Indian Boom!!!& Sahara/Jet (Merged).
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Indian Boom!!!
CAN SOME TELL ME WHATS GOING ON OVER THERE!!!
is it raining money ?
seems evryone is ordering planes like hot dogs or pizza's
Jetairways ordered 10 737 & 10 777 plus 10 A330
Kingfisher...5 A330 + 5 A350 + oh yes FIVE A380 wow!, and theire the same age as my son!
Airdeccan, even tough the put an order back in Jan for 60 birds (30 ATR's & 30 A320) not in this parisairshow, but it was on another airshow (AeroIndia)
Airsahara received new 737-800, they have 2, plus 5 737-700
not pleased, now theres INDIGO, who entered the scene, with an order of .......100......yes onehundred A320!!!.......THE LARGEST IN INDIAN HISTORY!!!!
seems that all the CEO's, president and/or heads of companies decided that this is the year to do it????
it looks from outside like a competition between them, like in the U.A.E., where Emirates orders a lot of metal and then Qatar comes along an orders even more, they took 80 in this parisairshow WOW
“The twenty-first century belongs to India . We feel privileged at the prospect of contributing to the growth of India 's aviation sector", from InterGlobe web page.
and each airline says that they would become (if their not by now) the BEST, or FASTEST GROWING, or YOUNGER airline by 2010, well kingfisher claims they would be proffitable in the very 1st year, thats good competition!!
one thing is for sure for someone like me (pilot) and all of us reading this post evry now and then, they would not have crews to fly them inside their boundaries!!!, c'mon! their short at the moment, imagine when all those airlines have by 2010 close to 300 planes combined
good for me, I love curry & rice!!! je je je
so far Pay is good
BooooooooM
is it raining money ?
seems evryone is ordering planes like hot dogs or pizza's
Jetairways ordered 10 737 & 10 777 plus 10 A330
Kingfisher...5 A330 + 5 A350 + oh yes FIVE A380 wow!, and theire the same age as my son!
Airdeccan, even tough the put an order back in Jan for 60 birds (30 ATR's & 30 A320) not in this parisairshow, but it was on another airshow (AeroIndia)
Airsahara received new 737-800, they have 2, plus 5 737-700
not pleased, now theres INDIGO, who entered the scene, with an order of .......100......yes onehundred A320!!!.......THE LARGEST IN INDIAN HISTORY!!!!
seems that all the CEO's, president and/or heads of companies decided that this is the year to do it????
it looks from outside like a competition between them, like in the U.A.E., where Emirates orders a lot of metal and then Qatar comes along an orders even more, they took 80 in this parisairshow WOW
“The twenty-first century belongs to India . We feel privileged at the prospect of contributing to the growth of India 's aviation sector", from InterGlobe web page.
and each airline says that they would become (if their not by now) the BEST, or FASTEST GROWING, or YOUNGER airline by 2010, well kingfisher claims they would be proffitable in the very 1st year, thats good competition!!
one thing is for sure for someone like me (pilot) and all of us reading this post evry now and then, they would not have crews to fly them inside their boundaries!!!, c'mon! their short at the moment, imagine when all those airlines have by 2010 close to 300 planes combined
good for me, I love curry & rice!!! je je je
so far Pay is good
BooooooooM
Last edited by jumpdrive; 17th Jun 2005 at 01:32.
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firing up
The indian aviation scene is really moving up.... but unfortunately , employment for foreigners is only if he/she was a PIC type rating on aircraft being operated in INDIA , that too is for a contract period of 1 yr , renewable. There are alot of indian pilots to fill the posts of F/O .... and more are getting their licenses current as we speak. Things are finally looking up.
cheers
vimd23
cheers
vimd23
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In my opinion, most of the Indian F/O's will fill up those leftseat spots once their ready for it, It happens evrywhere, if you have the time and the skills, & the airline is in need, they will switch seats with you in the blink of an eye.
