EVA Air 747 without nosegear at LHR
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I'm interested in the comment 'the nose gear pin sits on the gear door'. I would have said 'nonsense!' I look right up there and can see the place to put the pin, and a red streamer hangs off the pin. It don't rest on anything.
I gather there was a ground power truck under the nose, and it has eaten that as well. They got it raised fairly quickly.
I gather there was a ground power truck under the nose, and it has eaten that as well. They got it raised fairly quickly.
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The downlock pin for a 747 can be a "fishing pole" type. It is about 2m long with an actuating system to put a lock in place to stop the pin coming out. This prevents you from having to climb up into the bay to put the pin in. When installed it does rest on the trailing edge of the moveable doors, so it is possible that as the doors open the pin got caught on the doors and was pulled out, however, I would have thought that the lock should stop this from happening. I got told by someone who should know that the system had already been operated 5-6 times before it all went horribly wrong. There by the grace of God............
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"I got told by someone who should know that the system had already been operated 5-6 times before it all went horribly wrong. There by the grace of God............"
Good standard practice dictates that after upline checks are carried out, the gear pins should be magnafluxed to ensure no damage has been done during simulated "retraction". 5 or 6 times.........brave boys for mine.
Does anyone know if the NLG downlock pin " fell out " in one piece or was it sheared ?
Good standard practice dictates that after upline checks are carried out, the gear pins should be magnafluxed to ensure no damage has been done during simulated "retraction". 5 or 6 times.........brave boys for mine.
Does anyone know if the NLG downlock pin " fell out " in one piece or was it sheared ?
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why flap down - eva people said the aircraft inbound with hyd sys 1 leak. so it may be flaps they looking first and then landing gear... also said that r2 door / slide & rh forward belly gone wrong. any photo from the rh side spanner?
Usual disclaimers apply!
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Does anyone know if the NLG downlock pin " fell out " in one piece or was it sheared ?
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This is indeed a repeat perfomance, for another example see:
http://www.airdisaster.com/photos/nwsing/photo.shtml
Depsite what the caption says, in the SIN incident a gear pin was inserted but for some reason a Boeing gear pin was not available. Instead, a locally made part consisting of an Airbus gear pin welded to a handle was inserted into the nosegear. When hydraulics were powered part of the nose gear door cycled catching the handle and pulling the pin. A ground engineer underneath saw what was going to happen next and quickly departed the area, escaping injury.
http://www.airdisaster.com/photos/nwsing/photo.shtml
Depsite what the caption says, in the SIN incident a gear pin was inserted but for some reason a Boeing gear pin was not available. Instead, a locally made part consisting of an Airbus gear pin welded to a handle was inserted into the nosegear. When hydraulics were powered part of the nose gear door cycled catching the handle and pulling the pin. A ground engineer underneath saw what was going to happen next and quickly departed the area, escaping injury.
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The luck must have been on the engineers side many years ago when a simular incident occured on the Britannia (the whispering giant)
He was under the nose when the gear retracted, but the fin on its way up hit the ceiling (of BOAC's new wing hangars) and arrested the descent of the nose inches above the engineer.
In aviation every new generation makes the same mistakes. Every new manager finds new ways of reducing safety and saving money.
There should only be one set of gear pins. They should be stowed on the aircraft, and when needed used correctly. No engineer/ towtruck driver should be allowed "his own set".
There is absolutely no point in the flight deck checking the "pins are on board" if some other set is fitted below!
End of sermon...
He was under the nose when the gear retracted, but the fin on its way up hit the ceiling (of BOAC's new wing hangars) and arrested the descent of the nose inches above the engineer.
In aviation every new generation makes the same mistakes. Every new manager finds new ways of reducing safety and saving money.
There should only be one set of gear pins. They should be stowed on the aircraft, and when needed used correctly. No engineer/ towtruck driver should be allowed "his own set".
There is absolutely no point in the flight deck checking the "pins are on board" if some other set is fitted below!
