Most dangerous carriers in Indonesia and the Philippines?
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Most dangerous carriers in Indonesia and the Philippines?
Hello again PPRune,
I'm the investigative journalist who posted in another forum here looking for any info, leads or sources I could find on possibly dangerous airlines that are getting their planes--or did get their planes (in the case of Adam Air)--from American lessors. Since a lot of my focus has been on Indonesia and the Philippines and those carriers that are banned from EU airspace, I thought I'd drop into this forum and say hello. The knowledge here has been really instructive as I try to get a handle on this industry and region.
For this leg of my investigation, I'm looking at the safety records of particular companies, and I thought I'd see if anyone here, on or off the record, might be able to put me in touch with people who've had first-hand experience with these airlines. I am eager to have first-hand intelligence in my work that hasn't been filtered through various corporate and political interests. The companies I've been focusing on are these:
Lion, Merpati, Sriwijaya, Batavia, Air Asia, Wings, Adam Air, Cebu Pacific, Seair, Philippine Airlines and AirPhil Express. I'm curious about Garuda and Citilink as well, though they're exempted from the blacklist. These are simply my focus for now, as I've had to start with hard data from EU, ICAO, FAA, etc.
I'm also looking at a handful of carriers in Pakistan, Zambia, Afghanistan, Gabon, and other places, but the largest concentration of American planes flying for EU-banned carriers are in Indonesia and the Philippines. If anyone here is interested in talking to me about the safety of these companies (or wants to pass my contact info to people who might be interested in helping me, confidentially or on the record), please do get in touch! Thanks in advance for your time.
-Rin Kelly
Fellow, Stabile Center for Investigative Journalism
[email protected]
I'm the investigative journalist who posted in another forum here looking for any info, leads or sources I could find on possibly dangerous airlines that are getting their planes--or did get their planes (in the case of Adam Air)--from American lessors. Since a lot of my focus has been on Indonesia and the Philippines and those carriers that are banned from EU airspace, I thought I'd drop into this forum and say hello. The knowledge here has been really instructive as I try to get a handle on this industry and region.
For this leg of my investigation, I'm looking at the safety records of particular companies, and I thought I'd see if anyone here, on or off the record, might be able to put me in touch with people who've had first-hand experience with these airlines. I am eager to have first-hand intelligence in my work that hasn't been filtered through various corporate and political interests. The companies I've been focusing on are these:
Lion, Merpati, Sriwijaya, Batavia, Air Asia, Wings, Adam Air, Cebu Pacific, Seair, Philippine Airlines and AirPhil Express. I'm curious about Garuda and Citilink as well, though they're exempted from the blacklist. These are simply my focus for now, as I've had to start with hard data from EU, ICAO, FAA, etc.
I'm also looking at a handful of carriers in Pakistan, Zambia, Afghanistan, Gabon, and other places, but the largest concentration of American planes flying for EU-banned carriers are in Indonesia and the Philippines. If anyone here is interested in talking to me about the safety of these companies (or wants to pass my contact info to people who might be interested in helping me, confidentially or on the record), please do get in touch! Thanks in advance for your time.
-Rin Kelly
Fellow, Stabile Center for Investigative Journalism
[email protected]
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With all due respect, you are really opening up a can of worms....
Don't just look at the EU black list, have a look at the countries you have selected and the CULTURE that it presents.
Consider the terrain and minimal navaids that surround these airstrips/airports? Most are non precision approaches as opposed to the nice and comfortable precision approaches into a well fenced off airport.
Also don't forget the wet season/monsoonal seasons and wild life and people that ponder around landing zones whilst on a non precision approach.
With regards to the American lessors, can you expand on that?
Who says the airlines in Indonesia and the Philippines are dangerous....Pprune posters?
Go to the NTSB website in the USA, Australia, South America, Africa, South Africa, Europe and have a really good look at the statistics of FATAL crashes. I can assure you it is spread all over the world and it is not concentrated in SE Asia...We are humans and 70% of these are human error.