Im going as a Captain and im looking forward to it very very much!
& the experience its even more exciting with startup airlines, in wich your are part of the thing since the beggining, to this I can relate a lot.
good luck
see you in India
Im going as a Captain and im looking forward to it very very much!
& the experience its even more exciting with startup airlines, in wich your are part of the thing since the beggining, to this I can relate a lot.
good luck
see you in India
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Dunno about the phrase "getting their licences whilst we speak"
I just got back from India yesterday and there were a couple of articles in the local rag about the fact that there were no instructors to train students because of poaching by the airlines.
A flying school in Bombay has suspended ops because their cfi left.
Another story was that 10 pilots had left Air India? a couple of days ago for a new start up and a month or so ago the minister for aviation( or someone high up) had told the airlines to stop poaching each others pilots and had upped the retirement age to 61.
I just got back from India yesterday and there were a couple of articles in the local rag about the fact that there were no instructors to train students because of poaching by the airlines.
A flying school in Bombay has suspended ops because their cfi left.
Another story was that 10 pilots had left Air India? a couple of days ago for a new start up and a month or so ago the minister for aviation( or someone high up) had told the airlines to stop poaching each others pilots and had upped the retirement age to 61.
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Ok so the aircrafts are comming, where are the pilots. Non of these airlines will make the effort to start a resposible cadet program. They are thinking short term; poach, hunt, buy the pilots for now and ask the fresh CPL to cough up close to 10000 US$ for type ratings, what a joke.
So the shiny new planes will be standing on the ground with no pilots to fly em, would an airline rather pay top dollar to an xpat pilot for 1 yr or have a great cadet program that makes every one happy. Look at USA no pilots jobs untill you have a Green Card.
India is still a poor country many students cant affort to pay US$20000++ for their flt training, what will they do; keep dreaming of becoming a pilot one day.
So the shiny new planes will be standing on the ground with no pilots to fly em, would an airline rather pay top dollar to an xpat pilot for 1 yr or have a great cadet program that makes every one happy. Look at USA no pilots jobs untill you have a Green Card.
India is still a poor country many students cant affort to pay US$20000++ for their flt training, what will they do; keep dreaming of becoming a pilot one day.
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DGCA India just dropped the min 250hrs for CPL issue down to 200hrs so need for pilots is now an issue and the DGCA India will still sit with its Aircraft Act of India 1932 and bully newbies and start up airlines.
Spice Jet ops dept is a good place run by former VP flt ops of Oman Air. Expect to fly a lot approx 80hrs a mth.
Spice Jet ops dept is a good place run by former VP flt ops of Oman Air. Expect to fly a lot approx 80hrs a mth.
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The other side of the great BOOM
From http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/a...,prtpage-1.cms
From the Times of India
'Hijacked' pilot leaves his passengers grounded
TIMES NEWS NETWORK[ TUESDAY, JUNE 21, 2005 11:52:29 PM ]
Surf 'N' Earn -Sign innow
MUMBAI: About a dozen Indian Airlines passengers have been stranded on Agatti island in Lakshadweep for since the pilot who operated the only flight to this archipelago suddenly vanished on Saturday.
He was apparently poached by a newly launched airline.
Call it the other face of the booming Indian aviation sector.
On Tuesday, that small group of IA passengers comprising scientists, advertising executives, tourists and professionals, waited expectantly on Agatti island for the second consecutive day, hoping that an IA Dornier would show up to fly them back to Cochin.
But there was no sign of the aircraft.
Said Nishtha Mehta Balivada, an advertising executive, "We don't know whether any flight will come at all."
Cut off from the outside world -- with no internet connection, no newspapers, and fitful telephone lines -- the stranded passengers have been left with little by way of help.
"From Wednesday, the five vegetarians in the group will have to survive on coconut water as the vegetarian food provisions on this small island have run out," she added.
For these passengers, the ordeal began on Saturday, the day they took the IA flight from Cochin to Agatti.
