Pushing back under reverse thrust?
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Pushing back under reverse thrust?
I seem to recall that when the Korean Airlines 747 was shot down, as a consequence, an IL62 was stranded at @ LHR because no one would (understandably) service it.
Am i correct in saying it pushed back from the stand using reverse thrust and without the aid of a tug.
Did I imagine this?
Am i correct in saying it pushed back from the stand using reverse thrust and without the aid of a tug.
Did I imagine this?
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Plenty of aircraft can push back by using reverse thrust. I don't recall the IL-62 incident but it would, presumably, have been feasible with marshallers in attendance although whether it would have been allowed I don't know.
Paxing All Over The World
Whilst, in emergency all a/c can do this - it is not usually done.
The DC-9 and 717 series have high mounted engines, you would not 'blow back' in a 737 as the pods are low slung and you could pick up a lot of FOD. You would need to ask for permission before doing this.
As I recall, a 73 in the USA a couple of years ago did a blow back in heavy snow and complicated his life very considerable, as he stirred up all the snow and ice on the apron and some was ingested.
Lastly, you do not normally do this on a busy apron because of the heavy wind that you then send across the apron. This can blow things into someone else's engine (whilst it's off) and blow people off their feet etc.
Propliners can do this too. They set the pitch and get reverse thrust. When my nephew was on the J41 he told me that they often did it at the small fields that they visited but the procedure was to ease open the throttle and close almost as soon as she moved. Then WAIT for her to stop rolling back, then centre the pitch, then apply the brake. If you touched the foot brakes whilst she was rolling - she would promptly sit down on her backside.
The DC-9 and 717 series have high mounted engines, you would not 'blow back' in a 737 as the pods are low slung and you could pick up a lot of FOD. You would need to ask for permission before doing this.
As I recall, a 73 in the USA a couple of years ago did a blow back in heavy snow and complicated his life very considerable, as he stirred up all the snow and ice on the apron and some was ingested.
Lastly, you do not normally do this on a busy apron because of the heavy wind that you then send across the apron. This can blow things into someone else's engine (whilst it's off) and blow people off their feet etc.
Propliners can do this too. They set the pitch and get reverse thrust. When my nephew was on the J41 he told me that they often did it at the small fields that they visited but the procedure was to ease open the throttle and close almost as soon as she moved. Then WAIT for her to stop rolling back, then centre the pitch, then apply the brake. If you touched the foot brakes whilst she was rolling - she would promptly sit down on her backside.
Many years ago I spent a couple of pleasant hours on the viewing terrace at Albany NY (if I recall correctly it was on top of the pier) watching DC9s and 727s pushing back under their own power. It was quite a novelty. I wonder however just how economical it must have been.
Never saw it done in UK though, but I imagine that BMA and Dan Air must have done it at some time with their DC9s and 727s.
Never saw it done in UK though, but I imagine that BMA and Dan Air must have done it at some time with their DC9s and 727s.
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As far as I know, at most commercial UK airports power backs are not permitted. However, the Saudi C130s that visit MAN every now and then perform powerbacks in pairs, it's great to watch 
Paxing All Over The World
Reverserbucket
VERY GOOD! Yes, caught out there with my sweeping generalisation.
You must be thrilled to have a thread that suits you so well ...
Tried it in the 146 once but it didn't seem to work 
Yes, caught out there with my sweeping generalisation.You must be thrilled to have a thread that suits you so well ...
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I can recall an incident at Newcastle, at the time when the terminal was on the opposite side of the runway to where it is now, a landing BKS Britannia not quite making the turnoff, and backing up the runway and round the corner onto its stand – the apron would have been otherwise unoccupied, as was normal in those days. I bet the captain was an ace at parallel parking too.
However, for jets I have always thought it a US thing, never seen it anywhere else. If you are out on the ramp at the time without ear defenders it's quite a show, as reverse thrust is not particularly efficient and it needs quite a high power setting - was once disembarking from a Jetstream 31 at Fresno CA when the American MD80 alongside was doing it, which deafened us all.
Originally Posted by Paxboy
Whilst, in emergency all a/c can do this....
Last edited by WHBM; 12th Apr 2012 at 09:57.
BA757 had to reverse off the runway after the unpleasantness with the Airtours 737 at MAN many years ago. We also used to ' marshal' the J41s back from stand. Not done nowadays of course due to elf n safety innit.
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Just to back up NorternChappie's comment about Jetstream 41's, I seem to recall that was one of the main selling points to the American domestic operators.
Reversing
I remember the IL62 incident on the the BBC news. They said that the departure lounge was evaculated as a precaution.
I remember flying on a NW airpass in 1986 and reverse thrust pushbacks were common, at least on the DC9. I've not seen any in the last few years - I presume that its no longer considered safe.
If Boeing is successful fitting an electric motor into the 737 nosewheel I dare say that we will see a lot more pushbacks without tugs.
I remember flying on a NW airpass in 1986 and reverse thrust pushbacks were common, at least on the DC9. I've not seen any in the last few years - I presume that its no longer considered safe.
If Boeing is successful fitting an electric motor into the 737 nosewheel I dare say that we will see a lot more pushbacks without tugs.