You mention Garuda Airlines exempt from the blacklist but only 5 years ago on the 7th of march 20 people were killed. But hey, they are not on the EU black list
As mentioned, you are really opening up a can of worms, especially on pprune.
Move On.
Don't just look at the EU black list, have a look at the countries you have selected and the CULTURE that it presents.
Consider the terrain and minimal navaids that surround these airstrips/airports? Most are non precision approaches as opposed to the nice and comfortable precision approaches into a well fenced off airport.
Also don't forget the wet season/monsoonal seasons and wild life and people that ponder around landing zones whilst on a non precision approach.
With regards to the American lessors, can you expand on that?
Who says the airlines in Indonesia and the Philippines are dangerous....Pprune posters?
Go to the NTSB website in the USA, Australia, South America, Africa, South Africa, Europe and have a really good look at the statistics of FATAL crashes. I can assure you it is spread all over the world and it is not concentrated in SE Asia...We are humans and 70% of these are human error.
You mention Garuda Airlines exempt from the blacklist but only 5 years ago on the 7th of march 20 people were killed. But hey, they are not on the EU black list
As mentioned, you are really opening up a can of worms, especially on pprune.
Move On.
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An investigative journalist is that... one that investigates. Perhaps you should take the time to travel to Indonesia and experience, at first hand, not only life in the country, but attache yourself to employees of various carriers of Indonesia. It will reduce flame bait posts. In addition, your first hand experiences and information will be far more accurate... wouldn't you agree?
You can check data bases for incidents and accidents, as that is a good start, however, you need to look further into the dynamics, the corporate ethos, and management of each carrier, including dissecting each department within it's carriers operates.
I don't think an objective hypothesis can be drawn with comments, alone from comment boards alone. An investigative journalist, validated all information before committing it to print in order to maintain their professional integrity rather than creating unnecessary hype. Many journos in the past, perhaps with the finest intentions, have cocked up whole thing by taking short cuts or just printing words to print words.
Good hunting, good luck, lets see, an article in a format, to quote the New York times "All the News That's fit to Print"
.
Correct me if I'm wrong Move on... but I think that the only airport that Garuda is able to operate in the EU is AMS?
You can check data bases for incidents and accidents, as that is a good start, however, you need to look further into the dynamics, the corporate ethos, and management of each carrier, including dissecting each department within it's carriers operates.
I don't think an objective hypothesis can be drawn with comments, alone from comment boards alone. An investigative journalist, validated all information before committing it to print in order to maintain their professional integrity rather than creating unnecessary hype. Many journos in the past, perhaps with the finest intentions, have cocked up whole thing by taking short cuts or just printing words to print words.
Good hunting, good luck, lets see, an article in a format, to quote the New York times "All the News That's fit to Print"
.Correct me if I'm wrong Move on... but I think that the only airport that Garuda is able to operate in the EU is AMS?
Last edited by captjns; 6th Apr 2012 at 22:35.
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sriwijaya
if you are trying to investigate about airlines in Indonesia you should start from the sistem and from the corruption that characterizes this market in this country.
i have a very nice experience about that,with chief pilot of company asking money for a right seat,and if somebody wants it i have everything documented!
I'm trying to warn peoeple abut paying money to fly,expecially with SRIWIJAYA,wich is one of the most corrupted airline,even more than LION AIR,and his composed by people that are only looking for young pilots ready to pay for a right seat that they will never achive....my experience in there was really bad and i would like that everybody know how it works...if there is some journalist interested to this story i have some nice document wich will show the FLIGHT OPERATIONAL MANAGER asking to me and my collegue money for a job!
Just let me know!
i have a very nice experience about that,with chief pilot of company asking money for a right seat,and if somebody wants it i have everything documented!
I'm trying to warn peoeple abut paying money to fly,expecially with SRIWIJAYA,wich is one of the most corrupted airline,even more than LION AIR,and his composed by people that are only looking for young pilots ready to pay for a right seat that they will never achive....my experience in there was really bad and i would like that everybody know how it works...if there is some journalist interested to this story i have some nice document wich will show the FLIGHT OPERATIONAL MANAGER asking to me and my collegue money for a job!
Just let me know!