The flight landed on Agatti -- the only island in Laskhwadeep which has an airstrip -- at about 11.30 am and in 15 minutes, the group was to fly to its final destination, Kavaratti island, on a government helicopter.
"The helicopter did not turn up as it also does medical rounds," said Balivada. It didn't turn up on Sunday, Monday, then Tuesday.
"We were put up at the only beach resort on the island and on Monday all of us decided to fly back to Cochin," said Balivada.
That's when they learnt that the Indian Airlines flight which brought them to this island was playing truant. "The local IA officials told us that the pilot, one Capt Chowdhury, had gone missing," she said.
The stranded passengers were told that Capt Chowdhury had not reported at Indian Airlines' Cochin office as he had gone to Bangalore and joined another airline there.
Jagannath Reddy, a scientist from the Institute of Ocean Technology, who has been flying frequently with his colleagues to Agatti and Kavaratti to work on a desalination plant project, said, "In the last three months, we have been stranded thrice.
Earlier, it was for one day each, now I don't know for how long." He added angrily, "They should call it Chowdhury Airlines and not Indian Airlines."
The scientist alleged that the Cochin-Agatti IA flights had often been at this commander's mercy.
An IA spokesperson said that the flights could not be operated due to bad weather. "The pilot has not left Indian Airlines," he noted.
IA will try to operate a flight on June 25. But sources from Cochin confirmed that Capt Chowdhury had on Monday submitted his resignation to the IA office in Chennai.
"A month back, he wanted leave as a family member was ailing, but his request was refused," said the source. The pilot then put in his papers.
"The IA officials did not budge and told him that he would come back, like the many others who had left before him," said the source.
After a few days, IA officials got in touch with him and pleaded with him to return. "Capt Chowdhury simply loved that Dornier aircraft.
"He treated it like his child and was so happy to return," the source added.
But matters between him and IA officials soured again last week and on Monday, he put in his papers, leaving the passengers stranded.
************
From the Times of India
'Hijacked' pilot leaves his passengers grounded
TIMES NEWS NETWORK[ TUESDAY, JUNE 21, 2005 11:52:29 PM ]
Surf 'N' Earn -Sign innow
MUMBAI: About a dozen Indian Airlines passengers have been stranded on Agatti island in Lakshadweep for since the pilot who operated the only flight to this archipelago suddenly vanished on Saturday.
He was apparently poached by a newly launched airline.
Call it the other face of the booming Indian aviation sector.
On Tuesday, that small group of IA passengers comprising scientists, advertising executives, tourists and professionals, waited expectantly on Agatti island for the second consecutive day, hoping that an IA Dornier would show up to fly them back to Cochin.
But there was no sign of the aircraft.
Said Nishtha Mehta Balivada, an advertising executive, "We don't know whether any flight will come at all."
Cut off from the outside world -- with no internet connection, no newspapers, and fitful telephone lines -- the stranded passengers have been left with little by way of help.
"From Wednesday, the five vegetarians in the group will have to survive on coconut water as the vegetarian food provisions on this small island have run out," she added.
For these passengers, the ordeal began on Saturday, the day they took the IA flight from Cochin to Agatti.
The flight landed on Agatti -- the only island in Laskhwadeep which has an airstrip -- at about 11.30 am and in 15 minutes, the group was to fly to its final destination, Kavaratti island, on a government helicopter.
"The helicopter did not turn up as it also does medical rounds," said Balivada. It didn't turn up on Sunday, Monday, then Tuesday.
"We were put up at the only beach resort on the island and on Monday all of us decided to fly back to Cochin," said Balivada.
That's when they learnt that the Indian Airlines flight which brought them to this island was playing truant. "The local IA officials told us that the pilot, one Capt Chowdhury, had gone missing," she said.
The stranded passengers were told that Capt Chowdhury had not reported at Indian Airlines' Cochin office as he had gone to Bangalore and joined another airline there.
