Big Black Fence At MAN AVP
 

Does anyone know whats with this fence at MAN AVP?

Was there today and by time this is finished, no-one will be able to sit down any more and watch aircraft, never mind take any pictures.

I asked in the Burger Hut and they guy said it was due to some new rules.

What rules have come into force that are going to destroy the AVP?

Fence At MAN AVP | Flickr - Photo Sharing!

Does whoever thought this up have any idea of how this will affect the number of people going there?

Whats the point if you cant see anything?:ugh::ugh::ugh::=:=


It used to be a beautiful place to plane spot, now it looks like Colditz going up.

All they need now is a few watchtowers to go up and guards with machine guns and it will be perfect - NOT!

@ donnlass i think the veiwing mounds are to be raised to compensate for the new fence.:ok:

Aye but that would look daft and what about when there are loads of people say at an event, like the first time the A380 arrived.

Not everyone can fit on those mounds, how can they fit thousands of people at once?

People want to sit on the flat areas at the tables and watch, my partner had perfected taking photos through the fence of planes and we are both disabled now to an extent and cant really stand for that long.

And for people sitting in the restaurant and watching? It wont be possible.

Ok bring chairs I know but that isnt always convenient.

I can still see numbers plummeting of visitors once this is finished.:(:ouch:

The DFT have regulated that fences need to be able to survive a 45 ton truck being rammed into them.

Its not something that only MAN have dreamt up to annoy the people using the viewing area.

It is all about Customer Care and Passenger Safety! :=

Oh I know its not MAN but some Civil Service pencil pusher with nothing else better to do.


Honestly!!!!


As long we're safe, but we cant see.





Thanks for that everyone.:ok::ok:

Appreciate your replies:O:O


Mmmm many trucks tend to go ramming at MAN?


I had a look at a 45 ton truck on google and they look just a bit bigger than the push back trucks.

Might someone go amok in one of those?

Maybe.

I suspect it's not the weight of the truck per say but what it may be carrying that worries them.

Ginsters pies for instance, I see plenty of trucks hauling them, i mean are they VATable or not , hot, cold, cooling, warming at home aaargrgrgrgrgghhgghg. Safer to just ban the lot of them and build a bloody big fence.

You might have expected someone somewhere would find a different solution to stopping a 45 ton truck that didn't obscure the view. It is a while since I visited the MAN AVP but I would have thought that a concrete crash barrier could easily perform the same function without blocking peoples view. Is it too much to ask for someone think outside the box in a way that keeps all parties happy?

I don't think any fence would stop a 45 tonne truck and why bother when you could crash through a Crash Gate.. designed for Fire Vehicles to crash through!

Some of the larger pushback trucks can weigh 70 tonnes! :D

I was going to suggest a victorian HA-HA

funny you should say that srobarts, i was up there the other week and they were putting in a concrete crash barrier between the carpark and the grass area.:confused:

- love the idea - one problem is to find one jobsworth who a) knew what it was and b) could see how effective it would be!

- so did someone have a vision and a jobsworth also do what he was told?

And all that razor wire over the top.

Whats all that about?

Is the big bad 45 tonner going to climb over it?

Without getting into it the fence has to have a certain standard.

Its fine mesh is so that it takes longer to cut through ie more strands need to be clipped.

The razor wire is obviously there to stop folk just climbing over the top.

I have seen "them" go through a fence like that, to be honest they are pissing in the wind if they think its going to stop anyone with a bit of training who really wants to get in.

It will though however stop anyone that wants to make say a demonstration or is having mental health problems.

I would have guessed the 45 ton truck was set because of an intelligence operation that the ramming a 45 ton lorry through was the method of entry. Similar to the fluids thing for carry on bags. They found out someone was planning to use liquid explosives so had to do something about it.

MAN have always seemed to promote the viewing areas and seem to include them in there plans.

I for one hope this continues, we have usually completed the taxi checks by the firestation and always wave back to the kids if they wave as we taxi past.

If it's so vital to stop 45 tonne trucks crashing through UK airport fences, why is it not necessary for the same defences to be in place in airports across many European countries?

The UK mantra of "security is paramount" comes to mind.

Witness the restriction on drop offs in front of airport terminals, which simply aren't required at other major airports across Europe.

Every time the UK takes knee jerk reactions, the terrorists win.

ATNotts.......................

Couldn't agree more but the politicians and those at the top: feel they have done something, think they look better and consider they have protected us. In the meantime freedoms of the individual have been eroded. Does that bother them? Not in the least.

Planemike

Funy thing, I saw a fence replaced recently at XYZ which was taller but without the horrible mesh. Won't say where but it's next to a road at a busier airport than MAN......

Super Fence
 

Oh so that's what the APD increase is for!!

Digging a trench would have been cheaper, I'd have thought.

Prob scared someone would fall down it.

