Lufty Cargo Crash in Saudi
 

Sky news reports a crash in Riyadh, any real news on what happened?

27 July 2010 10:42:49
Lufthansa AG Reportdly cargo plane crashes at Saudi airport, Riyadh

Must have just happened as I landed at around 0800z and everything was calm and quiet. Guess they will have to open up 33 Right (notamed for routine maintenance).

Hope all is well. Any idea on type a/c (md11?)?

Lufthansa MD-11 crash landed at RUH, aircraft caught fire and split-ed in 2 half, crew reported to be safe.

Could be LH8460 from FRA which was scheduled at 0920L . It was then meant to go on to SHJ at 1050L and then further on to HKG. If all that is correct then according to Acars that would make it D-ALCQ.

ACARS mode: 1 Aircraft reg: D-ALCQ [McDonnell Douglas MD11]
Message label: ** Block id: @ Msg no: 6e4f
Flight id: LH8460 [FRA-RUH-SHJ-HKG] [Lufthansa]
Message content:-
SBS-1 Callsign: GEC8460

Runway 33L and 33R

recent weather reports:

RIYADH KING KHALED INTL - OERK - RUH
METAR:
OERK 271000Z 32022KT 7000 SKC 41/05 Q1005 NOSIG=
OERK 270900Z 32014KT CAVOK 40/05 Q1006 NOSIG=
OERK 270800Z 34014KT CAVOK 39/06 Q1006 NOSIG=
OERK 270700Z 35010KT CAVOK 38/07 Q1007 NOSIG=
OERK 270600Z 33009KT CAVOK 37/07 Q1007 NOSIG=
OERK 270500Z 31008KT CAVOK 33/05 Q1007 NOSIG=
OERK 270400Z 29006KT CAVOK 30/06 Q1006 NOSIG=
OERK 270300Z 30007KT CAVOK 28/04 Q1006 NOSIG=
OERK 270200Z 30007KT CAVOK 28/04 Q1005 NOSIG=

Whilst obviously very hot, the wind direction and strength would not initially seem to cause any undue concern.

She is the most challenging plane of all civilian widebody airliners with the highest wingloading and fastest approach speeds. Not easy to land at all, even under normal conditions. The Lufti guys belong to the best trained pilots in the industry and nevertheless this happend, a sad day for the industry. Lets be thankfull that they survived.

Pictures below

http://images.alarabiya.net/large_27753_114965.jpg
http://www.alriyadh.com/2010/07/27/img/944508634516.jpg
http://www.alriyadh.com/2010/07/27/img/369145603712.jpg
http://www.alriyadh.com/2010/07/27/img/095475628865.jpg
http://www.alriyadh.com/2010/07/27/img/594700777644.jpg
http://www.alriyadh.com/2010/07/27/img/649127051964.jpg

Glad the crew got out.

Which LH Cargo MD11 had the hard landing gear incident in MMMX... D-ALCO? Was it written off?

I wonder if someone somewhere is attempting to shred some DGR paperwork. Sounds like some cargo went " poof. "

D-ALCO was repaired and back in service.

Aircraft involved in today's event was D-ALCQ operating as LH8460.

The crew reported an in-flight fire in the lower (I think) cargo hold, and the airplane then broke apart during an otherwise-normal landing. Fire service had been informed and was awaiting the arrival.

Wow 6000PIC, case closed then.

Thanks for your brilliantly quick report, it will save Air Accident Investigators the bother!

According Luchtvaartnieuws, a Dutch newsagency, black smoke was coming from the airplane during approach.:uhoh:

official LH statement:

According to the latest reports, a Lufthansa Cargo MD-11 freighter crashed this morning at 11.38 a.m. (local time) in Riyadh, Saudi Arabia. The aircraft, coded Flight LH 8460, was on a flight to Riyadh from Frankfurt, Germany.

The plane was piloted by a two-man crew, according to initial reports. Both pilots are being treated in hospital.

On board Flight LH 8460 were 80 tonnes of freight. It is not yet known exactly what type of freight it was or which customers are affected.

The cause of the accident is still being investigated. At the moment, we have no further details. We will communicate any further information immediately. This accident might have an influence on our operation for the next few weeks. Lufthansa Cargo will do its best to operate a stable flight schedule. Updates are also available at www.lufthansa-cargo.com.
Best regards

Lufthansa Cargo
J. Florian Pfaff
Vice President
Europe & AfricaLufthansa Cargo
Nils Haupt
Director
Communications

good thing the crew survived it. always interesting when cargo catches fire..... hopefully with crew still alive and the cause can be found easily.

Interesting!!!??? guess you dont fly airplanes for a living. NOTHING interesting about a cargo fire. Ive had one. Wasnt INTERESTING at all. :ugh:

what an over reaction. yes i fly planes. it was remark that how can it catches fire. relax

http://www.alriyadh.com/2010/07/27/img/573708880746.jpg

http://www.alriyadh.com/2010/07/27/img/264002989469.jpg

http://www.alriyadh.com/2010/07/27/img/795006927056.jpg

in the USA, a DC8 freighter caught on fire due to lithium batteries in the cargo hold...a great quantity...wondering what the cargo was.