Jagannath Reddy, a scientist from the Institute of Ocean Technology, who has been flying frequently with his colleagues to Agatti and Kavaratti to work on a desalination plant project, said, "In the last three months, we have been stranded thrice.
Earlier, it was for one day each, now I don't know for how long." He added angrily, "They should call it Chowdhury Airlines and not Indian Airlines."
The scientist alleged that the Cochin-Agatti IA flights had often been at this commander's mercy.
An IA spokesperson said that the flights could not be operated due to bad weather. "The pilot has not left Indian Airlines," he noted.
IA will try to operate a flight on June 25. But sources from Cochin confirmed that Capt Chowdhury had on Monday submitted his resignation to the IA office in Chennai.
"A month back, he wanted leave as a family member was ailing, but his request was refused," said the source. The pilot then put in his papers.
"The IA officials did not budge and told him that he would come back, like the many others who had left before him," said the source.
After a few days, IA officials got in touch with him and pleaded with him to return. "Capt Chowdhury simply loved that Dornier aircraft.
"He treated it like his child and was so happy to return," the source added.
But matters between him and IA officials soured again last week and on Monday, he put in his papers, leaving the passengers stranded.
************
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hi guys left wing in particular...
i have often asked myself this question over and over again, but may be someone could explain...
i am a nri as u guys would call it and fly the 737-200 in africa,would love to work in india..even heard on the news the other day abt india granting dual citizenship to nri's
kindly help,
no more 406pilot..
i have often asked myself this question over and over again, but may be someone could explain...
i am a nri as u guys would call it and fly the 737-200 in africa,would love to work in india..even heard on the news the other day abt india granting dual citizenship to nri's
kindly help,
no more 406pilot..
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hmm too much trouble yaar rather wait till i make captain at the current outfit and then get a real airline job else where in a decent world..
thanks for the advice though...
no more 406pilot..
wouldnt make any difference if i were married to an indian citizen would it?
thanks for the advice though...
no more 406pilot..
wouldnt make any difference if i were married to an indian citizen would it?
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from Airline transport World online.com
Rush by Indian Airlines to buy aircraft is continuing with Air Sahara announcing that it intends to order 40 airplanes for delivery over the next five years to bring its fleet to 65. They likely will be 777s and 737s. Last week, Air Sahara announced plans to begin daily services between Delhi and London from September/October with two 777-200ERs leased from ILFC for five years.
&
Qatar Airways will add 11 weekly frequencies to India following the recent successful round of bilateral discussions between the countries. Qatar currently operates 19 scheduled flights a week between Doha and Cochin, Trivandrum, Hyderabad and Mumbai. From July 14 it will add New Delhi with seven services a week, flown initially with A320s in a 144-seat, two-class configuration and later with A330s offering three classes of service. From July 15, the Mumbai route will increase from six services a week to daily with the introduction of a new Friday night flight from Doha. Cochin, currently served thrice-weekly, will be boosted with two additional weekly departures beginning July 18. On July 21, a fourth weekly frequency will be added to the Hyderabad schedule.
+
Kingfisher Airlines signed a five-year contract with SITA INC for VHF AIRCOM data link services. According to the airline, SITA was selected because of its ability to provide nationwide VHF data communications coverage. SITA has four VHF ground stations operational at Mumbai, Delhi, Chennai and Calcutta with two more being installed at Port Blair and Trivandrum. SITA INC is now in the process of installing VHF stations at 17 new sites in India as well as upgrading existing sites.
by Geoffrey Thomas
www.atwonline.com
&
Qatar Airways will add 11 weekly frequencies to India following the recent successful round of bilateral discussions between the countries. Qatar currently operates 19 scheduled flights a week between Doha and Cochin, Trivandrum, Hyderabad and Mumbai. From July 14 it will add New Delhi with seven services a week, flown initially with A320s in a 144-seat, two-class configuration and later with A330s offering three classes of service. From July 15, the Mumbai route will increase from six services a week to daily with the introduction of a new Friday night flight from Doha. Cochin, currently served thrice-weekly, will be boosted with two additional weekly departures beginning July 18. On July 21, a fourth weekly frequency will be added to the Hyderabad schedule.
