Easy Airbus or Boeing?
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 182
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From: a fence in the sun
(i) The vibes I get from 'orange' chums is that it should have been a buy-out, it's been spun as a merger, and it is playing out to be a reverse take-over.
(ii) Flap 5 may be correct about the CP - but will (should) he have any say? He's a deliverer, not a policy-maker.
(iii) Flap 5 is wrong about the cargo holds. The NG hold is too high for manual loading without a belt-loader, just like the 'bus.
(iv) Take a look at the share prices over the last few months. (The LSE Share Monitoring Service is a good source). easyJet is sliding downwards a lot closer to BA than to Ryanair, whose price is as stable as one would expect.
(v) The 'Italian difficulty' is over and done with, and made fascinating reading in the Italian press as it unfolded. There's no problem there, and this has nothing to do with Stelios' departure.
(vi) The commercial and political advantages of operating the 'bus are significant. But will 'the management' see the wood for the trees?
(ii) Flap 5 may be correct about the CP - but will (should) he have any say? He's a deliverer, not a policy-maker.
(iii) Flap 5 is wrong about the cargo holds. The NG hold is too high for manual loading without a belt-loader, just like the 'bus.
(iv) Take a look at the share prices over the last few months. (The LSE Share Monitoring Service is a good source). easyJet is sliding downwards a lot closer to BA than to Ryanair, whose price is as stable as one would expect.
(v) The 'Italian difficulty' is over and done with, and made fascinating reading in the Italian press as it unfolded. There's no problem there, and this has nothing to do with Stelios' departure.
(vi) The commercial and political advantages of operating the 'bus are significant. But will 'the management' see the wood for the trees?
Joined: Jan 2001
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From: london
northern sky,
Now with over 60 boeings and the possibility of more with DBA.
Its highly unlikely to swap to Airbus at this stage.
Plus when I was based in the Middle east they were falling appart continuously {build Quality was poor}.
Stick with boeing seems to have worked for Southwest .
Easyjet should do the same.
Now with over 60 boeings and the possibility of more with DBA.
Its highly unlikely to swap to Airbus at this stage.
Plus when I was based in the Middle east they were falling appart continuously {build Quality was poor}.
Stick with boeing seems to have worked for Southwest .
Easyjet should do the same.
Joined: Jan 2000
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It's not such a no-brainer as people think.
easyJet will have done a very detailed economic comparison and as Ray Webster mentioned the Airbus has a risk element, but if the price is right they will go for it. They effectively operate 2 types already the 737-300 and -700 - the commonality in spares isn't as great as people think. Also with the development of new bases, easyJet could have ones dedicated to the 737-700 and others to the A319. So while the Chief Pilot may be a Boeing man, the decision will be based on financial numbers.
Also, the A320 family is already used by other low-cost airlines, eg. JetBlue (A320s); GermanWings (Eurowings's A319s); GoodJet (A320s) and don't forget the charter airlines (Monarch etc with the A321). The charter airlines were and still are low-cost airlines.
easyJet will have done a very detailed economic comparison and as Ray Webster mentioned the Airbus has a risk element, but if the price is right they will go for it. They effectively operate 2 types already the 737-300 and -700 - the commonality in spares isn't as great as people think. Also with the development of new bases, easyJet could have ones dedicated to the 737-700 and others to the A319. So while the Chief Pilot may be a Boeing man, the decision will be based on financial numbers.
Also, the A320 family is already used by other low-cost airlines, eg. JetBlue (A320s); GermanWings (Eurowings's A319s); GoodJet (A320s) and don't forget the charter airlines (Monarch etc with the A321). The charter airlines were and still are low-cost airlines.
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 492
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From: the edge of madness
As Lavdumperer said, from a pax perspective, the A319/320 is a much more comfortable aircraft than the 737 with wider seats/aisle etc and, these days, pax are more type-aware. Flying A319s would give Easy a significant marketing product differentiator with which to beat RyanAir etc over the head. Also while fleet transtion is a pain it doesn't last for ever and, in the overall scheme of things, won't be a major consideration - especially if Airbus a picking up the tab.