End of sermon...
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In HKG during a wheel change, the local engineers, evidently not bothering to go up to the FD and get the pins, used some self made wire coathanger contraption instead. The F/E, doing his subsequent walkaround in the dark, missed this contraption and seeing no red flag in the high up lock in the dark, accepted the aeroplane. We spent a jolly hour flying around trying to get the main gear to move- it worked well! The poor F/E was thrashed within an inch of his job!
It's astonishing how familiarity breeds carelessness.
It's astonishing how familiarity breeds carelessness.
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Greatest story ever in Taipei.
A CI 747 also got bad damaged as someone tried to raise the landing gear with the gear pin not properly installed. The result was just like the EVA air 747 at LHR but........
To put the aircraft up again they used a kind of airbags which got slid under the nose of the aircraft an inflate causing the aircraft to raise. Problem was they overinflated the airbags.......
causing the aircraft to fell back on it's tail.....
Some people never learn.....
Marcel_MPH
A CI 747 also got bad damaged as someone tried to raise the landing gear with the gear pin not properly installed. The result was just like the EVA air 747 at LHR but........
To put the aircraft up again they used a kind of airbags which got slid under the nose of the aircraft an inflate causing the aircraft to raise. Problem was they overinflated the airbags.......
causing the aircraft to fell back on it's tail..... Some people never learn.....
Marcel_MPH
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My word Woodpecker, you've stirred some dormant memory cells!
Cycling around the LHR southern peri track one morning, to the old Comet hangars ( Terminal 4 now) ,I was very surprised to see the tail of a Hunting Clan Britannia sticking out through the roof - similar circumstances I believe.
Cycling around the LHR southern peri track one morning, to the old Comet hangars ( Terminal 4 now) ,I was very surprised to see the tail of a Hunting Clan Britannia sticking out through the roof - similar circumstances I believe.
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Word from the ROC is: 3 months AOG and +USD8M, without consequent loss of revenue, face, etc.
OOuch!
Marcel_MPH - your story is nearly correct, except that when the CI engineers overinflated the nose bag, and it was going to tip back on its arse, thankfully the hydraulic tail strut stand was under the right empennage which prevented the arse of this brand spanking shiney new B744 from hitting the ground. Unfortunately, the right tail fuel tank now had the tail stand sticking through it from bottom to top.
OOuch!
Marcel_MPH - your story is nearly correct, except that when the CI engineers overinflated the nose bag, and it was going to tip back on its arse, thankfully the hydraulic tail strut stand was under the right empennage which prevented the arse of this brand spanking shiney new B744 from hitting the ground. Unfortunately, the right tail fuel tank now had the tail stand sticking through it from bottom to top.
The rumour doing the rounds amongst BA engineers on Sunday was that the gear handle was indded cycled several times and at some point in the process the nose gear pin sheared.
wiggy
wiggy
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Weapons_Hot,
indeed you're right. The tail strut prevented the aircraft to go all way back on it's behind, unfortunately the impact of the aircraft going back caused the strut to be burried in the back.
Marcel_MPH
indeed you're right. The tail strut prevented the aircraft to go all way back on it's behind, unfortunately the impact of the aircraft going back caused the strut to be burried in the back.
Marcel_MPH
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The last 2 pictures give a good look on the strut inside the tail section.
Thanks to my close friend Frans for making these shots possible.
Marcel_MPH
Thanks to my close friend Frans for making these shots possible.
Marcel_MPH
Last edited by Marcel_MPH; 26th May 2004 at 15:00.
I'matightbastard
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Another dumb question: I don't know but I'm asuming the 747 is like the 737 and if you need to swing the gear, you jack the nose. How come inserting the jack isn't a backup safety feature in the SOP for this procedure? or for that matter put an airbag under the a/c. Relying on one pin seems a litle risky.
If the answer is that it'd be too expensive to have a jack on hand, well...
If the answer is that it'd be too expensive to have a jack on hand, well...