+
Kingfisher Airlines signed a five-year contract with SITA INC for VHF AIRCOM data link services. According to the airline, SITA was selected because of its ability to provide nationwide VHF data communications coverage. SITA has four VHF ground stations operational at Mumbai, Delhi, Chennai and Calcutta with two more being installed at Port Blair and Trivandrum. SITA INC is now in the process of installing VHF stations at 17 new sites in India as well as upgrading existing sites.
by Geoffrey Thomas
www.atwonline.com
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The faster Decan shuts down the safer ! Its flt safety is waiting to crash....
Its sad that the Indian paying pax is still not aware of the details involved in running an airline, they feel if the food is good and the tiks are cheap, girls are sweet to them; its a great airline.
Whats worse, Deccan's boss thinks the same way as well !
Deccan will burst this bubble of LCCs in India and only then will DGCA wake up. 
Its sad that the Indian paying pax is still not aware of the details involved in running an airline, they feel if the food is good and the tiks are cheap, girls are sweet to them; its a great airline.
Whats worse, Deccan's boss thinks the same way as well !
Deccan will burst this bubble of LCCs in India and only then will DGCA wake up.
Whatever happens,.. happens!
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I'm curious!
Do all the contract Pilots that are going to India make their arrangements through agency's such as Parc, Sigmar, Direct etc. or is there a way to deal directly with the carriers?
Do all the contract Pilots that are going to India make their arrangements through agency's such as Parc, Sigmar, Direct etc. or is there a way to deal directly with the carriers?
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Indian Airlines has come out with an even more liberalised "Easy Fares"scheme. Basically these are discounted fares based on a continuous monitoring of capacity, but with none of the restrictions of an APEX fare. This move is outright taking on of Deccan (as well as Spice Jet). No interlining in case of flight disruptions, but they do promise you a seat on their next available flight (considering that Deccan operates 2 flights on BOM-DEL while Indian Airlines operates 10, you can see the difference). The interesting thing is that when I tried for a last day fare, some of the Indian Airlines flights were just 50 Rs costlier than Deccan for BOM-DEL. And remember - this is a full service carrier. Looks like it is getting to be an American vs Peoples Express saga replayed here.
Some other facts.
Both Indian Airlines and Jet are agressively targetting Deccan, Spice et all. In many cases, last minute fares are almost as cheap as Deccan as I already explained - plus the food is good (and free as well). Indian Airlines uses SATS which has a tie up with Taj group, Jet uses among others LSG Sky Chef. And yes sir, I do like to get a free meal for a 2 hour sector, esp if if I am paying more or less the same amount as for the lo-co!
Both the majors are sprucing up on customer service as well. Jet has been always good on that and IC has been steadily improving. My early morning flight today for 6 AM on Indian Airlines was rescheduled sometime the previous evening to 8 AM. I was informed on the phone by Indian Airlines last night itself, and yes I did appreciate the fact that thanks to being informed well on time, I didnt have to get up at an unearthly hour and end up twiddling my thumbs watching the airport cleaners at work! Not suggesting that the loco airlines dont do this, but having travelled Indian Airlines for the last 12 odd years regularly, they seem to be getting only better and better.
Lowering fares even more sounds good - but then how can people like DN survive eventually? Foreign pilots are expensive, and with more and more trained guys leaving, your training costs go high as well. Fuel costs havent come down much, and there are not likely to be any Brussells South or Frankfurt Hahns anytime soon in India! 95 % load factor sounds good, Re 1 /Rs 500 fares for the common man sound even better, but in the end where is your money coming from with costs spiralling up and up?
