The "Westcott Snatch"?
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Simple - a Heathrow inbound routing to BNN is given a heading before BNN to put it directly onto a base leg for either of the 09 runways. I don't think it's"old" as it is still currently employed.
Couldonlyaffordafiver
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There's a NDB (non-directional beacon) on the arrival route just before Bovingdon at the old airfield at Westcott, hence the "Westcott Snatch". Don't be rude....
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The Westcott Snatch was frequently used to expedite arrive into NHT arriving from the north when I was operating out of there. It had the advantage of getting us out of the way of the inbound traffic to LHR.
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Similarly:
the "Lambourne Pluck" - heading 240 at high speed to intercept a westerly localiser.
also the "Biggin Take" - 320 from Biggin to land westerly.
Neither of these expressions was heard as often as the "Westcott Snatch" which as far as I am aware came in to use when the Trident started pounding the Shuttle routes to GLA,MCR,EDI & BFS.
Then there was the "Bigolow" (sp?), an early left turn from the Berlin Centre Corridor en route to Helighen when heading South to FRA, STR, MUC staying in Western Airspace. Something like a heading of 240 about 10 nm short of Helighen towards an NDB to intercept the N/S airway. I was told it was named after a PanAm Captain who first asked for it.
the "Lambourne Pluck" - heading 240 at high speed to intercept a westerly localiser.
also the "Biggin Take" - 320 from Biggin to land westerly.
Neither of these expressions was heard as often as the "Westcott Snatch" which as far as I am aware came in to use when the Trident started pounding the Shuttle routes to GLA,MCR,EDI & BFS.
Then there was the "Bigolow" (sp?), an early left turn from the Berlin Centre Corridor en route to Helighen when heading South to FRA, STR, MUC staying in Western Airspace. Something like a heading of 240 about 10 nm short of Helighen towards an NDB to intercept the N/S airway. I was told it was named after a PanAm Captain who first asked for it.
Last edited by Hobo; 17th Jun 2005 at 10:47.
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We often used the term "snatch" for lots of other situations, but I've never heard "Lambourne Pluck" or "Biggin Take", which must have come into use since I retired. As Fly3 noted, the procedure is used for Northolt traffic too - probably more so than for LHR.
The base leg turns before BNN were in use long before Westcott was ever thought of - we used to snatch them off Beacon Hill, rememember that? A similar procedure is employed from the south when a/c are turned north from the MID area, or sometimes London Control put them on a heading for WOD and Heathrow pops them into the approach sequence.
It's terribly clever stuff and all done by a suitable sytem of levers and mirrors.
The base leg turns before BNN were in use long before Westcott was ever thought of - we used to snatch them off Beacon Hill, rememember that? A similar procedure is employed from the south when a/c are turned north from the MID area, or sometimes London Control put them on a heading for WOD and Heathrow pops them into the approach sequence.
It's terribly clever stuff and all done by a suitable sytem of levers and mirrors.
Many years ago I was P2 on Shuttle back up BAC 1-11's. The "Westcott snatch" was a regular feature but used to have me in fits of giggles when flying with a particular Captain.
His name was Westcott - no kidding
His name was Westcott - no kidding
Last edited by ETOPS; 17th Jun 2005 at 07:51.
Paxing All Over The World
H.Dir. "It's terribly clever stuff and all done by a suitable sytem of levers and mirrors."
Actually, since your retirement, you will find that the mirrors have been replaced by High Definition TV cameras and monitors, or will be when the International Standards Committee have agreed the standards.
The levers have been replaced by servo controlled actuators which are much more reliable. Unfortunately, the software that actuates the actuators is not ...
The management said that it was a purely temporary move to reinstate the levers and mirrors. The Projected Project Plan plans the new system to be ready for service at the same time as the new European Constitution.
It is true that The Projected Project Plan contains a lot of Ps.
--------------------
"I tell you, we are here on Earth to fart around, and don't let anybody tell you any different." Kurt Vonnegut, Jr.
Actually, since your retirement, you will find that the mirrors have been replaced by High Definition TV cameras and monitors, or will be when the International Standards Committee have agreed the standards.
The levers have been replaced by servo controlled actuators which are much more reliable. Unfortunately, the software that actuates the actuators is not ...
