Max speed for Concorde!
Thread Starter
Join Date: Dec 1999
Location: Over the horizon
Posts: 230
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Max speed for Concorde!
I think normal cruise was 2.02 there abouts, but was wondering what the max speed attained was, during testing or preproduction!
Thanks
Thanks
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Canberra Australia
Posts: 1,300
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Max IMN, CAS and TAS achievied in a Concord.
Interesting question.
Peter Baker if you see this you should know.
And what were its g limits and could you monitor for max skin tempertures during cruise.
Interesting question.
Peter Baker if you see this you should know.
And what were its g limits and could you monitor for max skin tempertures during cruise.
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Australandnewzealandland
Posts: 213
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I read a book about this and it went something along the lines of...
The Max Speed was limited by the Max skin temperature of the tip of the nose protrusion. 126 degrees C.
The Max Speed was limited by the Max skin temperature of the tip of the nose protrusion. 126 degrees C.
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Australia
Posts: 1,843
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
IF dudduddud is correct in quoting 126°C as imposing the upper speed limit (I have no way of knowing otherwise), AND there were no other CAS / Mach No. limits, -
At and above the Tropopause (11000 M / 36089.2 Ft) and at ISA Temperature (-56.5°C), a TAT of 126°C translates to M 2.0522 and a TAS of 1177.3 Kt. The associated CAS will depend on the particular Flight Level, and as a sample -
F/L 450 = CAS 716.3 / EAS 518.0
F/L 500 = CAS 650.7 / EAS 459.4
F/L 550 = CAS 589.1 / EAS 407.3
Temperature deviation from ISA will, of course, change these values.
At and above the Tropopause (11000 M / 36089.2 Ft) and at ISA Temperature (-56.5°C), a TAT of 126°C translates to M 2.0522 and a TAS of 1177.3 Kt. The associated CAS will depend on the particular Flight Level, and as a sample -
F/L 450 = CAS 716.3 / EAS 518.0
F/L 500 = CAS 650.7 / EAS 459.4
F/L 550 = CAS 589.1 / EAS 407.3
Temperature deviation from ISA will, of course, change these values.
Do a Hover - it avoids G
Join Date: Oct 1999
Location: Chichester West Sussex UK
Age: 91
Posts: 2,206
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I think this has cropped up before and a search might help.
I have no personal knowledge of the details but would make two comments
Certification normally needs to see speeds 10% above those cleared for service, plus the temp limit would only apply once the thing had hot soaked up.
If you hung around slow at height to cold soak it down before a dash you would be more likely to reach some other chosen limit before the skin temp got in the way
I have no personal knowledge of the details but would make two comments
Certification normally needs to see speeds 10% above those cleared for service, plus the temp limit would only apply once the thing had hot soaked up.
If you hung around slow at height to cold soak it down before a dash you would be more likely to reach some other chosen limit before the skin temp got in the way
Mach 3
Join Date: Aug 1998
Location: Stratosphere
Posts: 622
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Old Smokey,
T_0/T=1+(\gamma-1)/2*M^2.
I concur.
I've always wondered what the max Mach of the SR-71 was. The limitation was a CIT (Compressor Inlet Temperature) of 427C. I calculate that with ISA-50C, using the same equations Mach 4 was possible.
The flight manual (http://www.sr-71.org/blackbird/manual/5/5-8.htm) lists Mach 3.2 as the design flight Mach number but in the book "The Untouchables", flight crew record seeing in excess of 3.5 on an operational sortie in exactly the circumstances I describe.
Richard Graham describes the problem with the SR-71 (on Pg 167 of "The SR-71 Revealed - The Inside Story) with different ISA devs.
I've seen ISA+21C and <ISA-20C so maybe one day, somewhere, it saw M~=4.
T_0/T=1+(\gamma-1)/2*M^2.
I concur.
I've always wondered what the max Mach of the SR-71 was. The limitation was a CIT (Compressor Inlet Temperature) of 427C. I calculate that with ISA-50C, using the same equations Mach 4 was possible.
The flight manual (http://www.sr-71.org/blackbird/manual/5/5-8.htm) lists Mach 3.2 as the design flight Mach number but in the book "The Untouchables", flight crew record seeing in excess of 3.5 on an operational sortie in exactly the circumstances I describe.
Richard Graham describes the problem with the SR-71 (on Pg 167 of "The SR-71 Revealed - The Inside Story) with different ISA devs.
I've seen ISA+21C and <ISA-20C so maybe one day, somewhere, it saw M~=4.
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Southern UK
Posts: 92
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The limits at the top end were 530 knots CAS, M2.05 or T1=400 deg K (=127 deg C) At least, that was what they were when I worked on it in the late 60's. I seem to remember that the T1 limit stopped you getting M2.0 if the temperature was warmer than about ISA + 5 deg C, but you can work it out from the 1+0.2M^2 formula. From memory I think they had one of the prototypes up to M2.075, possibly faster.
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Perth
Posts: 75
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
SR71, I read of a study to see what the ultimate limit was, and it was M3.5 +- a bit. This was where the temp on the centre of the windscreen was so high that there was reduction of strength on the seal/mounting.
Don't think I want it getting that friendly Sorry I can't remember where I saw that. Mary may know.
Don't think I want it getting that friendly Sorry I can't remember where I saw that. Mary may know.