Well, I didn't see the aircraft land but I did see it's skid marks. The mains touched down approximately 100 feet before the threshold...

Too make this a little more interesting, the PAPI's were malfunctioning that day and giving erronious readings!!!!

There are no shortage of photos on the net from different positions showing this very landing. The aircraft is clearly lower over the fence than normal landings would normally be over the piano keys.
I'm no expert at all, but I though PAPIs were purely optical. How can they give erroneous readings (if they hadn't been misaligned)?

yes, somehow they became misaligned...and for a day or two the Tower left them on even though pilots (including myself) were telling them that they were wrong.

PAPI's can easily become mis-aligned by jet wake.

pass the threshold at 50ft?
 

what is going on here? Pass the threshold at 50 ft .. hmmm.. is that 50ft from the flightdeck or the gear or the middle of the aircraft...
anyway this is way too early landing in my opinion

http://p.airliners.net/photos/middle/4/7/7/1078774.jpg

http://www.airliners.net/open.file/1078774/L/

Ahhhhhhh!!

Another classic St Maarten shot :E

VEEPS

St Maarten :ok:

Theres a couple of different photos of this landing. On this one you see theres actually a beach just there, haha.

It is obviously 'silly season' again and you have all forgotten how to use 'Search'.:ugh:

I have combined a few Spectators' threads here.

There are several other threads on St Maarten spread around in other forums.

This can't be safe?
 

Spectacular? yes.
Safe? surely not?
hhttp://images1.jetphotos.net/images/....jpg.29076.jpg

I would not care if it is safe or not I would love to stand there when a 747 comes in, is it st martin.

Nick.

agreed, but its a bit nuts when its so close you can almost touch it! scary, but a hell of a rush I'd expect! :}

KLM landing at St Maarten
 

Tea and buiscuits with the chief pilot, surely!?

http://www.airliners.net/open.file/1078027/M/
http://www.airliners.net/open.file/1078774/M/

They don't seem all too short in the second pic, though I bet those fence huggers thought differently. :}

Hope he was on TA rather than RA when the photo ship went into formation! But there again it might be a photo montage!

Considering the touchdown zone will well past the piano keys I reckon they look b****y short in the second picture, must have been pretty close to taking out that fence with the wheels.

They certainly did NOT cross the fence at 50 feet, now did they


GF

or it might just be taken from an angle that would make the 747 appear very low? There's thousands of piccies from St. Marteen like that, btw. Neat-ish :D

what a ripping short-fielder! congrats fellas, thats impressive (and only slightly illegal).

One of our pilots landed a tad short of the threshold of our most critical runways and ended up back at the training center. Wonder if they did.

What I would like to know is, from what were these photos taken from ???

Tall building , helicopter.......I know a zoom lens was probably used but so close to the approach and above.....Is there high ground overlooking the app?

Cheers !:O

:hmm:

Sandblasting the Sunbathers?

What on earth is wrong with this well executed little biddy short field landing and wherein lies the illegality?
I have no doubt that, due to high speed inbound traffic behind him, The Flying Dutchman was trying to make the high speed exit and an expeditious turn off!:cool:

The view from the flightdeck must have been 'interesting'. What instrument approach does that runway have (if any)? If it is an ILS then they must surely have been well below the glideslope.

PP

My point is, there's a reason you can't get this close to the threshold at any other airport with 747's landing, is it overlooked with St.Maarten because there is no option, and the revenue from Jumbo's full of passengers is too much to lose?

747's passing just feet overhead of cars and pedestrians doesn't seem right to me

http://images1.jetphotos.net/images/....jpg.17822.jpg

I agree with BOAC. It is silly season on St Maarten. These pics appear almost with monotonous regularity. As he says, use search and you will find them. This thread is really unnecessary but we will leave it for a while.

This pic can't be real, can it? Landing so close to the start of the runway, there are no tyre marks etc.

Is it going to make the threshhold?

I am no expert but the first picture has a look of a montage or some sort of Photoshop manipulation. The 2nd one the photographer is standing on a very solid looking structure which looks dangerously close to the runway. The a/c's port wingtip is only just clearing it. Presumably it must be legal but it doesn't look safe - to me

It's a hotel you idiot!

The photo is real. It was taken by a respected photographer and posted on Airliners.net. The landing is one of closest (to the fence) ever. The PIC lands it extremely short of the numbers. More here: http://www.airliners.net/search/phot...ages=117&page=

you gotta have some balls to stand over by that fence.

Considering that KLM's skid marks are now the first set of tire marks on the runway and are well before the threshold (I will take a pic if ppl want when I get back to work)...This was an EXTREMELY early touchdown. I wouldn't dare land that short and I fly a plane a fraction of the size.

This pic actually shows the exact point where the left main touches the ground (and the other mains shortly after). It corresponds with the exact place that the tire marks start. http://www.airliners.net/open.file/1078774/M/

Always some amusing responses when people see St.Maarten photos for the first time. Yes it is real, yes they do come in low but this was a tad lower than most and touched down short of the threshold.

The main gear looks just a few feet off the tarmac, so it must have passed VERY close to the guy bending over behind the fence. He must have come very close to being decapitated or the 747 was descending very steeply for an almighty touchdown- I would guess he's evacuating his digestive system bending over like that! Still having trouble visualising this- the guy is under the APU, yet the wheels are about to hit the under-run area. Even after 18 years flying 747s, I could never judge it this fine. Definitley an interview in the Flight Managers' Office!

Is this an instance would a go-around and another attempt would have been more appropriate, or is it a very difficult one to call at this location, given that it seems its a visual approach as no ILS here? Surely the PF must, however, have known he/she was heading towards a short touchdown, or is there a certain point on the approach when its too late to call a GA? KL crew should be pretty familiar with this place tho, no?

Standing by the fence on landing is bad, but takeoff must be worse...!

Check out this video from ebaumsworld. Also gives a good indication just how short that landing was! And yes those are people being blown into the sea! I think it was filmed from the same spot the photo was taken also....

http://ebaumsworld.com/2006/07/planeblow.html

What brought about the change of mind?
 

This thread was closed on Saturday!!

It's definitely a fix. There's no vestage of shade or shadow under the aircraft, and unless it's totally transparent that would be extremely difficult to achieve!

The illegality lies in the fact that the section of runway BEFORE the white threshold line is NOT licensed for landing. And it is illegal to land a public transport aircraft on an unlicensed runway.

It's not the first time I've seen St.Maarten photos, and I know that approach is low, but the original thread starting question still stands, even with a normal landing

Is it safe?

true enough... all to much about the pictures of the landings...

how about this video of a take off...

Edit: That link locked up my computer! :ouch:

There is no ILS on Rwy 09 (nor 27).
I will try and post another pic later today, (see some on the sticky thread) but west of the airfield boundary fence there is a small twin track road, a thin low concrete buffer to keep the sand off the road and then the beach. The sand on the extended rwy c/l is lower than the remaining level of the beach left & right of centre - it gets blown away and even behind 75 deps the sea ripples for a good 100+ metres.

There is no traffic control on the road - fortunately, apart from the odd school bus, it is lighlt trafficked by cars/4 x 4's.

The "heavies" backtrack full length and the power starts being applied on the turn - and despite the brainless hanging on to the fence.....it is wise to take serious cover away from the jetblast.
Warning signs abound!

Watch Lear Jet arrivals in particular - very flat. As for DHC6tropics - I got one shot where I could just about touch the gear - but hey, you floated.....

There are so many options for photographic locations. There are two timeshare blocks seen in the background of most SXM pics and the Sonesta Hotel resort further back. You can look down on the runway from several vantage points.

Looking forward to my next trip:D