Thread Closed
 

It's being said more and more often here, and I believe that it's time the POWERS that be, start paying attention to it: I'm getting just a little tired of all the tiny padlocks and thread closed signs showing up here at pprune. The constant transfering of threads to other forums, and the notion that a question may not be asked in rumours and news, even if it's a question about a rumour or news, beats me. What are we running here, a one-party-state? Oh darn, a question. And it's not even about a rumour or news. I guess you'll have to move this one too! Or even better; why don't you just have the last word and then close the thread, Robert Mugabe?

Grow up. If we don't take the action we do with moving threads then really really interesting R&N threads can 'dissapear' onto page 2 within 30 mins at peak times.

We are a victim of our own success in many ways. You'll just have to learn to use the alternative forums as much as you like to use R&N.

As always we are open to suggestions on how to improve editorial control and decision making.

WWW

WWW, that might make some sense if you actually MOVED the threads you padlock, but you don't... you leave them sitting in R&N with a padlock and then replicate them on the target forum. The explanation as to what you have done is not at all obvious, which is why we waste so much bandwidth on "why has my thread been deleted?" threads. At the moment, you will go to page two of R&N just as quickly as if you had never "moved" it in the first place! It is still on R&N, just not ALL of it.

Why not put a note in the index page as to where it has gone, that would make it easier for everyone- or just re-direct the target of the thread title?

As it is at the moment, it is illogical and confusing...

WWW, your name implies that you need to do the growing up! I'm 6'3", no more growing up for me thanks. Secondly, I dont dispute that some threads (like this one) end up in the wrong forum. All I'm saying is move them if you have to, but do it logically. And STOP CENSORING this board!

Well I always post a note saying where the thread has been moved to and then move it and pdalock the original. If others don't then its by ommission. There is an automated feature for doing this in the pipeline or did I dream that it was working the other day already..? Danny?

WWW

RustyA300

I have an idea why don't you set up a free board using your own money, free time and effort. You can then allow people to clog it up with entirely inappropriate and often quite pointless threads.

Then the guys that run PPRuNe won't have to put up with the abuse and criticism that they currently have to put up with from those telling them how to spend their time and their money.

I disagree with your criticism and I suggest your tone leaves something to be desired.

M.Mouse - Clearly, you are but a child, still wet behind the ears. If you think that "own money" is financing this lot, then you have a lot to learn. What do you think all those ad's you're looking at are doing here? And why do you think the advertisers put them there in the first place? And do you think they would place them there if nobody frequented this site? Dream on China!

Furthermore, as you are entitled to an (all be it ill-informed) opinion, when one opens up a forum such as this pprune, then one had better get used to the idea that there will be criticism, good and bad, from the users. That's an ingrained principle of democracy if you hadn't noticed.

So, having completed printing out your post: I now sit in the smallest room in the house, I have your letter before me, soon I shall have it behind me!

As you can see, I am new to this site. Having looked around here for a couple of days, I must admit that I do agree with Rusty and Raw Data. Unless you've been skating these floors for some time already, all the closed threads can be quite confusing. Also, I would have thought that questions another Forum would be allowed in that forum instead of being "bannished" to the questions forum regardless?

What's the matter Rusty, can't afford any bog roll?

Keep it up and with any luck you'll soon head the way of the departed "Captain Ed".

What are you trying to say Down...? Is this the kind of site where a guy who is prepared to say his say, or stand up and be counted, has to fear being chucked out? If that is the case, turf me out with him!!!

You see now; you guys are slinging mud big-time, when my only point was (still is) that I thought that thread closing could be done a little less autocratically and a little more sensibly!?

Rusty A300,

I think you will find that PPRuNe advertising is there just to cover costs of running the site. I would be very very surprised if Danny etc. were making any money out of this site.

PPRuNe is run by people who volunteer their time and effort and provide the service at no charge to it’s users. As someone said in an earlier debate, it’s their sandcastle so they are entitled to run it how they choose.

If you are really that annoyed, go to another flying related Bulletin Board, or create your own and run it how you choose.

Have a good one, Dave.


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Flying is easy - just throw yourself at the ground and miss.

Dave -

Clearly you should go back and read what I said again. Why should I look for another board or start my own? What's that all about?Clearly a lot of people here take criticism too personally.

