-Entering my last year- blues
 

I am entering my last year as an airline pilot.
For a few years till now I thought, no matter how much I like the flying part of my job, that it was time to go. I couldn't care less if I they had me retired on the spot.

The life, the jetlags, the always from home missing important issues, my life governed by my roster, I had enough of it.

But now I have been hit hard by the hammer that tells me in one year no more X-wind landing a 744, no more nice hotels, no more surprising events, no more fun in some bizarre country with a youthful crew, no more sightseeing in countries one will probably never get to privately.
No more rostering to terrible destinations, that turned out to be unforgettable trips.

Get me right, I have enough hobbies, interests that can get me past 100 years of age, and some. That is not the problem.

I don't want to rate it as a crisis, but when I look at other pilots that went before me, I see some stunning things happening in a wide variety.

Guys that scr@w up a clean career by doing some stupid flying mistakes with retirement approaching, get divorced after all, (after a long marriage), do weird things.

What is going on in this last year, will be glad to hear about others......

Hi, I retired just over two years previously, after an obsessive career when nothing but flying and aviation mattered. A truly wonderful time and yet on the very last flight it was just fine. I walked off into a new life that is every bit as full and rewarding. A super wife, dog and home and new things to learn and discover about myself and the world around me. I moved from town to country and slowed down to a pace that is still lively but now I control it. Without those wonderful flying days I would be lost but now they are a warm and solid memory that will always be there until I die. A much emptier life without those times and experiences. Now when I look up at a contrail in the sky, I nod and give thanks to have been there and to now hand over to others whilst I enjoy a new stage and adventure that is part of life and growing older. Enjoy all those opportunities denied when in harness. Best of luck and happiness.

:D :) :ok: ;)

And that's what I call "perspective." Great posts. Long and happy retirements to both of you.

Upperecam
That is what I guess, or hope, will be my case as well, but it is still quite sometime to go. Once I looked forward to it, now I am in doubt whether I should be joyful.
I enjoy my trips now more than I did last few years, maxing them out on all aspects. I will miss them for sure.
Yes and I DID forget emotions getting mixed with getting older in general, with its pro and cons....
Indeed I have retired friends that lead a full life with no problems, but although most want to swap with me once, if only for ONE trip....just to be there again...

My uncle Bill retired in 2004 after a long career that started in C-130 gunships in Vietnam and ended in 767's flying internationally.

He decided he wasn't through yet. He got a job flying a Learjet. He has since swapped jobs and now flies a Citation and a King Aire for a medical services company.

He's home most nights, off most weekends and loves his job. I've never seen him so happy. The pressure's off, I guess....

Anyway, good luck Double Back.

What a terrific thread! :D

I'm currently "computerising" all my flying log books. A task that is taking much longer than I thought, because of all the memories of names long past, and trips that, on reflection, were very varied in their enjoyment-level! :ok:

Despite all the trials and tribulations of a modern aviation career, I still realise that I'm very fortunate to be doing something I've always wanted to do.

For what it's worth, Double Back, I think you latched-on to what matters quite some time ago, whether you realise it or not.

Enjoy the last year; when my time comes, I hope I approach the end of my career with a modicum of your good grace.

P.S. Someone else will no doubt be able to point you (and I) to it, but Rick Drury wrote a fine piece about entering retirement. Anyone able to post it?

No more:
...going to bed at 10am, getting up at 4pm, living in a hotel room, waking up in a country so far from home it may as well be Mars, (occassionally) having to fly alongside people you don't know/don't like or who don't meet your own professional standards, worrying if the latest piece of legislation introduced to cover the 6 o'clock of the industry is going to land you in the dang, being called in on a standby shift an hour after going to bed.......
The list is endless.