Joined: Oct 1999
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From: UK
As I said I think the A319/A320 would be better, but I don't think easyJet will think so.
The CP does have a significant input, although he may be out voted.
The cargo hold is lower on the 737 and can be loaded from the back of a truck (thanks f/spninx). I have jumped in to the forward hold many times to retrieve my and other crew bags - couldn't do that on the A320.
The 737 has airstairs, although easy don't like to use them if pax steps are available.
Whether the 'Italian difficulty' is over or not is a risk they may not be willing to take. The Italians do things their own way.
The CP does have a significant input, although he may be out voted.
The cargo hold is lower on the 737 and can be loaded from the back of a truck (thanks f/spninx). I have jumped in to the forward hold many times to retrieve my and other crew bags - couldn't do that on the A320.
The 737 has airstairs, although easy don't like to use them if pax steps are available.
Whether the 'Italian difficulty' is over or not is a risk they may not be willing to take. The Italians do things their own way.
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 182
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From: a fence in the sun
f/spninx,
Yes, it can be done like this, but not efficiently.
Flap 5,
The 'bus is available with stairs. And if you think that the Italians do things their own way, you should see the French ...and the Germans ...and the British ...and anyone else involved in building the European aircraft!
Nothing to do with me, but it would be nice to see a 'low cost' airline committing to 'high quality' equipment, which the Boeing (for all its Friday afternoon rough-and-ruggedness) most definitely is not.
Yes, it can be done like this, but not efficiently.
Flap 5,
The 'bus is available with stairs. And if you think that the Italians do things their own way, you should see the French ...and the Germans ...and the British ...and anyone else involved in building the European aircraft!
Nothing to do with me, but it would be nice to see a 'low cost' airline committing to 'high quality' equipment, which the Boeing (for all its Friday afternoon rough-and-ruggedness) most definitely is not.
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 389
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From: London
Turnround time for a bulk-loaded A319 would be no more than the 737-700. Possibly marginally less with passenger boarding aided by wider aisles and larger overhead lockers.
The study has been extremely comprehensive and scientific, taking into account all elements such as rostering complexity within a scoring system. Thus any one person such as the CP, whilst extremely involved in the study, will not really be involved in the final board decision.
The study has been extremely comprehensive and scientific, taking into account all elements such as rostering complexity within a scoring system. Thus any one person such as the CP, whilst extremely involved in the study, will not really be involved in the final board decision.
Thread Starter
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 5,123
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From: London Whipsnade Wildlife Park
So back to the orginal post!
Airbus or Boeing?
Decision should have been made ages ago, what is the hold up? Must be money eh? Who can give a gut busting deal? I see Ryanair are being offered 'extra white tailed' 800's for a song from the manufacturer. Loads of built and ordered, but not wanted airframes on offer allegedy?
I see GermanWings will not be using one of thier A319's for the launch of "Low cost", but using one of thier partners A320's from Cologne. (Lufty).
Is this to compete with Air Berlin 737-800's? They seem to be in and out of Stansted rather regularly. Or Ryanair 800's into Hahn?
Airbus or Boeing?
Decision should have been made ages ago, what is the hold up? Must be money eh? Who can give a gut busting deal? I see Ryanair are being offered 'extra white tailed' 800's for a song from the manufacturer. Loads of built and ordered, but not wanted airframes on offer allegedy?
I see GermanWings will not be using one of thier A319's for the launch of "Low cost", but using one of thier partners A320's from Cologne. (Lufty).
Is this to compete with Air Berlin 737-800's? They seem to be in and out of Stansted rather regularly. Or Ryanair 800's into Hahn?
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 119
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From: UK
Further on the loading issue a dispatcher at LHR told me that with not more than about 85 passengers worth of bags it is possible to load them entirely in one of the holds on a 319 meaning you can use one hold for outbound and the other for inbound which in turn means that the inbound and outbound baggage can be loaded/unloaded simultaneously, effectively halving the time required.
Systems falls down when the baggage weight beomes too great though.
Systems falls down when the baggage weight beomes too great though.