No wonder Spice is not talking about the 99Rs fare nowadays. They wanted to make an impact, achieved the same , annouced the fares were sold out in no time and then went about their business with sensible fares.
Business traffic wont touch DN- and finally they seem to be realising that with talks of a shuttle between MAA-BLR- HYD. But then others wont sit quiet either, already Jet has 4 flights on MAA BLR route between 6 AM and 12 noon, and the Indian Airlines lady at the top has informed through the latest copy of the inflight magazine that in winter, they are also going to increase capacity in domestic routes (they already have in key routes like BOM DEL). That way KF and Spice seem to have a better plan - atleast they have twice daily flights at sensible times (and not 11 AM and 3 PM arrivals) on most of their routes. Speaking of routes as well, KF serves 2 with 2 planes and even Spice seems to be concentrating on the frequency aspect .
Some other facts.
Both Indian Airlines and Jet are agressively targetting Deccan, Spice et all. In many cases, last minute fares are almost as cheap as Deccan as I already explained - plus the food is good (and free as well). Indian Airlines uses SATS which has a tie up with Taj group, Jet uses among others LSG Sky Chef. And yes sir, I do like to get a free meal for a 2 hour sector, esp if if I am paying more or less the same amount as for the lo-co!
Both the majors are sprucing up on customer service as well. Jet has been always good on that and IC has been steadily improving. My early morning flight today for 6 AM on Indian Airlines was rescheduled sometime the previous evening to 8 AM. I was informed on the phone by Indian Airlines last night itself, and yes I did appreciate the fact that thanks to being informed well on time, I didnt have to get up at an unearthly hour and end up twiddling my thumbs watching the airport cleaners at work! Not suggesting that the loco airlines dont do this, but having travelled Indian Airlines for the last 12 odd years regularly, they seem to be getting only better and better.
Lowering fares even more sounds good - but then how can people like DN survive eventually? Foreign pilots are expensive, and with more and more trained guys leaving, your training costs go high as well. Fuel costs havent come down much, and there are not likely to be any Brussells South or Frankfurt Hahns anytime soon in India! 95 % load factor sounds good, Re 1 /Rs 500 fares for the common man sound even better, but in the end where is your money coming from with costs spiralling up and up?
No wonder Spice is not talking about the 99Rs fare nowadays. They wanted to make an impact, achieved the same , annouced the fares were sold out in no time and then went about their business with sensible fares.
Business traffic wont touch DN- and finally they seem to be realising that with talks of a shuttle between MAA-BLR- HYD. But then others wont sit quiet either, already Jet has 4 flights on MAA BLR route between 6 AM and 12 noon, and the Indian Airlines lady at the top has informed through the latest copy of the inflight magazine that in winter, they are also going to increase capacity in domestic routes (they already have in key routes like BOM DEL). That way KF and Spice seem to have a better plan - atleast they have twice daily flights at sensible times (and not 11 AM and 3 PM arrivals) on most of their routes. Speaking of routes as well, KF serves 2 with 2 planes and even Spice seems to be concentrating on the frequency aspect .
Last edited by rsoman; 17th Jul 2005 at 12:37.
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Left Wing
You ask, "would an airline rather pay top dollar to an xpat pilot for 1 yr or have a great cadet program that makes every one happy".
Well, until they are big enough to be able to afford themselves the luxury of a cadet pilot programme most start-ups will go for the experienced pilot. No airline that I can think of has ever been grounded by a lack of cadet pilots whereas some have for a lack of experienced crew.
Cadet pilot programmes are long term ventures and airlines can only launch into them when they are fully up and running and stabilised.
Well, until they are big enough to be able to afford themselves the luxury of a cadet pilot programme most start-ups will go for the experienced pilot. No airline that I can think of has ever been grounded by a lack of cadet pilots whereas some have for a lack of experienced crew.
Cadet pilot programmes are long term ventures and airlines can only launch into them when they are fully up and running and stabilised.