Am I only good enough to post on this board as long as I'm brown-nosing those who run it and saying the things that Dave likes hearing said?

If I were running this board I'd take criticism one of two ways; I'd either use it constructively, or I'd take it with a pinch of salt! I certainly wouldn't be threatening people who disagreed with me though.

A little touchy there huh, Dave Incompleto...?

You can tell exactly how well this site is run, and how many people feel it is well worth the effort by the number of subscribed members there are.

It is not a democracy. It is a privately-owned website. Danny and Co. make no money from it. They put their own time (unpaid) into running it. They have the right to censor it if they so wish.

If you have constructive suggestions to make about how it can be improved, I'm sure they would listen sympathetically. I have to admit, however, that I did not read the first post in this thread as constructive criticism.

Finally, if you don't like what goes on here, you still have a choice about coming here!

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Breeding Per Dementia Unto Something Jolly Big, Toodle-pip

I don’t care if people don’t agree with my viewpoint etc.

I do care when people take this bulletin board for granted, and believe they can post anything they want.

If you have been around here for a while, you would know that there have been numerous threats to close down Jet Blast, while Dunnunda an Godzone was shut down for a cooling off period because people thought they could post anything they wanted.

I’m not saying your initial suggestion was bad, (I too find the locked threads that don’t have an explanation a tad annoying), just don’t expect that the site will always be run how you want it to be run.

Have a good one, Dave.


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Flying is easy - just throw yourself at the ground and miss.

Dave, your point is redundant. If you have something to say, by all means do so. But don't accuse me of wanting "the site run how I want it run." I reiterate: go back and read my postings again. I'm sure you'll find there's nothing offensive or selfish about them at all.

A wise man speaks because he has something to say.
A fool speaks because he has to say something.

Rusty. I have read all of your posts on this thread, and, with the exception (possibly) of one, you have managed to be aggresive/insulting in each one. Re-read them if you don't believe me - but I am entitled to an opinion!
You ask in your first post "are we running a one party state" (or words to that effect). Two points come out of that.
1. "We" are not running anything - Danny and his team are
2. Yes, if you want to put it that way. Danny owns the site, Danny decides how the site is run. Posts on the wrong forum are padlocked and moved. Thats the way it is. Just like the bills go to danny's house, as do any legal stuff when peopole have said the wrong thing (yes, Danny has been threatened many times). So, now you know how it is, we can all get on with PPRuNe in the way the owner wants it run. Can't we?

I'd like to point you two bodyguards in the direction of the Guestbook on this Board. It reads; "Visitors Book

Please take a few moments to fill out this form and provide some details so I can keep this site to your liking." With those words, I'm sure the owners do not expect me to agree with everything they do, nor do I believe that they will object as vociferously as the two of you.

PS: You've read all 50 odd of my postings? You following me or do you just like me a lot?

Rusty

If you were genuine you'd have been deleted (not moved/padlocked) in about 10 minutes.

WARNING. This is a fishing expedition to see who supports 'Rusty' (almost certainly an anagram of captainpprune - yes the very same!!!!)

;)

Rusty A300,

How about these?

Have a good one, Dave.

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Flying is easy - just throw yourself at the ground and miss.



[This message has been edited by Dave Incognito (edited 18 June 2001).]

Interestingly Rusty, you do not respond to a single point i made. I have read all your posts ON THIS THREAD.

And i stand by what i wrote about your style of posting

Rusty A300

Really ?? This next quote might seem a tad offensive to some who give up their time and effort to keep the board running the best they can for the benefit of everyone. Especially to those of us with links to Zimbabwe.

For every one who complains about the locking of threads, we have at least another one (and probably a lot more) who take the trouble to e-mail the crew at Admin and tell us how they feel the Rumours & News Board is being diluted by irrelevant threads. What was the registration of the rusty A300 at Kinshasha ? Which is best, Airbus or Boeing ? That sort of thing. These questions can quite clearly be answered by the people on PPRuNe, however they ain't necessarily Rumours nor News, so they get moved to a Forum more in keeping with their genre. The vast majority have asked for a focused R&N Forum and (by listening to them), that's what we try to achieve. We're not foolish enough to think that we are 100% successful, but by and large things get moved for a good reason. As you can read on other threads, quite often this is done quickly, or when suffering from jet lag, and laborious explanations are not always provided as to the reason for the move. That, unfortunately, is sometimes the only way that the moderators can get through the entire site and have at least some semblance of a social life.

