South Asia and the Far East News and views on the fast growing and changing aviation scene on the planet.

China ... has turned

Old 11th Jan 2020, 13:45
  #1 (permalink)  
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China ... has turned

Well its seems that the market in China has gone bust to expats.

China Eastern in Nov said they will not renew any foreign Capts.

Most ex-pats in China are with some part of HNA Group and they have been having issues for ages.

Now Yangsee River (Suprama) has let go all expats,
HNA now paying ex-pats on local terms
BCA new contract is sign it, or we put you in the sim for a check.
West Air new contract with paycut
Guillin no recruitment and letting go
Lucky getting rid of all A320s.... what next

Chengdu .. not recruited for a year
Sichuan .. no recruitment.
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Old 11th Jan 2020, 18:28
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Iím a victim too. Lost my job along with more than half the foreigners at my HNA airline.

The ones that are left are the last weíll see of foreign pilots in China. Maybe a couple of years remain for the few that are left.
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Old 12th Jan 2020, 06:14
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Why is this happening? Itís a very sudden change... Can they just change your contracts when they please?
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Old 12th Jan 2020, 07:42
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Originally Posted by Fred4000 View Post
Why is this happening? Itís a very sudden change... Can they just change your contracts when they please?
yes, apparently.

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Old 12th Jan 2020, 08:44
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Tianjin, not recruiting, waiting for financial bailout, considering options
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Old 12th Jan 2020, 14:18
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Any idea about China Southern?
They seemed to have hired plenty of expats over recent years.
Are they letting their expat pilots go too, or reducing T&C's?
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Old 12th Jan 2020, 14:51
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Originally Posted by LongTimeInCX View Post
Any idea about China Southern?
They seemed to have hired plenty of expats over recent years.
Are they letting their expat pilots go too, or reducing T&C's?
No info so far. Although they donít seem at all worried when guys resign, which is happening a great deal recently.

They did however stop recruiting NTR pilots from January which was pretty unexpected given that the majority of the guys joining were actually NTR. That says something I believe.

Some agents have said they are expecting some Ďbig newsí(whatever that means) after CNY so watch this space......

Last edited by mach85; 12th Jan 2020 at 15:59.
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Old 13th Jan 2020, 08:17
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BCA, which used to be one of better companies, I am understood to have told pilots that they sign new contract or get a sim ride !

CSA, always offered NTR but them most guys left after failing or realised that they were going to be a Cruise captain for a min of 3 years. The poster boys Aussies are long term and been there decades, it changed for new joiners.
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Old 14th Jan 2020, 01:42
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China Eastern in Nov said they will not renew any foreign Capts.

No such announcement was made at all. The only change was a age 60 retirement for foreigners is now in effect.
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No change to contracts and or working Conditons either.... HNA group has been suffering alot financially that encompasses many of the airlines listed in the thread and could explain why many are changing T and C.

CES has not recruited in three years and not replaced anyone who has left in that time.

There is no message that we are not needed but we are not being replaced. So go figure...
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The only thing constant about China is change.
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Old 14th Jan 2020, 07:05
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There is a lot of weirdness and strangeness about Chinese aviation and airline practices but every day I hear a lot of unsubstantiated and child-like BS rumors about what is happening in China..One guy gets the chop at some stage of the recruitment or renewal process and that gets translated as some big hoohaa coming to bite the rest of us in the ass. "Oh, but he was a trainer in Europe!" "oh but he has 20,000 hours" or "he was such a nice guy, If they fired him they will fire us!". It doesn't matter, he had a bad day, and it was game over. A certain demographic of foreign pilots with their big circle always finds something to moan and and create negativity about. I've seen it first hand. Several agencies are still hiring for at least 4 different Chinese companies as we speak. They are renewing their adverts on many sites including FlightGlobal.com
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Old 14th Jan 2020, 09:51
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Originally Posted by CW247 View Post
There is a lot of weirdness and strangeness about Chinese aviation and airline practices but every day I hear a lot of unsubstantiated and child-like BS rumors about what is happening in China..One guy gets the chop at some stage of the recruitment or renewal process and that gets translated as some big hoohaa coming to bite the rest of us in the ass. "Oh, but he was a trainer in Europe!" "oh but he has 20,000 hours" or "he was such a nice guy, If they fired him they will fire us!". It doesn't matter, he had a bad day, and it was game over. A certain demographic of foreign pilots with their big circle always finds something to moan and and create negativity about. I've seen it first hand. Several agencies are still hiring for at least 4 different Chinese companies as we speak. They are renewing their adverts on many sites including FlightGlobal.com

There would in fact appear to be many inaccuracies in the original post......

