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Another Dreamliner Problem?

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Another Dreamliner Problem?

Old 14th Aug 2013, 09:32
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A4

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Another Dreamliner Problem?

From Sky News:

ANA says it has found wiring problems in fire extinguishers for engines on three aircraft.......

Last edited by A4; 14th Aug 2013 at 10:15.
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Old 14th Aug 2013, 09:52
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Dreamliner: Airline Detects Wiring Faults
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Old 14th Aug 2013, 12:14
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Saw this today on the evening news in Japan. They said that the crossed-wiring worry is that the good engine could be smothered in the event of an engine fire.
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Old 14th Aug 2013, 12:56
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Locked Door, did you just make all that up?
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Old 14th Aug 2013, 13:08
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Yes, he did just fabricate all that.
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Old 14th Aug 2013, 13:16
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Yes, he did just fabricate all that
Apart from the bit about Boeing having a history of this. From 1989:

36 More Boeing Planes Found with Crossed Wires; Total Now 95

Last edited by Cows getting bigger; 14th Aug 2013 at 15:04.
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Old 14th Aug 2013, 14:19
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Note, please, the date on the AP "crossed wires" story.
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Old 14th Aug 2013, 15:04
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Yes indeed, we're talking 25+ years ago. I've edited my post for clarity.

Last edited by Cows getting bigger; 14th Aug 2013 at 15:05.
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Old 14th Aug 2013, 15:44
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NHK today
Faulty wiring found in B-787 Dreamliners

Japanese carrier All Nippon Airways says it has found some faulty wiring in the fire extinguisher system in the engines of 3 of its Boeing 787 jets.

ANA officials say a mechanic working on a 787 parked at Haneda airport in Tokyo found the faulty wiring on Wednesday.

They say the fault would result in spraying extinguishing agent into the wrong engine if there was a fire in one of the jet engines.

The officials say that even if the wrong engine was sprayed it would not stop functioning and a fire can be extinguished by other means.

They inspected their fleet of 20 Dreamliners and found the same problem in 2 more planes.

Japan Airlines started inspecting its 10 Dreamliner jets after being informed of the problem via the transport ministry.

JAL officials say they have not found any faulty connections so far, but they had to call back a flight to Helsinki, Finland, to do the check after it took off from Narita airport.

787s were grounded across the world in January for battery-related malfunctions. They were back in service starting in April.
Aug. 14, 2013 - Updated 11:22 UTC
NHK WORLD English
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Old 14th Aug 2013, 15:52
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ANA 787 wiring problem

Boeing 787 Hit by New Glitch as ANA Discovers Wiring Faults - Bloomberg

Boeing 787 Hit by New Glitch as ANA Discovers Wiring Faults
Boeing Co.’s 787 Dreamliner suffered a fresh setback after ANA Holdings Inc., the model’s biggest operator, said it discovered wiring defects in three aircraft.
The fault, found in the fire-suppression system of a 787 due to depart Tokyo’s Haneda airport today, would cause the wrong extinguisher to be activated in the event of a blaze in one of the plane’s two engines, spokeswoman Megumi Tezuka said.
Enlarge image
A Boeing Co. 787 Dreamliner aircraft operated by All Nippon Airways Co., front, is parked as other ANA aircraft taxies at Haneda Airport in Tokyo. Photographer: Tomohiro Ohsumi/Bloomberg
Boeing’s flagship jet is already under scrutiny following a fire in London last month that initial findings suggested may have been sparked by wires for an emergency beacon. The 787 had returned to service with ANA and Japan Airlines on June 1 after a global grounding in the wake of fires involving jets flown by the pair, later traced to the failure of lithium-ion batteries.
“We will thoroughly examine this issue and take the appropriate steps,” Boeing spokesman Rob Henderson said from Tokyo following the latest incident. “The safety of those flying on Boeing airplanes is our top priority.”
Boeing fell as much as 1 percent and was trading 0.8 percent lower at $105.4 as of 9:47 a.m. in New York. The stock has advanced 40 percent this year.
JAL Turnaround
ANA’s Tezuka said parts were replaced in two of the jets in which the Tokyo-based carrier found the defect, adding it must have occurred during the manufacturing process. The third aircraft will also be fixed by the end of the day, she said.
Japan Air today ordered a 787 bound for Helsinki to return to Narita airport in Tokyo as a precautionary measure after being informed of the new wiring issue by the national Transport Ministry, company spokesman Seiji Takaramoto said.
The carrier subsequently inspected all 10 of its 787s and found no problems, he said. Among other Dreamliner operators, LOT Polish Airlines SA said its planes are flying as scheduled, while Qatar Airways Ltd. said it has had no problems and Norwegian Air Shuttle ASA said it was unaware of the issue.
“These things happen with a new aircraft,” said Robert Stallard, an analyst at RBC Capital in London with an “outperform” rating on Chicago-based Boeing. “When the airlines ground the plane or regulators start becoming involved, then it becomes something to watch out for.”