The management said that it was a purely temporary move to reinstate the levers and mirrors. The Projected Project Plan plans the new system to be ready for service at the same time as the new European Constitution.
It is true that The Projected Project Plan contains a lot of Ps.
--------------------
"I tell you, we are here on Earth to fart around, and don't let anybody tell you any different." Kurt Vonnegut, Jr.
A WCO snatch is always very welcome when coming from the North onto 09L as is getting picked off for a straight in from LAM or BIG. None of them seem quite as sporty as they used to be I guess due to the length of final now required to keep the neighbours happy.
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<<Actually, since your retirement, you will find that the mirrors have been replaced by High Definition TV cameras and monitors..>>
So they've replaced the stack TVs at last, eh?
Max Angle.. They were the good old days: "Turn right 190, no speed control!"... Then "Left on 150 and report if you get the runway in sight"..
So they've replaced the stack TVs at last, eh?
Max Angle.. They were the good old days: "Turn right 190, no speed control!"... Then "Left on 150 and report if you get the runway in sight"..
Paxing All Over The World
<<So they've replaced the stack TVs at last, eh?>> I understand that Dixon's did a very good job at replacing them.
And replacing those under warranty and then when the third set also failed ...
And replacing those under warranty and then when the third set also failed ...
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Loved the 'MR' link - thank you Lhr Atc. Many happy memories of Wco 'snatches' into Nht under the 'stack' and still enjoy the odd Mid snatch from the Willo 3C onto 08R @ Lgw. A big thanks to all at WD and Swanwick - best in the world.
Cheers,
mcdhu
Cheers,
mcdhu
The Westcott Snatch
Folks,
"The Westcott Snatch". I once heard this mentioned by a BA chappie on a late-night inbound. Again, I'm guessing on inbounds to EGLL from the north effectively turning onto a long base leg of 09L/R from Westcott, rather than having to route via BNN, hence "cutting the corner".
Hopefully I'm safe here. Mods - please don't move me to the ATC forum. I'm still in therapy from the last drubbing.
r
PS - just seen the archive on "The Westcott Snatch". Do I win a prize?
"The Westcott Snatch". I once heard this mentioned by a BA chappie on a late-night inbound. Again, I'm guessing on inbounds to EGLL from the north effectively turning onto a long base leg of 09L/R from Westcott, rather than having to route via BNN, hence "cutting the corner".
Hopefully I'm safe here. Mods - please don't move me to the ATC forum. I'm still in therapy from the last drubbing.
r
PS - just seen the archive on "The Westcott Snatch". Do I win a prize?
In the good old days, before 9/11, I was enjoying a jump seat ride in a BA 757 and captain was telling the FO about the Westcott Snatch just as we were descending past Bovingdon. He was saying that, in a 747, it was great fun and that you had to use a bit of idle reverse on two engines to avoid getting too fast..
I've since been told that that is impossible so it might have been a bit of B/S.
I've since been told that that is impossible so it might have been a bit of B/S.
Warning Toxic!
Disgusted of Tunbridge
Disgusted of Tunbridge
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pulse, it was indeed possible to do a snatch in a 747, but you had to be quick. You would be turning onto base at an altitude of 7000' or above. It required rapid extension of flap and a short wait to assess when to raise speedbrake or drop the gear, and to get down quickly. One had to judge before then the likelihood of it being permitted and whether the cabin preparations would be complete- it would only ever be offered at very quiet times, but just sometimes you detected there may be a possibility and I asked several times and occasionally got it.
You cannot use reverse in the air on a 747. It's a complicated, difficult system that gives trouble on the ground, operating it in the air is a real no no.
You cannot use reverse in the air on a 747. It's a complicated, difficult system that gives trouble on the ground, operating it in the air is a real no no.
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Yep - snatches from the south were as common as those from the north. Often, TMA would simply put traffic from the south on a direct heading for WOD..... then leave the transfer to London Approach late = lots of hands flying around over Blackbushe!
Glad to know tap-dancing went on at the Centre - lots of it in Approach too! And a lot of attempted whistling for similar reasons....
Glad to know tap-dancing went on at the Centre - lots of it in Approach too! And a lot of attempted whistling for similar reasons....