RAAF to get the F-22 and/or F-18E/F?
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Originally Posted by gaunty
Time to upgrade all the pigs and make those "spares" operational methinks.
Waaaay cheaper, more effective in our area of operations and no "operational sovereignty" problems.
The idea that you buy a weapons platform from another country who retains the ability to deny its use whenever they think fit, is real loony tunes only a "captive" partner would contemplate.
Waaaay cheaper, more effective in our area of operations and no "operational sovereignty" problems.
The idea that you buy a weapons platform from another country who retains the ability to deny its use whenever they think fit, is real loony tunes only a "captive" partner would contemplate.
And NOTHING can replace the pissaphone-equipped bou-bou.
Last edited by Taildragger67; 2nd Aug 2006 at 09:06.
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Currently we have,
16 x Sea Hawks
11 x Sea Sprites
6 x Sea Kings
38 x Black Hawks (minus those written off)
25 x UH1
(Please correct my Army numbers, as the only refernce on the net I could find was a bit old)
80 may well be dreaming. Without the UH1's, my count is up to 65, and the number Army birds could well be off.
I know its not a straight one for one replacement, but we have 69 Sea Kings, Blawk Hawks and UH1's being replaced by 46 MRH90s. (Also should mention the suggested 50 UH145 order, I listed above, as well)
80 may well be ambitious, but are we not looking at least 60-65. 46 have already been order and there would need to be at least 20 to replace the Sea Hawks and Sea Sprites.
Should we be thinking about an increase in numbers? (as aposed to capacity, which the 90 may offer an improvement on) Heaven forbid we need to deploy 12 on each LHD at the same time. Would leave only 22 for other Ops.
One question I have is will MRH90 fit on an ANZAC frigate?
16 x Sea Hawks
11 x Sea Sprites
6 x Sea Kings
38 x Black Hawks (minus those written off)
25 x UH1
(Please correct my Army numbers, as the only refernce on the net I could find was a bit old)
80 may well be dreaming. Without the UH1's, my count is up to 65, and the number Army birds could well be off.
I know its not a straight one for one replacement, but we have 69 Sea Kings, Blawk Hawks and UH1's being replaced by 46 MRH90s. (Also should mention the suggested 50 UH145 order, I listed above, as well)
80 may well be ambitious, but are we not looking at least 60-65. 46 have already been order and there would need to be at least 20 to replace the Sea Hawks and Sea Sprites.
Should we be thinking about an increase in numbers? (as aposed to capacity, which the 90 may offer an improvement on) Heaven forbid we need to deploy 12 on each LHD at the same time. Would leave only 22 for other Ops.
One question I have is will MRH90 fit on an ANZAC frigate?
Last edited by Dragon79; 2nd Aug 2006 at 11:38.
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Originally Posted by gaunty
Time to upgrade all the pigs and make those "spares" operational methinks.
Waaaay cheaper, more effective in our area of operations and no "operational sovereignty" problems.
Time to upgrade all the pigs and make those "spares" operational methinks.
Waaaay cheaper, more effective in our area of operations and no "operational sovereignty" problems.
Yes! Finally someone agrees with me!
F-111 would piss all over F22 if we could just devote some cash to making it stealthy and slap on an AESA. With a vectored thrust kit fitted it would be unstoppable
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I think we should get two squadrons of F-22s to replace the F-111s ASAP, and then hopefully get 3 squardrons of F-35s to replace the F/A-18s later on.
I personally don't like the idea of putting all of our eggs in one basket.
I personally don't like the idea of putting all of our eggs in one basket.
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Originally Posted by oldm8
F-111 would piss all over F22 if we could just devote some cash to making it stealthy and slap on an AESA. With a vectored thrust kit fitted it would be unstoppable
An upgraded single donk could easily make the pig lift off vertically.
With today's engine technology and a V-STOL kit, the upgraded VTOL pig could lift a full warload vertically out of hidden, unprepared surfaces all over the NT and deliver it to the bros
to the north. Get some, get some....
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I wonder if the yanks would let us build our F-22s locally or whether they'd prefer the technology be kept "in house"???
