Tell you what 1 2 Go, and VM, have a read at what JH has just written in the BWA forum - them come back in here and appologise !

1 2 GO, Do you really believe this is the result of a well-planned, pre conceived operation, that is now coming to light?

If that is TRUE, yeah, go for it! My only advice to you is that you must be damned sure you are right, both in your facts and your targets. If not, you will only compound your current woes and you stand to lose the’ shirt off your back’.

If you can prove subterfuge, then go for it with all of your collective strength, but again, be warned that the greater the number involved will offer none of you any added protection. The courts will happily distribute their punishment on all that participate.

Tread carefully guys, for goodness sake. Stick to facts and act accordingly.

What a sad day,
fond memories of junior piloting at SND
back in the Viscount days, happy innocent days; Viv, Pete T, etc, grand folk :-)

good luck folks,

Puritan
As I said we need to uncover the truth whatever that is. I didnt say JH had anything to do with it and I have just read his post.
To be honest I dont know what to believe at the moment and nothing would surprise me.

Thanks Holt CJ
Lets all keep an open mind right now and not rule out anything.
Good night :)

Holt CJ...fair comment , maybe you know the law better than I do<s>

As to whether I heed my own advice...absolute BOLLOX. I have not been abusive, nor wrongly accused anyone here, so go back to your lawbooks...lol...Sheesh, I have more faith in the English Law than to believe rantings on here

Who was born yesterday?????

Holt???...what are you doing here on an aviation forum? Go play elsewhere, where you may have something to contribute. Spit the dummy?...You will know when I do that, friend<s>

Soddit, I can't agree more. read my postings; have I not been urging tolerance here?

HCJ has been winding up the fair discussions here...go look. I reckon he/she could well be a first year law graduate/frustrated pilot...
[ 16 December 2001: Message edited by: Horatio ]

[ 16 December 2001: Message edited by: Horatio ]

Speaking of unanswered questions, it now becomes very clear why the news of the BWA aircraft being impounded at STN was repeatedly buried on PPRuNe; was it five or six threads that disappeared in short order?

I guess it is only natural that the PPruNe administrators who have close connections with BWA would exercise their powers to bury that news and offer what can now be seen as obvious attempts to limit the damage, dressed up as an explanation of an alleged BAA error.

We know better than to expect fairness in editorial decisions here, but could I just enter a plea on behalf of other airlines named in connection with rumours of impending closure or financial difficulties, that you treat them as sympathetically as you have BWA?

Not a lot to ask, really...

Snooze et al; You cry foul and state editorial censorship and unfairness. Look how long this post is. Lots of people up for libellous comments, yet this has not been withdrawn.

When are you guys gonna grow up and smell the coffee. The world doesn't owe you a living - far from it.

The thread seems to be becoming somewhat hyperactive, I have read all related posts, and if all concerned have acted for the common good then none should be afraid. All we do is pass in hand evidence to the appropriate authority. None of us are founding any civil action, we are mere messengers. :)

[ 16 December 2001: Message edited by: Only A Few More Seasons ]

OAFMS

Am I right in thinking he had a not too disimilar bad smell? :(

Black Beauty

Not sure of your thread there are you talking of convict/Aussie bad smell?

OAFMS

[ 16 December 2001: Message edited by: Only A Few More Seasons ]

This topic seems to be getting away from the Nitty Gritty.

An earlier posting referred to BWA balance sheet showing £40M of assets. I would be interested to know whether this included World Aviation Support?- as if not I cannot see where the 'assets' came from.

Similarly if HSBC had debts totalling £1m on BWA alone, exactly what were those debts secured on?
More questions.... :confused:

As I understand it, BWA's sole assets were a couple of (one would assume) fully depreciated BAC1-11s and a load of BAC1-11 spares and tooling. I have been informed - and I'm not sure how reliably, so make of it what you will - that the spares and tooling for the other aircraft were leased or alternatively owned by WAS.

Is WAS a 100% owned subsidiary of BWA plc - and if so, what are its declared assets? Who is in the picture to buy it as a going concern - and do they have any links to the new company that has been discussed?

This situation sounds very much like that of Gill Airways, where banks provided funds against cashflow - effectively on an unsecured basis.

If HSBC was aware that BWA had lost its two European contracts (with substantial amounts owing); and that the West African flights were having to use OM's aircraft because the 757 had insufficient baggage capacity, then it is obvious that the cashflow against which the bank was relying for its debt service had, to a very large extent, disappeared. Under those circumstances it is not unreasonable for them to pull the plug.

As to whether or not anything improper happened - well, it depends on what contracts have ended up with the new company. Certainly, those that were lost - and left BWA with bad debts - were not taken over; though it would be interesting to see if any commitments for next summer that should have gone to BWA (and perhaps convinced HSBC that there was light at the end of the tunnel) have been diverted to the new company.

WAS is a 100% owned subsidury of BWA and I think you will find they leased the hangers so the asset position is a total fiction.
This is probably why the auditors bailed out.

If they were trading whilst insolvent and setting up a company in the background I would imagine the city regulator will have something to say as this is serious stuff

A group of us looked at buying BWA about a year before it was floated. I remember our accountant couldnt stop laughing for a week after he had studied the books. You people who have been affected by this might want to dig back a long time to see where all this started

itchypuss, regards the beginning of your second paragraph of your posting on page 3 - Are you privy to some facts that the rest of us aren't ? If not how about placing a little more empasis on the IF ?!

Ah, thanks for that (hence the edit), you've just answered my question. So it might be fair to say that there were some questionable financial 'doings' occurring well before the newest group of directors took office ? Because that would then account for why so many directors seemingly came and went, i.e. it looked good (but who made it look good ?), they joined, then found out the truth, and left.

[ 16 December 2001: Message edited by: Old King Coal ]

Old King Cole

Look back at the people who made a great deal of money out of the bizzare reversal into an underware company that was the BWA floatation. You people need to go for people with assets if you are to gain anything from this. You might want to look at the broker who masterminded the floatation as well.
Enough clues yet