008, 16:54   #9 (permalink)
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Lots of bird strikes occur at night and in what appears to be IFR weather. the birds are actually flying between layers. Many migratory birds take advantage of favourable winds by migrating at night.

Data analysis reveals that the strike rate (strikes/movements) is higher during night hours than during the day.

The highest recorded bird strike is 39,000 feet.
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Old 15th Oct 2008, 17:07   #10 (permalink)
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What Kind Of Birds Was It?.............did You Actually Type F390
As In 39000 Ft?
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Old 15th Oct 2008, 17:40   #11 (permalink)
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The strike information is direct from the FAA database and was the subject of my reseacrh for the Transport Canada book Sharing the Skies. The strike occurred on October 23, 1991, the aircraft was a DC-8-62. The species was not identied, most probably from insufficient remaining material. At that time DNA analysis was not possible. In the last few years there have been other recorded strikes above 30,000 feet.
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Old 15th Oct 2008, 18:27   #12 (permalink)
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This is the fall in this hemisphere and in the colder climates you will see lots of bird activity around airports, ponds and fields as the birds take their last repast before heading out at night to fly south. Most of the geese and duck strikes occur in October.
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Old 15th Oct 2008, 18:45   #13 (permalink)
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High level bird strike

About 5 years ago I was P1 of an a330 Calgary to London. In the cruise at about FL330 (we were kept down due to other traffic ahead we would normally be much higher) when we heard a loud bang from the front left side of the nose It was in the middle of the night but good vmc. It was also the core height of an eastbound jetstream. No obvious sign of damage etc and on landing at LGW the only sign was blood streaks on the side of the fuselage below cockpit P1 opening window. A very few traces of feathers in the blood. A guy in the CAA at the time thought the only bird that flew that high was a Canada goose. Fortunately it was a glancing blow, otherwise the outcome could have been very different. And no, it didn't have any lights, and it wasn't squawking! Sure woke us up though!
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Old 15th Oct 2008, 20:41   #14 (permalink)
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Actually, a significant portion of the Canada Goose population is becoming "resident", i.e. they do not migrate north/south. Some numbers being quoted are as high as 60% of the population. Due to lots of available safe habitat and food these birds are remaining in the vicinity of urban centers and creating big wildlife management challenges for airports. Additionally, due to the fact there is lots of food, few predators and they are not migrating, the populations are increasing and the average weight of the birds is increasing. The net result is that we are seeing more migratory bird strikes even in the winter months and they are causing more damage.
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Old 16th Oct 2008, 12:40   #15 (permalink)
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One autumn a few years ago I was climbing out of Thessaloniki (LGTS) at night when we hit a very large bird at 8000ft. It made a hell of a noise and initially gave us quite a shock! The windscreen appeared badly damaged although investigation showed that only the outer layer was cracked. Lots of grey feathers were attached to the wipers etc.
Later, I did some research and found that further north was an area of wetlands popular with a type of grey stork which migrates south to the Nile valley in winter; it was possibly one of these that we struck.
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Old 16th Oct 2008, 13:28   #16 (permalink)
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LowNSlow (http://www.pprune.org/private-flying...ml#post3231146 post #16) reckons 27,000ft is rubbish, although I question the '54,000ft' - don't they have ANY SOPs?

While 'smith' (http://www.pprune.org/jet-blast/1972...ml#post2192998 post #29) says
The highest bird strike reported to date occurred on November 29, 1973, at 37 000 feet. It involved the collision of a commercial jet airliner and a Ruppeli's Griffon Vulture which was flying over Abijan, Ivory Coast. Another reported bird strike occurred at 33 000 feet involving a goose and a Pan Am Boeing 747.
- to back up Canuck.
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Old 16th Oct 2008, 20:50   #17 (permalink)
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Birds fly and migrate far higher and on a more regular basis than most people realise.

Certain birds, such as geese, have evolved to fly at high levels for just the same reasons as we do - efficiency.

I remember thermally in a glider years ago at 4,500 ft accompanied by swifts. Insects were obviously drawn by the thermal and the birds followed them. It seemed amazing at the time that such relatively small birds should be soaring and feeding at that altitude.

No surprises then for these bird strikes.

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Old 17th Oct 2008, 07:42   #18 (permalink)
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If you didn't find any feathers/guts it was probably a Cessna!
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Old 17th Oct 2008, 21:13   #19 (permalink)
Sir George Cayley
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Species identification from feathers, remains or blood is quite possible these days. Feathers have unique species patterns akin to fingerprints, and blood can be DNA sampled.

Hope you get to here what is was and post an update.

Sir George Cayley
Old 18th Oct 2008, 10:09   #20 (permalink)
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Perhaps it was a Norwegian Blue.

Remarkable bird, the Norwegian Blue, idn'it, ay? Beautiful plumage!

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