I recall an MD11 (or was it a 10) for Fedex broke apart landing in japan

I understand the plane requires a deft hand in landing...but we've all seen some terrible airborne fires...recall valujet and its crash in florida due to oxygen generators among other things in the cargo hold.

any landing you can walk away from...

from http://avherald.com/h?article=42edca16&opt=0

if you look at the pictures, it would be hard to believe the cargo didn't burn...whether it was the cause of the fire or the cargo caught fire subsequent to another fire will certainly be a subject of investigation.

if we ''wait'', why even have pprune at all? I heard about it on FoxNews.

Did you have a look at the photots on the previous page?

It certainly looks like a fire in the cabin.

Could have been cargo, could have been wiring, coulda been lots a things.

Glad everyone made it.

Maybe the cargo was...lithium batteries. :rolleyes: It was a UPS plane carrying laptop batteries. Made an emergency landing at PHL, Feb 7, 2006.

Where's the aircraft now? Normal Riyadh procedure is to pull it off the runway a few hundred feet, and let it sit for 20+ years.

Isn't the point of a "Rumour Network" to, er, well, you know postulate ideas, maybe hazard a guess, you know that sort of thing? After all there's absolutely no compulsion on your part to read or comment, is there? If others want to give it a go then aren't they living up to the name of this board?

Otherwise we should rename the darn thing - "Professional Pilots Facts Only Network"....

I dunno', it's getting rather tedious seeing people complaining all the bloody time about the fact that people are posting opinions, which is the point of the board in the first place.

- GY :ugh:

Looks like a fire mid cabin. Not much you can do but, put it on the ground ASAP or send a crew member back and try an combat it. Not a nice scenario both ways. Good job by the crew of getting it on the ground and I hope they recup. soon!

very well put Garage Years:ok:

She is the most challenging plane of all civilian widebody airliners with the highest wingloading and fastest approach speeds. Not easy to land at all, even under normal conditions. The Lufti guys belong to the best trained pilots in the industry and nevertheless this happend, a sad day for the industry. Lets be thankfull that they survived.
http://images.ibsrv.net/ibsrv/res/sr...er_offline.gif http://images.ibsrv.net/ibsrv/res/sr...ons/report.gif Cws, you coudn't have put it better ! The MD 11 is the most unforgiving airliner in history. The statistics are a testimony to that.
http://images.ibsrv.net/ibsrv/res/sr...eply_small.gif

Perhaps FedEx's new main deck fire suppression system will turn out to be a wise investment after all:).

Evanelpus
 

Thank you Sir,

Spot on

NS

What happened to the rh inboard aileron?

@gazin

Fedex has fire suppression (i.e. halon) for maindeck as well?
Do they have a solid smoke barrier or a curtain solution?

htpaccv.
Fedex have both solid bulkhead & net/curtain configured MD11's but most are net/curtain. The fire system is for containerised freight.

I never understood why a cargo plane like this one, does not has a loadmaster or some other crew member on board. He could finish a fire like this if he was fast enough to reach te ignition point, :rolleyes: and help the crew of a big widebody in something else if it was necessary...frankly, it's a big plane and lots of cargo for two men...:{

HatzerimMoney. It's the same reasons that busses and trains have less staff and why there are less cabin crew and so on around the world.

I understand that...but shouldn't SAFETY be there first? :suspect:

Hatzerim,

Just FYI, 80 tons cargo is not too far from max cargo so even if there was someone else on the aircraft, getting back to where the fire was (presuming you could even find it) would be difficult - at best. A fully loaded MD-11 does not leave much room to go for a stroll.

Also, on this flight, there happened to be two crew. Sometimes there are more. Loadmasters are "typically" used to load the freight but may not travel with the aircraft for operators like Lufthansa Cargo. That said, sometimes additional crew are on-board, but I think you are being overly optimistic to think that someone is going to be able to squeeze by all of those pallets and containers to fight a fire aft of the wing, presuming that is where it started of course.

The guys did the right thing. Land Immediately. Fortunately, they were in a position to do that and not somewhere out over the Atlantic. If that were the case, we would possibly be telling a different story.

Safety?
 

Hatzerim

It's not only money, where's the safety having a 'loadie' sitting about waiting for something to happen. He sure isn't needed to load or unload the a/c. Even if the cargo did catch fire if it were containerised he'd have a hard job even getting a probe anywhere near the source, and how would he know where the source is? Some years ago BA were forced to stop flying the 747 combi as the UKCAA insisted that if the cargo was mixed with pax on the main deck then a fireman (not a pretend fireman) was positioned on the pax side of the bulkhead in full fire gear for the duration of the flight. Now that's safety-and the airline decided double quick time that it wasn't worth the hassle.

You have to be proportional in all of this. How many fires per thousand hours etc etc. I'm no actuary, those people are paid far more than pilots to figure out the risk v profit.

S

"I dunno', it's getting rather tedious seeing people complaining all the bloody time about the fact that people are posting opinions, which is the point of the board in the first place."


Couldn"t agree more, it seems like other peoples suggestions or ideas are becoming Personal Insults to some, so what if there wrong, it"s an open forum after all, it"s a place where people can Toss around ideas and hopefully learn something. When i looked at the Pictures i came to the view that it wasn"t an Engine Fire, but i could still be wrong, no need to Blast me into Cyber-Space because of it.

I am so glad my company uses loadmasters on most of our flights, obviously it keeps me in a job but more importantly, there as the first line of defence.
It has to be said though, the MD-11's attrition rate is rather unsettling. That's not assuming the aircraft itself was at fault here.