As the post above said, no such memo sent in CEA stating they wonít renew any expats.
Nobody in HNA yet on local contracts.......only talk.
Sichuan airlines actively hiring apparently.
Suparna still have expats actively flying.

So China might be a quirky place but as CW said, lets try and stick to the facts.

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Old 14th Jan 2020, 10:06
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SPEAK TO Guys at China eastern, maybe not an announcement but being let go and no renewals.

CSA has recruits in last 3 years, and has had many failures.

BCA pilots told sign new contract or face consequences

WA new contract , pilots being forced onto with loss up to $38k per annum.

sichuan claim to be recruiting but have not done so.

adverts by agencies mean nothing, and many offer what is not there to attract when in fact there are no jobs.

facts ....
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Old 14th Jan 2020, 10:07
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Suprama, pilots told to sign local contract or go by 31 Dec.
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Old 14th Jan 2020, 12:13
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Originally Posted by Xi Ping View Post
SPEAK TO Guys at China eastern, maybe not an announcement but being let go and no renewals.

CSA has recruits in last 3 years, and has had many failures.

BCA pilots told sign new contract or face consequences

WA new contract , pilots being forced onto with loss up to $38k per annum.

sichuan claim to be recruiting but have not done so.

adverts by agencies mean nothing, and many offer what is not there to attract when in fact there are no jobs.

facts ....
I personally know someone who has been invited for a Sichuan interview last month.
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Old 14th Jan 2020, 18:53
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S speed, good that Sichuan invited Your friend last month. Tell me when Your friend will start training. I was invited long time ago also....
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Old 14th Jan 2020, 20:10
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As always take rumours with a pinch of salt, advertising jobs and being invited is not a good indication of actual hiring in China. They do this constantly with guys having big delays during the process or in some cases cancelling of start dates. In China anything and everything can happen at their discretion at any start of the process.
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Old 14th Jan 2020, 21:36
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China has definitely turned: on the list of airlines not hiring anymore don't forget Xiamen Air, which was one of the biggest in terms of expats community.

As mach85 said, CSA stopped recruiting NTRs...how many rated guys will they get now? doesn't seems to be a problem for them since they keep failing people (even at initial type ratings) and they do nothing to stop pilots from resign. The rsp deal is basically over (especially on 777fleet) with no new assignment even with plenty "official" slots available.

Talking with a famous recruiter, I was told that a (named here) airline will get rid of foreigners over the next 12months or so.

Having said that, we all know that market in China is very unstable and everything can change again very rapidly... since most of the time those massive recruitments are even based on market figures, but on personal decisions of some so called "leader / manager".
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Old 14th Jan 2020, 22:53
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Had a few pints with a good friend last night that is now at CSA, he said no hiring and guys are not only leaving, but also failed left and right on medicals and sim checks! He described it as a minefield where you are just waiting your turn to trigger the next mine! It's incredible that they are so shortsighted (well, not really) if they want to continue the growth of their aviation market it's not the most intelligent policy to react on market outlooks for the next 90 days, they should be looking ahead at the next decade!
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Old 15th Jan 2020, 17:28
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Originally Posted by Xi Ping View Post
SPEAK TO Guys at China eastern, maybe not an announcement but being let go and no renewals.

CSA has recruits in last 3 years, and has had many failures.

BCA pilots told sign new contract or face consequences

WA new contract , pilots being forced onto with loss up to $38k per annum.

sichuan claim to be recruiting but have not done so.

adverts by agencies mean nothing, and many offer what is not there to attract when in fact there are no jobs.

facts ....

I am at China Eastern... No one had been let go.
One guy quit recently he had enough and left on his own accord and is in fact looking at transferring to CS.

The onky people not renewed were and are the 60 Yr old guys.. And it was never truly guaranteed they could work past that when they all accepted the job so there is no reason to make a deal out of that

MR chairman I must ask what's your vested interest in all of this?



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Old 1st Feb 2020, 08:50
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Originally Posted by CW247 View Post
No comments here about the latest Chinese health pandemic. What are people experiencing at their company? Any rumors about what your company will do with foreigners or even locals due to the upcoming decline in airline travel? I know it's too soon but I think for many of us who just joined, it's obvious. Being at the bottom of the list I fear for my future here. Any thoughts of your own?
My guess is that this will decimate the Chinese Airline industry as more and more flights are cancelled. Expats will be the first to go if there are staff cuts. That seems inevitable at this point imho.

Given the deteriorating situation in China - I'd be on the first flight out if I was working there.

I wouldn't want to get stuck in China and the options to leave are getting less every day.
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