Airline Fleets
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 28
Likes: 0
From: CheekyTown
Thanks for all the replies , i did think it was the case that Kenyan previously cleared LHR before with their last B737 batch and also i believe Ethiopian also did the same ; assumedly for the same reason of a station.
I'm not sure if any of these flights onward were direct revenue flights or not.Certainly Monday's fight on to Kenya via Cairo was empty.
It just would be nice to have an advanced notice of these sorts of thing dropping in to LHR.
I'm not sure if any of these flights onward were direct revenue flights or not.Certainly Monday's fight on to Kenya via Cairo was empty.
It just would be nice to have an advanced notice of these sorts of thing dropping in to LHR.
Considerably Bemused Wannabe
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 498
Likes: 0
From: UK
How many new TCX 330's are due?
This photo was taken at TLS on 30/10/06:
http://www.!!!!!!!!!!!!!!/open.file?i...FP&photo_nr=82
Cheers for the info.
eP
This photo was taken at TLS on 30/10/06:
http://www.!!!!!!!!!!!!!!/open.file?i...FP&photo_nr=82
Cheers for the info.
eP
cheers mate.
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 766
Likes: 1
From: scotland
Who the heck wants to go to SFB (Sanford)? Its miles north of Orlando and the tourist traps, and the terminal is small, not to mention tight taxiways for WB aircraft and way too much primary flight training (Cessnas & Pipers) traffic for comfort.
Better to go to MCO-Orlando Intn'l.
Better to go to MCO-Orlando Intn'l.
Joined: Oct 2002
Aviation Qualifications: PPL
Posts: 8,203
Likes: 347
From: London UK
If you order an aircraft it is for a firm delivery date and you will negotiate hard and get say a 737, whose "list" price (in practice rarely paid) is $60m each, for a bargain price, say $50m for each one, all in a firm contract
Airlines like to have one type in their fleet. Now I have bought 10 737s to be delivered over the next year at $50m each. But maybe in 3, maybe 5 years time I will want some more, though not really certain yet if I do or how many I will want, or when.
But if you go back to Boeing in a couple of years time and say "how much", they know you are stuck with all the maintenance and training for the 737 and that changing to the A320 will cost you a bomb and is not what you want to do at all. So they can say "Well the list price has now gone up to $70m, in fact they're so popular we would like $75m each".
So you do an option with your initial order that says - well they all say different things. But maybe it says you can order up to another 12, anytime up to 5 years from now, for delivery within 12 months from then, at a price of $50m plus some inflation index percentage. So when you do go back in a few years time you can be confident that the order price will be say $53m.
So you are on the order books with an agreed price although you needn't take any at all. But you know what you could have if you want, and how much they will cost.
If things turn out bad for the manufacturer there is of course nothing to stop you from negotiating the price down further at that later date. But the manufacturer cannot stick you for more.
Manufacturers like options too because they give an indication of what could possibly be sold in the future and the figures often get misinterpreted as something as good as orders for the long term.
Airlines like to have one type in their fleet. Now I have bought 10 737s to be delivered over the next year at $50m each. But maybe in 3, maybe 5 years time I will want some more, though not really certain yet if I do or how many I will want, or when.
But if you go back to Boeing in a couple of years time and say "how much", they know you are stuck with all the maintenance and training for the 737 and that changing to the A320 will cost you a bomb and is not what you want to do at all. So they can say "Well the list price has now gone up to $70m, in fact they're so popular we would like $75m each".
So you do an option with your initial order that says - well they all say different things. But maybe it says you can order up to another 12, anytime up to 5 years from now, for delivery within 12 months from then, at a price of $50m plus some inflation index percentage. So when you do go back in a few years time you can be confident that the order price will be say $53m.
So you are on the order books with an agreed price although you needn't take any at all. But you know what you could have if you want, and how much they will cost.
If things turn out bad for the manufacturer there is of course nothing to stop you from negotiating the price down further at that later date. But the manufacturer cannot stick you for more.
Manufacturers like options too because they give an indication of what could possibly be sold in the future and the figures often get misinterpreted as something as good as orders for the long term.
Joined: May 1999
Posts: 160
Likes: 3
From: UK
Who the heck wants to go to SFB (Sanford)? Its miles north of Orlando and the tourist traps, and the terminal is small, not to mention tight taxiways for WB aircraft and way too much primary flight training (Cessnas & Pipers) traffic for comfort.
Better to go to MCO-Orlando Intn'l.
Better to go to MCO-Orlando Intn'l.
1. The taxiways are wide enough with no exceptionally tight turns.
2. The time taken to transit from the aircraft in SFB, clear imigration and pick up bags is a fraction of the time of the time at MCO.
3. The terminal is large enough to cope with 7 wide bodies at a time.
I do agree with your comments on the flying training though
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 41
Likes: 0
From: Newbury, Berkshire
Cheers WHBM, very clear answer! I was also wondering as I read that whats in it for the manufacturers (whether the airline has to put down a deposit or something) but I guess the interest is good enough for them!
Joined: Oct 2002
Aviation Qualifications: PPL
Posts: 8,203
Likes: 347
From: London UK
In my day job I do options on cement and steel. If I am building Terminal 5 at Heathrow I say to RMC Concrete "how much for 500,000 cubic metres of concrete delivered to the site by the end of 2007. And they will quote £50 a cubic metre, and I place an option (we call it a "bulk order"). I don't pay anything initially and I don't have to take anything, but I know now that if I call them up and say I want 100 cubic metres next Monday, delivered to site, that it will cost me £5,000. It's the same concept. If they didn't trust I was serious about taking any (they can see I am doing the job) they wouldn't quote.
If they have to build a whole production unit to handle the job they may say "£5 million up front, then just £40 a cubic metre". It gets much more complicated than that but you get the idea. Airlines do the same sort of negotiations with manufacturers.
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 834
Likes: 0
From: Estonia
Air India Worldliners
Is Air India supposed to be the next Worldliner customer after PIA?
When are they supposed to get the planes?
Where would they fly?
What interior would they have? (Air India, unlike PIA, has first class in their 747-s.)
And when will the other Worldliner customers (Emirates, EVA, Air Canada, Delta... who else?) get their planes?
When are they supposed to get the planes?
Where would they fly?
What interior would they have? (Air India, unlike PIA, has first class in their 747-s.)
And when will the other Worldliner customers (Emirates, EVA, Air Canada, Delta... who else?) get their planes?
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 431
Likes: 7
From: London
MYT G-GTDL to be painted at last?!
MyTravel A320 G-GTDL is departing BHX to FZO tmrw as MYT005, could this be for a repaint?
Be so good to see all the MYT fleet in the full colour scheme!
Talking on which does anyone know how it is possible to find out which A/C in an airlines fleet will be painted next and when?
Be so good to see all the MYT fleet in the full colour scheme!
Talking on which does anyone know how it is possible to find out which A/C in an airlines fleet will be painted next and when?