There is absolutely no doubt that you've thoroughly enjoyed your time with us, but you've got to ditch it all sometime so do so when the first opportunity arises and all the best for thoroughly enjoying a real life!:ok:

Well my compulsory retirement age was 55. I was tired and half looked forward to it, although with a lot of concern- I'd lived aviation since I was 17, and wasn't sure how much else there was to life. I wanted my life back, and it was great....for about 3 months. Then the marriage was in trouble, and I started missing the life greatly. So after a gap, I went back to work and really enjoy it. It's what I do- I'm no good for anything else, and frankly, golf bores the living tears out of me. It's a life I like, and want to be in as long as they'll let me. I'm working hard to be fit in the hope I'll make it to 65- it keeps the mind sharp and the outlook young. Besides, have you seen how stonking expensive private aviation is?

it is good that you are speaking of this subject, as it is never covered in flight manuals.

I stopped flying the line one day due to an injury...nothing terrible, but enough that I couldn't fly anymore.

No lead up to it, no thinking about it. Glad that my landing was on the better side of OK.

Done.

What do I miss? I don't miss crew scheduling...not one person.

I don't miss any of the mechanics...can't think of a single name...maybe one guy in STL went above and beyond and I will smile.


I do miss some of the flight attendents (girls) , the ones I think of were and probably still are genuinely nice, smart, and charming. (no I wasn't boffing them) Can't think of any of the boys.


I do miss chatting up with a pilot that I hadn't seen in years just walking through the terminal building.


I'll miss the human touches that some provided. I won't miss the well below Zero walkarounds in the snow.

I won't miss management who took my pension away while getting a bonus.

I won't miss how management got a retention bonus while thousands of my brothers were furloughed.

when I see a jet, I might smile...when I see a low cost carrier jet I blame them for many ills.

I haven't been in a plane for 5 years, yet I still know my emergency items by heart.

I promise you, that if you let it, the world of the ground has more delight than the world of the cockpit.

I too will retire at 55, still very young and full of energy. Few years ago I would not even consider to try to get to another airline to roll out a few years longer, but I get to the point that I am looking through the last pages of FLIGHT, just curious, nuttin' else....

As Rainboe states, he got in trouble AFTER retirement, a thing that I also hear, even people get divorced áfter retiring. We too hear stories of guys who just sit home, do nothing else but sobbing over a lost life.

A state I don't want to enter, therefore I started this thread. At least talking about it can do no harm.
Anyway, it keeps me very busy the last months, my mind is running, I want to be prepared.

Indeed it is an area that I never saw any spotight upon, but now I am getting there myself, I am getting uneasy.

Sure, the time will come someday, be it at 55, 60 or 65, I know. That is not the problem, and I had a full career, nothing to be wanted left (OK, I always regret I missed my DC8 position...)

Just a thought on a different angle. My CPL/IR instructor was 69 years old, a retired military and then retired airline pilot. Obviously he had thousands of hours of multi faceted flight experience, and was also a CAA CPL examiner. Before him I had one or two younger instructors, and I am not saying they were bad, not at all, but they weren't as good, either, as him.

I can safely say that I learned more from my retired-airline-pilot-turned-instructor than was required in any book, and more about real world flying which is probably more important than passing the tests, which he got me through anyway. I don't mind admitting I am no ace pilot, and certainly was a poor student, but with a steady hand of experience teaching me I reckon I am ok now, certainly I am a safe pilot. Not to mention the fact that when we had a problem with the landing gear tsking off for one lesson (turned out to be nothing more than a display problem, but at 1000 feet, well you just aren't 100% sure are you?) he took it all in his stride, did everything which could be done, took control and landed lightly just in case. No drama except for the red lorries chasing us down the runway.

If I make it to 69 and am half as good a pilot as he, I'll pass a little knowledge and experience on, I'll try and remember this thread, and hopefully retire fat and happy.

Nice thing from my position is I was looking at 60 and I now have the option of extending to 65 so my aim is, get to 60 then start to cut down gradually. I also still instruct, so aiming to keep that going for fun as long as I can.:)

Double Back. This is the advice I was given. It worked for me.