I agree with Bob... although putting all our eggs in one basket cuts costs... all it would take is a couple of hickups (eg. seasprite; ok more than hickups in that case!), and you could potentially have your air defence force of 100+ aircraft grounded! Perhaps an F-22/F-35 buy is the go.
I've heard pretty nasty things about the Typhoon's progress into operational status, but what about the very cheap, lightweight and capable Grippen??? We could even con NZ into a group buy on that one!
I agree with Bob... although putting all our eggs in one basket cuts costs... all it would take is a couple of hickups (eg. seasprite; ok more than hickups in that case!), and you could potentially have your air defence force of 100+ aircraft grounded! Perhaps an F-22/F-35 buy is the go.
I've heard pretty nasty things about the Typhoon's progress into operational status, but what about the very cheap, lightweight and capable Grippen??? We could even con NZ into a group buy on that one!
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Originally Posted by Buster Hyman
Well...ummm...as much as we have that capability now...is anyone rated to use it in anger?
The current RAAF F 18s do not have all the gear for carrier ops. It is useful to have the ability to stage through a US carrier if nothing else. See the last big war for examples - Malta, Norway etc. It is in any case a relatively easy aircraft to fly on and off the deck.
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Holy snappin' dooly! There are some serious wish-lists there. 2nd & 3rd mortages forthcoming on the house?
Hmmm, PAF. AC-130J?
LMAS, being the ever-reliable military contractor that they are 
would of course thoroughly test and integrate it before selling it to us! 
Hmmm, PAF. AC-130J?
LMAS, being the ever-reliable military contractor that they are would of course thoroughly test and integrate it before selling it to us!
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Are we talking about the same RAAF that just spent $2billion to buy 4 C-17s? Now they're going to get a few SQUADRONS of F-22s and F/A18E/Fs for $15billion? Not a chance. I've also seen in print recently that the F-22 is not for export. That may change but we won't be on the list of approved buyers if we pull out of JSF.
Have many carrier landings in the F/A18? Any understanding of how the US Navy operates their carriers, other than from watching Discovery?
The current RAAF F 18s do not have all the gear for carrier ops. It is useful to have the ability to stage through a US carrier if nothing else. See the last big war for examples - Malta, Norway etc. It is in any case a relatively easy aircraft to fly on and off the deck.
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Yes, I have to admit that there has been a lot of pipe dreaming here. Even if Brendan and his mates in Canberra have at last recognised that we might actually need some credible hardware in the near future that might actually get used, they still want to be re-elected, and the price tag on some of the wish lists we've seen here is well beyond what the Oz Great Unwashed is willing to pay.
It's a pity that in Oz, it has always seemed impossible to get the message across to some - quite a few, actually, especially the 'educated' elites - that the best social welfare system in the world won't be of much use to you if you no longer own the country that's providing it.
The current unpleasantness in Lebanon should, (but you can guarantee it won't), be a sobering wakeup call to many that if you don't possess a credible deterrent, (Mr Rooseveldt's 'big stick'), any near neighbour can do whatever he likes with and on your territory if he chooses to.
...and if push ever comes to shove in our part of the world, don't expect any of our near neighbours to simply bomb the bejeezus out of us and then go away, as the Israelis are promising to do in Lebanon.
It's a pity that in Oz, it has always seemed impossible to get the message across to some - quite a few, actually, especially the 'educated' elites - that the best social welfare system in the world won't be of much use to you if you no longer own the country that's providing it.
The current unpleasantness in Lebanon should, (but you can guarantee it won't), be a sobering wakeup call to many that if you don't possess a credible deterrent, (Mr Rooseveldt's 'big stick'), any near neighbour can do whatever he likes with and on your territory if he chooses to.
...and if push ever comes to shove in our part of the world, don't expect any of our near neighbours to simply bomb the bejeezus out of us and then go away, as the Israelis are promising to do in Lebanon.
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How much time is dedicated to carrier landings in the RAAF F18 pilot group? If any...
Some of you might not know that the mighty Pig has a hook too, and I have it on good authority that they are writing deck landings into the syllabus at 6Sqn.
Soon our hornets will be able to "stage" through carrier groups on their way to overseas destinations. There is so much room on those carrier decks it is no problem to park a RAAF squadron and refuel before pressing on.