This worries me
 

The notions that airlines are now responsible for deciding if it safe to fly concerns me. Why is an ash concentration that was considered dangerous yesterday now considered safe tomorrow? NATS and the met-office don't have to answer to shareholders which is why I trust them rather than a bunch of airline execs paid bonuses.

Frankly I'm disgusted by Willy Walsh and BA and the fact that they have leant on the regulator in this way (and I'm usually very pro BA) I have to admire O'Leary (and I'm normally far from a fan of his!!) but actually ironically Ryanair seems far more bothered by the risks of this than BA do - and I never thought I'd say that...

Safety is safety whatever it costs. I personally am not ken to fly tomorrow because I have yet to hear scientific evidence to confirm it is safe.

Desk-pilot

Obviously they are being kept in holds to ensure they arrive after 2100z, and not a minute before!

Even though the decision has been made to reopen EGLL, Nats presumably want to be seen to be retaining the upper hand. Silly really. They should be more concerned with just getting them back on tierra firme - must be some tired crew and pax up there, needlessly holding in my opinion.

BA must have planned this...
 

How long have those flights been circling for? And now they're still meandering and giving their pax an aerial tour of various bits of Britain, circling here there and everywhere to meet that 10pm openning.

So I'm assuming they all loaded FAR more contingency/diversion fuel than usual, which suggests to me, given the meeting Willie has had this evening, that he rather planned this whole operation, knowing the bad PR the government would get if all these flights were diverted and more pax stranded, when the rest of Europe is open.

Very clever tactics for now, but I will reserve judgement on whether this is the right decision, it does seem aviation safety decisions are being made for political reasons, which puts us on a very very slippery slope we really don't want to be near. However, I do tend to trust Willie Walsh is an intelligent enough man to know a fleet of ash-damaged aircraft would cost far more than waiting till the winds change on fri/sat so I assume he has good reason to believe the air is OK.

BA A/C into LHR
 

I have heard that BA have about 15 A/C arriving into LHR through the night tonight. Sadly they only have the staff to handle 3 at a time!!:ugh:

working hours
 

Is the crew of the planes which are holding,not coming in problems with their working hours?:sad:

Surely it is causing more distress to engines holding at 26000 as BAW84 has been around BHX for the past 10 mins, although it is now on a rapid decent so he looks as though he is one of the chosen few.
But is it a good decision to have held them off all this time. Does this make engineering sense...

Awful lot of the use of the word "guidance" from the regulator?

Desk-pilot
 

I would not even bother thinking about it, your job is to fly the aeroplanes and that is it. You should be positively happy to get the all clear to get back to work. What do you know about what goes on behind the scenes?

I would be far more concerned if I were you about the damage it may be causing ones airline. I for one do not want to be grounded any longer as this could become terminal. Some of us have just dodged redundancy and now this.

The sooner we get an all clear the better.

Agreed. This seems to have turned out to be a rather sad evening for UK aviation in many ways. The apparent brinkmanship is particularly appalling. Just heard two on about 18 mile approach to LHR ... if so they'll land early :ok:

neila83: yup, of course it was planned; Denver, Houston, Vancouver, Toronto, Los Angeles, Orlando, Miami, Mexico City. Contingency had to be built in and the planning finalised at least 24 hours ago.

But as deskpilot posted a few minutes ago, an issue forced -- or attempted to be forced -- by someone accountable only to shareholders is no cause for any kind of celebration.

What precedent then?

Be interesting to learn how long it takes for BA to release details of the condition these a/c are in after their extensive jigging around an airspace but recently closed down for being at risk of hazard.

I certainly wouldn't want to be currently in charge of any Speedbird Grand Aerial Tour -- whether the pax are enjoying the view or not.

Quoting from this

The cloud was 4-5 days old at this point.

Speedbird 84 just reported a "burning smell" upon passing a thin layer of cloud between 6000-5500ft when turning right for base leg 27L. Nothing major, no panic, just a smell.

Obviously they don't want to liable for any damaged aircraft or passengers. If Airlines want to take the risk, its their problem.

It appears that WW has played a pretty capable hand today - Gawd knows the situation needed it - but politicians never forget those who have shown up their true incompetence, and if Willie/BA need help at any time while this lot are still in power := he can expect a darned cool reception. BA beware?

Maybe we have reached a tipping point where professionals who understand risk reassert control over the real world from the hands of unelected bureaucrats, jobsworths and political placemen! A lesson for all walks of life. Willie for PM?

Looks like they've landed several minutes before 2100Z. Was the hold to sample the ash as someone suggested?

Anyway, hope things are on the way back to normal for us all...:ok:

a game of chicken
 

WW has been engaged in a high stakes game of Chicken with the regulators all afternoon, he launched 24 wide body aircraft to LHR scheduled to arrive between 1900 and 0400 and then stood back to see if the UK government and associated agencies would back down or if they would stand firm and take the flack for the diversions. A number of them diverted before the government caved in.

WW has won the game, who is correct and incorrect will be decided in the coming days

I wonder, with some trepidation, what the "intensive maintenance ash damage inspection" is going to entail.
Are we going to have to boroscope every engine post flight? Is it going to be the line engineers fault if an engine fails because it was operated in contaminated air to please the CEO & shareholders? :ugh:

Anyone seen this "guidance" yet?

Forget the politics, for time being we need to boroscope the engines, and make sure that our moves are safe!