Last edited by DWS; 14th Aug 2013 at 15:53.
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Old 14th Aug 2013, 15:58
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This has already been posted.
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Old 14th Aug 2013, 16:12
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Could you point out to me where this is posted please.
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Old 14th Aug 2013, 18:45
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Some people's well being is threatened if they can't find another 787 "problem". There may be crashes, smokes elsewhere in the fleet but a defective part in 787 trumps everything

Last edited by olasek; 14th Aug 2013 at 18:47.
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Old 14th Aug 2013, 21:15
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What could be more NEWSworthy than another 787 electrical problem?
How true, no other airplane in the history of aviation has ever had a mis-wired circuit - let alone one that was found and fixed - so we're not about to be diverted from our crusade by run-of-the-mill minor mishaps elsewhere are we?
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Old 14th Aug 2013, 22:17
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Fenland787

Your user name,perhaps, suggests an unbiased approach to this topic.
To me, should I ever have an engine fire, I would be a bit p#ssed off if the extinguisher bottles were incorrectly wired and all my well rehearsed drills in the sim over the last few years resulted in a non extinguished donk.
Yes I know that any problem involving the so called 'dream liner' is getting exaggerated coverage, but lets not try and stifle debate. I should like to know of any such problems with any commercial plane.
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Old 14th Aug 2013, 23:07
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Manthrust

Yes, it is true I feel a certain affinity with the thing but not a blind one, there are issues, they need addressing I don't deny it. Were there aspects of the management of the program that turned out to be less than great? Absolutely!

As you point out it does get a disproportional coverage for every problem but even that I can sort of understand, the thing that winds me up more is the whole conspiracy theory, that is so prevalent here, that somehow there is an unholy alliance between Boeing, all the airlines of the world and all the worlds regulators to deliberately cover up a raft of known and catastrophic failings in the airplane.

It ain't so and it never could be!

I am well aware of the fact that this particular issue is bad and actually you would be right to be very p***ed off because it has been a known issue on other airplanes so something went wrong that really should not have, I know that there will be a bunch of folk in Everett right now who will working this, fixing it and from what they find, looking at other systems to see if the same could have happened there.

What those folk will not be doing is covering it up. In Mike Sinnett's day he would be along, sitting on the corner of desks in the 40-88 building asking some very, very good questions and the last thing he or anyone else will do is stifle debate.

Sadly for us, what they will also not be doing is posting their findings here!

But when the problem is found it will be fixed and the reasons for it will be given to those who need to know and lessons will be learned.

Last edited by fenland787; 15th Aug 2013 at 17:37.
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Old 15th Aug 2013, 00:09
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Why is this in the Spotters Corner?

Seems like something the professionals would want to know about.
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Old 15th Aug 2013, 14:57
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The officials say that even if the wrong engine was sprayed it
would not stop functioning and a fire can be extinguished by
other means.
That's ok then, we can all go back to sleep. Are these people
serious, a major safety related fault and noone needs to
worry ?. The complacency and related excuses are astounding.

The first question should be: Why wasn't this picked up during
system verification testing, in manufacturing. Do they
bother to check / verify that the various systems actually
work as intended before shipment to the customer ?. In this
case, apparently not...
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Old 15th Aug 2013, 17:34
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This is starting to look like it is not quite as straight forward as first thought.
Still awaiting Boeing recommendations to the operators, looks to be a manufacturing issue with the bottle and not just wires incorrectly fitted.
Looks like a short term fix is re-wiring, with replacement of fire bottle within a short period of time.
However as pointed out on the other thread in R/N, why was it not picked up when the system was tested after installation?
Maybe Boeing are not testing all the aircraft systems after power up during build.
Boeing's QA department must be flat out on all the issues being found on the various models, yes it is not just the B787 where quality issues are being found.
The build quality is not as good as it used to be and not a scratch on Airbus at the moment.
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Old 15th Aug 2013, 20:37
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I hate the fact that expressing concern about 787s leads to accusations of being pro-Airbus and anti-Boeing, and this partisanship works both ways. Criticising either maker brings rapid defence from fans of the other.

However, I was already concerned about several aspects of the 787, and this latest seems to add faulty installation and verification processes to its reputation.

It is entirely right to express concern, and does not automatically denote a bias against the maker.
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