Hopefully the prat who thought all this up in the fiirst place:ugh::=

wonder if they'l drop the parking fees a bit, considering you cant see so much, as has been said before, not going to see much, unless your on the mounds, and not everybody will fit on them:ugh: dont visit as much as i used to now, so will see if its a bad as it sounds, otherwise will be visiting even less.

I was as the AVP yesterday and whilst I thought the lower Heras style fence was a bit unnecessary and useless, the main fence was acceptable and I was standing on the grass with my little dog.

And then I was asked to leave as dogs are not allowed. If the fence is meant to stop terrorists, surely it can stop a dog?

It does clearly state no dogs are allowed as you enter the park AFAIK.

I think the no dogs thing is more to stop them sh!tting all over which is fair enough considering the amount of children etc, imo.

The dog ban is nothing to do with children etc etc, the security people deemed that dogs working in a group would be able to dig a hole under the fence big enough to fit through a 45 tonne truck.

Makes sense to me.

My springer spaniel is gutted, he just loves jet noise. His favourite viewing place is Lakenheath. On his last visit he got the full effect of a pair of F-15s taking off on full reheat.

Bizarrely (Whilst I was more than compliant once I was advised of the ban by a lady was very polite about it) I did not see any of the signs despite the fact they were in front of my face. Sometimes one concentrates so much on; in this case; getting the ticket that you don't see the important thing three inches below.

She mentioned the dog that ran on the runway issue from a few months ago as the reason, although the fences are pretty secure. It was a pity as the other children at the AVP were enjoying playing with the dog more than watching the planes.

Loose lips sink ships. Reading this, the bad guys will know to get a 46t truck now.

I'll get my coat...

Give me a break, the mods or others would have pulled the thread if there was any validity to your claim.

Besides think about it, the bad guys want something spectacular something the world would take notice of, what is a 46t truck going to do ?

A 200t airplane impacting elsewhere would be something else.

he was taking the wee with the 46t truck.

Any one with even a hint of engineering savy would be able to put a huge hole in the theory that this fence would stop anything apart from an accidental ramming.

Shy's ditch with a row of tank traps before or after it sculpted into seating would be more use.

But you can't tell these types, if you start pointing out the flaws in there thinking it doesn't help matters.

What they need to get is a QSMI from the Royal Engineers to advise them on what works and then build something and then get 5-10 sappers to try and get through it, which they will.

Dogs have been on airfields since Pontius was a Pilate.... for example
Once [as a Runway Controller] I was told to fire my bird scaring Very pistol at a dog on the airfield. I aimed wide, but the dog tried [fortunately unsuccessfully] to pick up the live cartridge. Again, from the Tower, we watched the Plod drop a PC off at the old link Bravo to catch a stray doggie :p {JA1} down the now Twy J. B. then catching the dog....which promptly escaped, running down Twy C towards the old Fairies Apron [Western Maintainance] where it swanned off home. This took 15 or so enjoyable minutes.
In the word of Dave Cl*se "Don't bother about dogs on the Runway, they are frangible"

And then there was a dog from a biz jet which got off and wandered into the middle of the taxiway and then squeezed out what looked like half its body weight.

The twr controller got quite upset about that. Cheered our day up though.

Maybe he was taking the urine.

But come on don't you think the gate people at AVP know what to look for when it comes to looking at bad people ?

I'm on the other side of the fence I sure would hope so !!

err nope. They are just one visable line of security which filters out a few types of risk. The mentally ill and attention seeking type of incident.

The really bad guys which would actually do you harm hopefully are nipped in the bud before they get to do anything by the other layers of security.

While our enjoyment of the Viewing Park is further ruined having been first turned from a plane spotter's paradise to a "Visitor Attraction" sorry place for parents to bring their kids when a park isnt available and now totally trashed by not being able to see anything from the flatter areas when they have spent so much money on them.

You couldnt make it up.

how very grown up of you to post an anti-spotting post on a plane spotting thread.:D :ugh:

"While our enjoyment of the Viewing Park is further ruined having been first turned from a plane spotter's paradise to a "Visitor Attraction" sorry place for parents to bring their kids when a park isnt available and now totally trashed by not being able to see anything from the flatter areas when they have spent so much money on them.

You couldnt make it up. "

And of course they have done this just out of spite not because they have been required to do it! Consider maybe they would have preferred not to!

Don't know what the fuss is all about, the new fence can still be seen through, the mounds have been raised (at great expense) and a compromise was made by placing the concrete blocks around the car park instead of at the fence base, which would have made it higher still.

Um....is this sort of thing happening anywhere else? I rather love the ability to shoot through the fence a good part of the way round LHR, GLA, EDI, PIK, ABZ, STN etc etc.

Um....is this sort of thing happening anywhere else? I rather love the ability to shoot through the fence a good part of the way round LHR, GLA, EDI, PIK, ABZ, STN etc etc.


Hope not, my partner had perfected that at MAN as well.

Oh well, the smaller higher mounds near the testing bay are a good spot as well:ooh: