ASA and KINGFISHER kill dreams of indian trainee pilots
Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: lakshdweep
Age: 36
Posts: 127
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
ASA and KINGFISHER kill dreams of indian trainee pilots
hi guys yesterday ASA told there india tranee pilots which r under cadet pilot scheme of kingfisher to pack there bags and go back home because ASA facing finencial problem and will shut off soon ,now what those student going to do and will any action be taken by kingfisher or not in this regard because those student pay a lot of money through bank loan and how will they be able to pay that back .they ask for help from indian goverment in this regard and its our AVIATION PEOPLE duty to help them in solving problem so pls if there any one from kingfisher airline reding this thread ask from your HR to help them and what going to be there carrier in future ???????????????????????????????????????????????????????????? ?
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Auckland NZ
Age: 65
Posts: 25
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Hi Shuchim,
I am sorry to hear about this as you say a lot of student pilots have lost a lot of money without obtaining a qualification. I am not sure what the agreement is between the students and Kingfisher? At the present time Kingfisher is loosing a lot of money, reducing routes with the likely delay of the international or cancellation all together of the start of international operations. To put it into perspective I think the currently employed qualified pilots should be worried about their jobs, not just those at ASA.
Indian student pilots have had a good run over the last 3 years going from not flying an aircraft at all and then 12 months later being in the right seat of an A320 or B737 with 250 hours total. The bubble had to burst sooner or later! It has burst unfortunately.
The world economy has been on the down for some time now, this hasn't happened overnight! Increasing ATF prices pushing up operating costs which in turn push up the ticket cost to the passenger with the net result of less people flying and the airlines loosing more money.
The airlines have to reduce capacity and reduce the amount of seats they offer on a daily basis to increase their load factors to try and make a profit.
At the end of the day if you pay an organization a lot of money up front prior to obtaining your completed training, it is a large risk! Especially in the world of aviation, with a general aviation organization the risk is even higher.
I also think that people over the last 12 months have had a good indication of this day coming and should have been more cautious and not proceeded with pilot training. I know hind site is great but the indications have been there.
I do hope something is sorted out for these student pilots as it will be a great loss for them. Unfortunately this is life and reality.
I am sorry to hear about this as you say a lot of student pilots have lost a lot of money without obtaining a qualification. I am not sure what the agreement is between the students and Kingfisher? At the present time Kingfisher is loosing a lot of money, reducing routes with the likely delay of the international or cancellation all together of the start of international operations. To put it into perspective I think the currently employed qualified pilots should be worried about their jobs, not just those at ASA.
Indian student pilots have had a good run over the last 3 years going from not flying an aircraft at all and then 12 months later being in the right seat of an A320 or B737 with 250 hours total. The bubble had to burst sooner or later! It has burst unfortunately.
The world economy has been on the down for some time now, this hasn't happened overnight! Increasing ATF prices pushing up operating costs which in turn push up the ticket cost to the passenger with the net result of less people flying and the airlines loosing more money.
The airlines have to reduce capacity and reduce the amount of seats they offer on a daily basis to increase their load factors to try and make a profit.
At the end of the day if you pay an organization a lot of money up front prior to obtaining your completed training, it is a large risk! Especially in the world of aviation, with a general aviation organization the risk is even higher.
I also think that people over the last 12 months have had a good indication of this day coming and should have been more cautious and not proceeded with pilot training. I know hind site is great but the indications have been there.
I do hope something is sorted out for these student pilots as it will be a great loss for them. Unfortunately this is life and reality.
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: here there every where...
Posts: 51
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
That's AVIATION for you
well said C433....
All you youngies...out there who are keen on becoming an Airline pilot!!!!!
GET OUT...!!!!!...it was a hipe, now its gone...
...please go back to uni do something else...
Its cost too much....to get the "ticket"... when the economy sneezes....the "Airline" catches a COLD and a FEVER
Sorry to hear to those effected BY ASA....
Good luck to everyone....
All you youngies...out there who are keen on becoming an Airline pilot!!!!!
GET OUT...!!!!!...it was a hipe, now its gone...
...please go back to uni do something else...Its cost too much....to get the "ticket"... when the economy sneezes....the "Airline" catches a COLD and a FEVER
Sorry to hear to those effected BY ASA....
Good luck to everyone....
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Mumbai
Posts: 26
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
after the article was published in Times of India, dated 27th Nov I did some research of my own. I now understand that Kingfisher KFA is not in any relationship with ASA. There was a agreement earlier where in KFA was supposed to give an interview chance to some ASA students, but the agreement was broken in 2007.
Times of India is known to report wrongly and sensationalize issues for the heck of it, they are good for page -3 reporting as of today. i am not trying to defend Kingfisher in this and students need to keep their eyes open before choosing a flying school.
ASA had a horrible reputation with it being asked for closure in 2007 also. It didnt have a valid business insurance i.e. its aircraft were flying un insured. Also the promoter a certian Mr. Singh overstayed in US after his flying in 1995, he is romored to be running this school as an illegal alien.
In some of his interviews he has claimed his schools problems to arise from 'indian agents' making off with his money and at some other places the students who complained about ASA as students being not qualified enough to fly.
ASA was running a huge racket in the name of flying. if you want you can check the website for yourselves and take a look at the unprofessional language and spelling mistakes to start with.
Times of India is known to report wrongly and sensationalize issues for the heck of it, they are good for page -3 reporting as of today. i am not trying to defend Kingfisher in this and students need to keep their eyes open before choosing a flying school.
ASA had a horrible reputation with it being asked for closure in 2007 also. It didnt have a valid business insurance i.e. its aircraft were flying un insured. Also the promoter a certian Mr. Singh overstayed in US after his flying in 1995, he is romored to be running this school as an illegal alien.
In some of his interviews he has claimed his schools problems to arise from 'indian agents' making off with his money and at some other places the students who complained about ASA as students being not qualified enough to fly.
ASA was running a huge racket in the name of flying. if you want you can check the website for yourselves and take a look at the unprofessional language and spelling mistakes to start with.
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: usa
Posts: 169
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
American School of Aviation
Indian pilot trainees duped by US aviation school - Sify.com
IndiaPost.com - Californian aviation school ousts Indian trainees
The Telegraph - Calcutta (Kolkata) | Nation | California ‘Prince’ dupes aspiring pilots
TIMESNOW.tv - Latest Breaking News, Big News Stories, News Videos -
IndiaPost.com - Californian aviation school ousts Indian trainees
The Telegraph - Calcutta (Kolkata) | Nation | California ‘Prince’ dupes aspiring pilots
TIMESNOW.tv - Latest Breaking News, Big News Stories, News Videos -
Last edited by flightknight; 30th Jun 2008 at 15:33. Reason: add
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: usa
Posts: 169
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
ASA followup
ASA is a company that has had a long history of shady business practices. This company was always run by a group of shady businessmen. The aviation world is pretty small and bad news gets around and that is the reason why there were very few LOCAL pilot trainees at the flight school.
The best measure of a pt 141 flight academy is its LOCAL clientele, not the excessive amount of foreign students. "The students who choose these schools bear some responsibility". The information and resources available on the internet regarding flight schools is extensive and ample research should have been done before plunking down tens of thousands of dollars of your parents finances.
Furthermore, the school has several airline logos on its website. Those airlines have no obligation of recruitment unless there is a cadet-pilot agreement between the airline and pilot trainee. If you do have a written agreement with KFA, then mail them at Contact Us
Spoonfeed to get your money back:
1. File a class action lawsuit.
2. File a report with
Fresno: Home
3. Don't be intimidated by these crooks telling you that they have political and business contacts in your native country.
4. If you're going to become a Professional Pilot, than stop whining and research and fight for your money. No one is going to spoon feed you in this industry.
5. Contact the FAA with your complaints
FAA - Home
6. Contact the local government officials in Atwater, CA
City of Atwater
7. Contact the IRS.
Internal Revenue Service
The best measure of a pt 141 flight academy is its LOCAL clientele, not the excessive amount of foreign students. "The students who choose these schools bear some responsibility". The information and resources available on the internet regarding flight schools is extensive and ample research should have been done before plunking down tens of thousands of dollars of your parents finances.
Furthermore, the school has several airline logos on its website. Those airlines have no obligation of recruitment unless there is a cadet-pilot agreement between the airline and pilot trainee. If you do have a written agreement with KFA, then mail them at Contact Us
Spoonfeed to get your money back:
1. File a class action lawsuit.
2. File a report with
Fresno: Home
3. Don't be intimidated by these crooks telling you that they have political and business contacts in your native country.
4. If you're going to become a Professional Pilot, than stop whining and research and fight for your money. No one is going to spoon feed you in this industry.
5. Contact the FAA with your complaints
FAA - Home
6. Contact the local government officials in Atwater, CA
City of Atwater
7. Contact the IRS.
Internal Revenue Service
Last edited by flightknight; 30th Jun 2008 at 15:45. Reason: add
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: negative RAIM.....
Posts: 329
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Shuchim...
Regarding the title of your post, ie your "dreams have been killed".... If that is all it takes to remove your passion to fly then you need to have a long hard look at your career vocation.
You have received some excellant advice from some people to your post.
I find it so difficult to fathom (if I may read between the lines, and correct me if I'm wrong) that you seem to believe it is your RIGHT to be GIVEN this job. No need to earn it. No need to build experience up. It seems you went to a sausage factory flying school on a half baked promise of free coffee at FL360. And, from others' responses this flying school does not have a good history, nor did it ever (?).
Why not take your shiney new CPL and go and do some freight, scenic, instructing, etc.... and build up some experience until the opportunity presents itself again. Go and study for your ATP(L) subjects!
"When I was a young boy......" (sorry to have to use that term!) pilots would have over 1000 hrs on a single engine piston before getting to look at a twin; then 2500 - 3000 hrs (1000 hrs PIC) before looking at a turbo prop, and 4000 hrs TT before getting the chance to interview for a jet job, then8 out of 10 would be rejected. It seems on the sub continent a culture of job-by-right in aviation has flourished. Now the bubble is bursting.
Get in a car and start driving to airfield after airfield and BEG for work on any aircraft you can and build your hours. It'll be tough, but the rewards endless.
Welcome to aviation. Do your research before getting involved with anything in this industry. Learn to make the best of the bad times and enjoy the good.
Best of luck.
PS: Sorry to point it out but you may need to work on your English if the grammer from your post is any indication.
Regarding the title of your post, ie your "dreams have been killed".... If that is all it takes to remove your passion to fly then you need to have a long hard look at your career vocation.
You have received some excellant advice from some people to your post.
I find it so difficult to fathom (if I may read between the lines, and correct me if I'm wrong) that you seem to believe it is your RIGHT to be GIVEN this job. No need to earn it. No need to build experience up. It seems you went to a sausage factory flying school on a half baked promise of free coffee at FL360. And, from others' responses this flying school does not have a good history, nor did it ever (?).
Why not take your shiney new CPL and go and do some freight, scenic, instructing, etc.... and build up some experience until the opportunity presents itself again. Go and study for your ATP(L) subjects!
"When I was a young boy......" (sorry to have to use that term!) pilots would have over 1000 hrs on a single engine piston before getting to look at a twin; then 2500 - 3000 hrs (1000 hrs PIC) before looking at a turbo prop, and 4000 hrs TT before getting the chance to interview for a jet job, then8 out of 10 would be rejected. It seems on the sub continent a culture of job-by-right in aviation has flourished. Now the bubble is bursting.
Get in a car and start driving to airfield after airfield and BEG for work on any aircraft you can and build your hours. It'll be tough, but the rewards endless.
Welcome to aviation. Do your research before getting involved with anything in this industry. Learn to make the best of the bad times and enjoy the good.
Best of luck.
PS: Sorry to point it out but you may need to work on your English if the grammer from your post is any indication.
Last edited by TopTup; 30th Jun 2008 at 16:29. Reason: typos.....
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: EARTH
Posts: 220
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
such things happened in past also.
collecting data on the issue.
any trainee,before going to any flying school, must have a representative in the respective country to take up case with the appropriate authorities.
trainees are lucky at least they had return ticket to comeback.
HR says my hands are full , bags are too full.
collecting data on the issue.
any trainee,before going to any flying school, must have a representative in the respective country to take up case with the appropriate authorities.
trainees are lucky at least they had return ticket to comeback.
HR says my hands are full , bags are too full.
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: EARTH
Posts: 220
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
routine bussiness
Posted by MDDOG earlier
............................................................ ...................
Moreover, as a flight Instructor working at a busy flight school in the late 90's in the Southern California area, over a period of 1 year there were 5 fatal accidents ALL involving either European or Indian students..
............................................................ .....................................
I presume
In this scenario flying school pick trainees who had no representative in USA.
They pick 5 a/c” s which were due for C of A.
Grounding an airplane for C of A is very expensive.
Full money of the course paid by trainees.
Insured a/c”s.
After crash aircraft parts fetching higher price than the a/c.
Parking charges saved.
Parking lots saved.
Flying school made big chunk in one year over the dead bodies.
And why FAA could not go beyond routine enquiry after crash, or made some recommendations for safety after the first crash because inquiry finished looking at the metal on ground.
These trainees had no representative to go to FAA and ask for detailed enquiry and look in to other aspects leading to such events.
FAA could have gone beyond the wall and done justice with the flying school provided someone had followed it up.
............................................................ ...................
Moreover, as a flight Instructor working at a busy flight school in the late 90's in the Southern California area, over a period of 1 year there were 5 fatal accidents ALL involving either European or Indian students..
............................................................ .....................................
I presume
In this scenario flying school pick trainees who had no representative in USA.
They pick 5 a/c” s which were due for C of A.
Grounding an airplane for C of A is very expensive.
Full money of the course paid by trainees.
Insured a/c”s.
After crash aircraft parts fetching higher price than the a/c.
Parking charges saved.
Parking lots saved.
Flying school made big chunk in one year over the dead bodies.
And why FAA could not go beyond routine enquiry after crash, or made some recommendations for safety after the first crash because inquiry finished looking at the metal on ground.
These trainees had no representative to go to FAA and ask for detailed enquiry and look in to other aspects leading to such events.
FAA could have gone beyond the wall and done justice with the flying school provided someone had followed it up.
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Behind You.....
Posts: 408
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
IMHO,
the bottomline was if they got their CPL license... they expect to be shown their brand spanking new shiny jet.... most of them had the illusion that they are already cut out to fly jets... no need for flight hours and valuable experience... "just give me my right seat" was the mind set... now that the price of ATF is rising by the day, almost all airlines are directly affected by this and need to trim up operations... a lot of flyboys will be left out in the dark...
the bottomline was if they got their CPL license... they expect to be shown their brand spanking new shiny jet.... most of them had the illusion that they are already cut out to fly jets... no need for flight hours and valuable experience... "just give me my right seat" was the mind set... now that the price of ATF is rising by the day, almost all airlines are directly affected by this and need to trim up operations... a lot of flyboys will be left out in the dark...
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: usa
Posts: 169
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Any brave pilot trainees out there ??
Its interesting that there has'nt been a whimper from any of the "brave" future aviators who posted their grieviance on this forum.
Anyways ...more spoonfeed, we just can't sing you'll koombayaah !!!!
http://www.ftc.gov/opa/2007/10/fraud.pdf
https://www.consumeraffairs.com/php/a_report.php
Anyways ...more spoonfeed, we just can't sing you'll koombayaah !!!!
http://www.ftc.gov/opa/2007/10/fraud.pdf
https://www.consumeraffairs.com/php/a_report.php
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Behind You.....
Posts: 408
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
getsetgo,
nice one, i didn't say i was worried about the indian cpl's / co-pilots seats, who cares about them, what i'm worried about are the expat fo's flying there in curry land.
glad to be out of there before the bubble bursts!
nice one, i didn't say i was worried about the indian cpl's / co-pilots seats, who cares about them, what i'm worried about are the expat fo's flying there in curry land.
glad to be out of there before the bubble bursts!
,your user id says it all,and what land are you from????show some respect,as you know what goes around comes around.
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Behind You.....
Posts: 408
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Dagar,
let me ask you one thing, have you flown in the land that i am referring to, i suggest you get for yourself firsthand experience (the ones i had and a bunch of the guys here) and walk the walk and then talk the talk...
let me ask you one thing, have you flown in the land that i am referring to, i suggest you get for yourself firsthand experience (the ones i had and a bunch of the guys here) and walk the walk and then talk the talk...
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: usa
Posts: 169
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The absconding Prince ????????????
Is it true that this "prince" fellow has runaway from the USA ?. Anybody out there pursuing this crook or have you'll just given up because its just your parents hard earned money.
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: EARTH
Posts: 220
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
power stall
............................................................ .........................
nice one, i didn't say i was worried about the indian cpl's / co-pilots seats, who cares about them, what i'm worried about are the expat fo's flying there in curry land.
glad to be out of there before the bubble bursts!
............................................................ .............................
there is a saying falling from sky and stuck on treetop
and seeing bubbles from tamrind tree........
you can see bubble but you wont get curry there
good luck
............................................................ .........................
nice one, i didn't say i was worried about the indian cpl's / co-pilots seats, who cares about them, what i'm worried about are the expat fo's flying there in curry land.
glad to be out of there before the bubble bursts!
............................................................ .............................
there is a saying falling from sky and stuck on treetop
and seeing bubbles from tamrind tree........
you can see bubble but you wont get curry there
good luck