No matter how long you've been flying there will still be things you put off doing until you get an extra day off somewhere or the weather is better or you're not so dog-tired or you can persuade another crew member along, whatever. Make a list of them. Then make a list of your favorite places in the world you want to say goodbye to - places that mean something really special to you (yes, I know you can afford to go back after you retire, but do it now). Finally make a list of all the people in the airline around the world you want to say goodbye to (yes, I know right now they're sometimes a pain in the ar$e and you see too much of them but you _will_ miss them).

If you're honest with yourself the list will be several pages long - and a year is only just time to tick all the items off.

Then go do it. You'll be busy. You'll get a buzz. The year will fly by and......

....................when it happens, you'll be ready to let go and................

... ready to to play with all the other toys in the cupboard you tossed to one side when you discovered those flying things..........whatever they're called.

Oh! and this is really important, get the wife some flowers and and something with diamonds. Now! She's gonna be your new boss.

One last thing:

Don't listen (just this once) to the Toxic Rainboe. Even he admits you have to retire some time.

Have you seen how long people live these days? The aim is to build a new life to fill the next forty years with as much fun as the last forty - but without the cr&p.

It's a lot easier to do that at 55 than at 65.

The lines above make one realize how fortunate we are in flying as a profession. Pure passion...

- live to fly - fly to live -

Soon to reach the half-century barrier, I'm alreary getting ready... tons of (aviation...) books, helicopter models to adjust, friends to visit all over the planet, trecks to share with my wife, TLC my private plane and fly over the place at my pace, all things I don't have time to do now, almost entirely commited to my work :hmm:


Take care and enjoy, life's short :cool:

im at the other end of the scale. i am just begining my carear flying having just got my first job. its all been at bit of a blur so far, lots of work, but reading your post has made me remember why i got into flying in the first place. thanks and good luck.

Fascinating thread. I retired at 60 after a few years instructing, a few years in aerial survey and a quarter-century operating a corporate flight dept. I, too, wondered how the time would pass.

Since then I have played a lot of golf, done a lot of motorsport, learned the joys of vegetable gardening, registered with PPRuNe to try to contact some of my former contacts.

I miss the impromptu dinners when you have bumped into old friends in some foreign place; I miss overnight stops in nice hotels and nice restaurants with a nice company credit card in my pocket. I really miss some of the views from the big window at the front.

I do not miss getting up at 0400 on a winter morning, to leave home at 0500, to be at the airport at 0600 for departure at 0700.

I do not miss the extra bulls**t imposed by security measures, however necessary; and I do not miss the old days of waiting on a payphone for the Regulator - remember that?

I'm now 68, having a wonderful time, some involvement at my local grass airfield, and enjoying every minute.

It is going to happen, so appreciate your last years then step into the next phase of your life. If it's fun, enjoy it - if it's not fun, try doing it differently.

Good luck.

Just a short addition:

Fly lowcost carrier some years before you intend to retire. It makes it easier to let go!;)

Great advice!!

I'm coming up to my last year and looking at going a few days after my 60th birthday which will give 40 years long-haul flying.

Love flying the aircraft and working with the crews, but the BS factor has gone beyond the edge for me [:ugh: ] and sleep patterns are a hassle.

Plenty to do in retirement, but a mate who's 65+ has just signed on as a Sim Instructor because he never wanted to retire and still has a lot to give.

As noted above, I'm organising my last year to revisit the stuff I've enjoyed with the many friends we've made world-wide, shedding Company responsibility along the way.

Sign a production contract for the new boat Friday...yippee!:)

G'day ;)

Adverse-bump.
Ha, good You read this. When I joined and the (then not seldom ex RAF Spit or bomber pilots) crews were discussing their retirement stuff, I always stared outside somewhat glazed. I thought, man, this don't interest me one penny, I am starting my career, dont want to talk now how to end it.

But the years flew by so quickly, You have no idea, it looked like yesterday I joined, and now myself bald, and experienced, I am now discussing this matter.

But Albert Driver and Feather #3 make a point to which I will react:
See my opening mesg, I mentioned about good guys making big time mistakes with retirement approaching. Sure in every company these things have happened.

