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Garuda cancels its MAX order
A billion-pound order. How many to follow ?
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Strictly speaking, Garuda have requested cancellation. I very much doubt they can simply walk away from their order.
Garuda have also been at pains to state that they're not necessarily binning Boeing and may look at taking a different 737 variant. |
Carriers like Virgin who have a hundred odd 737s dropping their orders for what the NEO? Highly unlikely. |
Originally Posted by Andy_S
(Post 10426720)
Garuda have also been at pains to state that they're not necessarily binning Boeing and may look at taking a different 737 variant.
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Originally Posted by GeeRam
(Post 10426728)
I was under the impression that the order book for the NG versions was closed, and pretty much the final couple of fuselage tubes (other than military P-8 and E-7) have or are just about to leave the plant...?
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Originally Posted by Andy_S
(Post 10426746)
My apologies. On re-reading the story, Garuda say they may replace it with "another model" rather than another 737 variant, although the inference was that they would stick with Boeing.
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Originally Posted by GeeRam
(Post 10426728)
I was under the impression that the order book for the NG versions was closed, and pretty much the final couple of fuselage tubes (other than military P-8 and E-7) have or are just about to leave the plant...?
Re Garuda type change story , well the immediate aircraft to order next after the Max is the 787 . quite a big jump., and I guess the 787 order book is filled up for the next 5 years as well .Plus Garuda and Lion use their 73s mostly domestically , most or relatively short routes, not exactly made for a long range 787. So I do really not buy the "swap" story. |
Originally Posted by ATC Watcher
(Post 10426867)
According the Boeing states 2019 they still have 93 NG to deliver .
Re Garuda type change story , well the immediate aircraft to order next after the Max is the 787 . quite a big jump., and I guess the 787 order book is filled up for the next 5 years as well .Plus Garuda and Lion use their 73s mostly domestically , most or relatively short routes, not exactly made for a long range 787. So I do really not buy the "swap" story. |
As a retired Reuters journalist (and pilot) in my opinion this story is much more complex. The general opinion appears to be that Boeing tried to catch up with Airbus by modifying a 50 year old design with bolt on technology and computer software. This meant no new costly FAA paperwork to sign off . Added to this scenario was the fact the US government effectively allowed Boeing carte blanche certification. Boeing are now in a very serious legal and sales situation. Clearly the airlines with expensive grounded aircraft are going to be talking recompense and lawyers shortly. Added to this is the issue that Boeing face with public trust in their aircraft. Meanwhile Airbus sales teams are going to milk this for what it is worth. |
The other issue which doesn't appear to be reported on is the the overall effect on the US trade deficit and the US/China trade talks idea of China buying more 737's
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..... Meanwhile Airbus sales teams are going to milk this for what it is worth. It's not like they have lots of product sitting on a shelf in their store and it's never good to bad mouth the other guy when you have your own problems not yet visible |
Originally Posted by lomapaseo
(Post 10427624)
How so?
It's not like they have lots of product sitting on a shelf in their store and it's never good to bad mouth the other guy when you have your own problems not yet visible Low cost operators are in a cut throat business in this part of the world. Air Asia is one of the fastest growing among the loco’s and they are major Airbus buyers while Lionair are operating a mixed fleet. It appears Lionair will cancel Boeing next followed by a raft of other buyers. Vietjet and others are sitting on easily cancelled orders. As for the 737 Max I imagine that Boeing will take a big financial hit trying to shift what is now a maligned aircraft. As for your suggestion ‘it’s never good to bad mouth the other guy’ sadly that is what salespeople do all the time. The bottom line here is that Boeing have been caught out by Airbus technology and in trying to catch up they have re engineered the Model T Ford. The Chinese have got the Comac C919 which will be serious competition for the 727 Max. Never dismiss Chinese technology. I have spent a large amount of time here over the last 20 years. |
Originally Posted by Andy_S
(Post 10426720)
Strictly speaking, Garuda have requested cancellation. I very much doubt they can simply walk away from their order.
Garuda have also been at pains to state that they're not necessarily binning Boeing and may look at taking a different 737 variant. |
I'm looking forward to the 727 Max ;)
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Mike flynn once Boeing have a fix for this problem and the aircraft is back in service the general public will soon forget and the 737 will march on for another forty years. |
I can see a rebranding exercise in the not too distant future. |
The culture at Boeing has changed for the worse and probably more of this will show up in the future. They got caught this time but what else has been swept under the carpet?
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Maybe the 737 can be 'fixed', what about the certification process in general ?
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Originally Posted by A and C
(Post 10427709)
once Boeing have a fix for this problem and the aircraft is back in service the general public will soon forget and the 737 will march on for another forty years. Maybe the news cycle in 2019 is much shorter than it was in the 1970s, and you are right, people may forget soon , but I can see , just like the DC10, the Max effectively being restricted to the US market and a few exotic users, while a re branded version will be pushed up ( e.g. the MD-11) . In addition to this, I was just watching CNN where the CEO of Ethiopian was interviewed by Richard Quest , and he declared that he lost confidence in Boeing and cancellation of its Max orders were being looked at. |
I'm not really old enough to remember myself, but I guess it wasn't really smooth sailing for Airbus either in the beginning with theire FBW systems. But I agree it's like comparing apples with oranges, since A320 was state of the art technology back then. But in today's world people forget these kind of things quite quickly.
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