I take RD's point about moving the threads lock, stock, and barrel as a possible way forward. The only potential downside is more threads from people saying 'Where's my thread gone ?' ;) That could be solved by his suggestion of re-directing and it sounds good to me if it can be automated. I certainly don't want to start having to write out the new URL manually. Perhaps PPRuNe Dispatcher can come up with some clever solution to that one.

Bonaero

I think you'll find that we don't throw people out just because they disagree with us, that's not against the rules of the site. The very few that we have thrown out have been for things like posting links to porn sites or inciting racism or intolerance. Differences of opinion are inevitable, that's life. Indeed, it would all be a bit sterile if there wasn't two sides to most of the things we see here on PPRuNe.


Comments are always welcome, though please don't be too offended if we don't always agree with them. That's OUR part of this democracy. And everyone has the ultimate freedom of choice in visiting the site. Nobody is forced to stay, but nor are they forced to leave.


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PPRuNe Radar
ATC Forum Moderator
[email protected]

Radar, "links to Zimbabwe" - Those of us, 3rd generation, born and resident in Zimbabwe feel entitled to make derogatory statements abot BOB.

The rest of you that are shouting at me:
As far as what has and has not been said so far is concerned; each to his own is my opinion. Clearly some of my statements have burned a little. But each and every one of you rose to the occassion. That, I believe, points to the fact that I have a valid point. If you want to critisise me, it can be only for my approach, I believe. For the landing; it was perfect!

My sarcasm with regard to this thread has clearly got more than one person thinking.

Mission Accomplished.

<Round of applause for PPRuNe Radar>

Rusty - as I closed my post with:

"As always we are open to suggestions on how to improve editorial control and decision making"

I can't see that you have any real grounds for complaint. You've made a criticism, the Admins have heard it and responded, in the future we will re-double our efforts to ensure that pointers are left to guide people to moved threads. All this happened within 24 hrs of your complaint.

You've been given a reasoned explanation of WHY threads are moved and we've tried to justify and qualify that explanation.

Please do not equate those that run PPRuNe to Mugabe, we have thick skins, but such a comparison is frankly repellant on many levels.

I can atest to the fact that PPRuNe COSTS mney for those that run it or are you going to pay my BT Internet bill this month?

How about a little bit of professional courtesy here - we are not in a cockpit but perhaps a private email to the PPRuNe Admins/Moderators would have been equally effective and have avoided this whole slangin match thread... Something to use as a discussion point at your next CRM day???

Cheers now,

WWW

Of course you are. In which case you'll entirely understand that comparing the PPRuNe team to him not only stretches the imagination, but is also insulting us deeply.

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PPRuNe Radar
ATC Forum Moderator
[email protected]

Yeah, comparing you to Bob was going too far. I apologise, sincerely!

At present (17:40 GMT) on page 1 of R & N there is 1 padlock, on page 2 there ar 7, page 3 has 9 and page 4 has 10, not to mention 16 on page 6.

Thank You.

Boy its a full moon tonight. I like the idea RawData mentioned.....Just redirect the topic to the appropriate target. The padlock is intimidating until you realize that the post is not deleted, just placed in another forum. Maybe we could avoid it altogether. better than a padlock icon would be one that said "moved" OR just do nothing and redirect the reader to the other forum automatically. A quick note could be flashed (much like the one, "thank you for your post...you will be redirected back to the forum in 5 seconds etc etc")politely stating that "you are being redirected to the forum considered most suitable for this topic". This would leave no questions and should cause no undue anxiety. It would create better awareness in the relation of topic to forum. So how bout it?
There is nothing wrong with this site. This one little thing could use some tweaking though. If only for newer members.

Hey Rusty,

How about jumping in with both feet? Then throw a few insults around and top it off with a chip on each shoulder.

I'm sure you wouldn't act like this on the flight deck so why do it here?

Personally I couldn't care less which forum a post appears on. Life's too short.

