Is this legal and /or acceptable practice?

[dochealth]

Hope this is the right forum for this question.

Last weekend I travelled on a scheduled service with one of Europe's former state airlines. About 30 mins prior to landing, the senior cabin crew beckoned to a woman sitting beside me and she was brought forward to the cockpit door. The hostie then keyed in some numbers into cockpit entry keypad and the passenger was allowed into the cockpit. She emerged after we landed and had reached the gate.

Two things have niggled me since:

Is it legal/ permissible to allow SLF into cockpit post 9/11?

Now that we have locked cockpits, should the door not have been opened by one of the flight crew from the inside?

Thanks in advance

[G SXTY]

Don’t be niggled.

Not all countries have the same draconian rules on FD access as the UK, and you have no idea of the identity of the passenger sat next to you. They could have been off duty aircrew, or a relative of one of the crew, or ATC. FD access rules will be covered by the airline’s ops manual, and if the book says it’s allowed, then why not? I doubt that many captains would risk letting an unauthorised visitor into the FD these days, when passengers are watching every move . . .

[Fernanjet]

Now that we have locked cockpits, should the door not have been opened by one of the flight crew from the inside?

It would have been......the entry code is like a doorbell basically!

Is it legal/ permissible to allow SLF into cockpit post 9/11?

Legally....the captain of an aircraft still has the last word on what happens on board....so technically, yes they could enter, but unlikely if they were not an employee etc...

[IFPS man]

I've been on the jump-seat three times since 9-11.....

[Avman]

This subject comes up about once a month. Too many people have been brainwashed into believing that the draconian kneejerk regulations imposed by a few paranoid countries apply worldwide. This is not so. Many countries have no such regulation and many airlines continue to apply the principal that FD visits remain at the Captain's discretion. As already said, it will most likely be someone with appropriate I/D and "qualifications".

[smudgethecat]

Ive had the "pleasure" of being stuck on a bloody jump seat hundreds of times, if i never ever have do another down route on a jump seat that will suit me fine, give me a nice comfy pax seat any time.

[Rainboe]

Well Smudge, you can rest assured= the pilots in the cockpit didn't want you there but they were gracious to give you as much hospitality as they could in their 'office' in order to help you travel. But I suspect by jump seat, were you really referring to cabin jump seats if you say you have traveled on them 'hundreds of times'? Again a minor irritation to the cabin crew having you there, but they are happy to undergo it in order to help you get to your destination. But again, rest assured, they would rather not have you there, but it was for your benefit, and presumably at the time, you were grateful for the favour.

Not surprisingly, it was occasionally known that people would travel on cabin jumpseats after begging to be able to travel an (any) seat, then start creating afterwards for their fare to be refunded because it was 'uncomfortable'.

[smudgethecat]

No they were not being gracious rainboe, they have no choice, , company policy old chap, why put a employee in a fare paying seat when you can cram them in the 3rd obs seat, not a problem on a short sector but gets rather wearing longhaul, however it does have its up side the views are the best in the house the crew foods almost edible and the f/deck are normally a excellent source of rumour /scandle/gossip/banter etc

[Rainboe]

So...there is an ulterior motive you didn't let in on? And the gossip is usually far behind what whizzes around the ground staff. The engineers are always a step ahead.....unless their department is going to get canned. My usual source of goss is the sandwich van in Manor Royal.

[SloppyJoe]

Why did you think he meant cabin crew seat? I think that with most airlines you actually need to be qualified to sit in one of those but the jump seat in the front you do not.

[smudgethecat]

I normally find the caterers are way ahead of both the engineers and the pilots /CC in the intelligence gathering dept, something to do with the fact they chew the fat with lots of different operators in the course of the day, i think gives them a very unfair advantage in the goss dept!

[simonchowder]

You dont know how lucky you are smudge, there are plenty on this forum

who would love to find out just how uncomfortable that jump seat is, id

love to get a trip on the jumpseat must be a great experiance.

[brs planespotter]

jumpseat rides

for a good couple of years before 9/11,i approached the charter airlines based at brs and they were more than happy too oblige with ramp staff going on a short hop and back.many of the captains that i have got too know have said its a great shame that its been stopped.in fact my last trip on the jumpseat (757)the skipper even said he prefered someone on the j/seat as if someone did "break in"then the observer could help....if only those days would return....

[tom775257]

For the previous airline I worked for the rules were 1) Anyone allowed into the cockpit inflight must be known to the flight crew 2) No non crew members in the cockpit within UK airspace.

My girlfriend flew with them recently, I told her to tell the FA's she was my other half (she was interested to see what I do for a living), she was invited up the cockpit and stayed through to arrival.

Now I work for a UK airline there is no chance of getting anyone non-crew into the cockpit during the flight.

[dochealth]

Thanks for all the replies.

As a regular on EI, RE and less so BA, but not related to crew, is there any point in asking nicely for access on the basis of being an interested amateur?

In the past have enjoyed Saab 340 into Kerry and 737 - 400 into FCO, but have never been in Airbus cockpit and would love to see how it differs...

DH

[5milesbaby]

dochealth, there is nothing stopping you asking, however don't be dismayed if the answer is always "no".

Tom775257 - Some ATC personnel are allowed in the jump seat with pre-arranged authorisation.