:) Why not give Rusty 20 minutes to put his argument forward at the next bash! If we like what he says, we buy his ale for the rest of the evening, if we don't; he buys the biggest round it's ever been his misfortune to suffer. :)
It'll take Don King to organise it, but should be worth it http://www.pprune.org/ubb/NonCGI/tongue.gif http://www.pprune.org/ubb/NonCGI/tongue.gif http://www.pprune.org/ubb/NonCGI/tongue.gif


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It wasn't me.

BigJETS - Thank you for a constructive input to this issue. IMHO (speaking here as a fellow PPRuNe member, not as an admin) you have a very good suggestion regarding a "moved" sign versus a "locked" icon.

Perhaps the more we concentrate on possible solutions, rather than the trade of verbal daggers, we can actually accomplish something here. Sarcasm doesn't accomplish a mission -- it only dilutes an argument and "pushes buttons" which distract from the main objective.

[This message has been edited by McD (edited 18 June 2001).]

Flintstone -

Do you mean the way you just did?

You are rather obviously a well balanced individual are you not?

Once I've posted 848 times, will I also become a hypocritical dingbat?

Hey Spoonbill, that is a FANTASTIC idea! Can we hold it down here at Charles Prince (outside Harare) or at the East African Flying Club up in Wilson, Nairobi? That way we get COLD beer, and we don't have to drink it where the sun don't shine.

Well Bonaero I've looked again at my posting and I can't see where I've insulted anyone, unlike m'learned friend Rusty.

Oh, and you.

[This message has been edited by Flintstone (edited 18 June 2001).]

Girls girls girls........With these handbags at ten paces......you'll get this thread closed!!!!

:)

C.N.

Well, speaking as one of the "Gang-of-Four" in green at the top of R and N, there is some good constructive debate in this one, in between the comparisons to despots.

I'll try my best to provide a link to any thread moved in the future, something I already try to do when closing down a duplicate (in that case, a link to the original, particularly if it has vanished back a few pages.) I say try because it takes time, something I for one don't always have an abundance of. But where I can do it, I will endeavour to do it from now on for those threads I choose to move. Fair?

Everyone else has a part to play in this too, so please help US out by only posting bonafide rumours or news concerning the "Professional" aviation world to this the headline site. If it's a question, put it in Questions; if it's a plea for help with training or 'sussing' out a potential employer, then Wannabes, Terms and Endearment, or the appropriate regional forum may be the best bet etc, etc, etc.

It would be preferable to have a system like the one suggested where either a link was auto-created, either from the closed thread or the front page of the board. Indeed, I asked a while back if such a facility existed to allow a new duplicate thread with responses to be absorbed into the body of an existing one. Unfortunately, it would take some seriously deep scripting in the bowels of the UBB program itself (so I'm told!) so is not viable at the moment. The idea of a "moved" icon is excellent, and will certainly go on the wishlist.

All criticism good or bad accepted, and will be acted upon where possible (time permitting.) This is the finest site for aviation bar none, and would be nothing without the wide and varied contributions from all corners of the globe.

Now, I'm closing this one down....

......only joking, no I'm not! ;)

Sick Squid
Rumours and News Moderator

(Typing this in a ten-minute break between A320 Electrical Abnormal Operation A and Abnormal Operation B. Back to the conversion course now.....after editing the spelling mistakes!)




[This message has been edited by Sick Squid (edited 18 June 2001).]

Troll Alert!! http://www.stopstart.fsnet.co.uk/mica/MiscAlert.gif

RustyA300 This thread has to be one of the best 'fishing' threads I've seen on PPRuNe for a while! Nice one!! :)
http://www.stopstart.fsnet.co.uk/mica/fishead.gif

OzPax1 http://www.stopstart.fsnet.co.uk/aircraft/busypig.gif

Spoobill! The next bash! Don 'Who' to organise it? My friend PPP would not like that!

Hey Oz, Thanks mate. It doesn't come easy you know. I work at it day and night to get it down to the perfection of this one.

Now, who can I insult next...?

Only kidding! Goodness me. I hadn't even posted this one and already I could hear the online phsycho's analysing me in preparation of their 6 millionth post!

And what's more, we can spell 'psycho' ;)