No matter however nice I will try to make my last year, I have carved in my mind that I have to be 100% on the ball till I shutdown all 4 for the last time.
Starting to relax a bit already now, can marr one's spotless career, and that is NO nice start of your new life...
But obviously all retirees who reacted got to "the other side" with no problems and enjoying a good life now.

That's another issue I think about. Having (almost)made it with my lifetime company, why get to another one, be lost for a year in getting used to a new company policy(and ditto management, rosterers, chief pilots..), or get yourself killed with some doubtful operator?

I still have my SE/IR ratings, plus instructor, but I lost most company collegues due to GA related accidents...

Double Back,

I don't know if they ever did, but on behalf of the hundreds of thousands, if not the millions of passengers you have flown, thank you for having landed them safely. I don't suppose it occurs that often to most folk, but I often thank the crew (I'm mere SLF myself) as they stand in the doorway getting rid of me off their aircraft!

I've never flown with KLM (if that isn't too much of an assumption), but people like you give people like me a hassle free life, by letting me get to where I need to go, to do what I need to do.

If I were you, I'd look back on my career, and sit back with pride (in a year's time!). You did it!

Have a great last year, and a successful retirement. And a glass of Heineken.

Upperecam:
Just want to say, what a fantastic post.
When my time comes, I can only hope I have your attitude towards retirement, I still have 21 years to go, but I can imagine with an outlook like that, you were good fun, both to fly with and on the overnites!
well done mate, and best of luck.

Flying is not just another job - it is a way of life and one that often is difficult for others to properly comprehend. Many have their heads in the clouds; but for those who have spent their life in the clouds things are very different. The sense of loss when forced to hang up your cap, particularly due to advancing years, is palpable.

Enjoyment (of flying) is so much magnified by being able to share that enjoyment with others but in this business, perhaps due to its somewhat recondite and technical nature, that sharing is not always possible when not in the company of aviators. Couple this with a marriage which may have worked well enough for any number of years on a "9 to 5" basis but when suddenly confronted with a full-time load, begins to reveal stresses from unsuspected incompatibilities and you head in the direction of the dissolution of partnerships. Sadly, this is not uncommon following retirement from any profession but I suspect is more prevalent in our game.

I've been through it but regret I have no particular wisdom to impart. I think that to develop an alternative and absorbing interest that can be shared or generate interests that can be pursued individually (although not necessarily mutually exclusively) some time before retirement provides a much softer landing when the day comes. In this way the transition becomes less painful and with a more positive outlook on the future.

Retirement often is regarded as a downhill sort of thing. Rubbish! It is a wonderful opportunity to involve yourself with all sorts of things for which you previously had no time but can now pursue with as much enthusiasm as you like and without fear of being invited to have another McVitie's Rich Tea in the Chief Pilot's office. Blissykins!

Good luck to all of you. :ok:

Those are all interesting observations.

It is one thing to have worked so long in the industry, for an airline which was worth working for.

Many of the FOs with whom I fly would like to be in another business, or at least work for a quality operation, such as FEDEX or Southwest. Some of them are leaving at ages 37-45. Years ago this would have been unheard of. One is studying to become a nurse anesthesiologist, and with a little experience will make a much higher salary than as FO on a major airline 100-seat jet.

The people who have corrupted, weakened and turned so many US airlines into a commodity industry have damaged it in the long-term.

How will it be?
 

Well a lot depends upon you. There are people who can't let go and there are people who can.

In my case flying was an intensive time lasting through RAF (to 30) Major airline (to 55) Startup airline far away (to 57) LOCO in UK and then "abroad" (to 60) and then...

Retirement!

Many things then change - number one, you are at home all the time and interfere with the daily routine of the person(s) who has spent years coping without you. This takes patience and adaptability on both sides to deal with.

You wake up at 04:00 and realise that you don't (ever) have to get up and shave and scrape off the ice and drive to work. It's a nice feeling.

You hear / see jets and (this is where it varies according personal makeup) either you think "I know what it is like and I don't need it now" (my case although I loved it at the time) or you feel "I wish I could still be at the controls" (some friends of mine).

You don't forget all the skills and experiences which were, during your career so vitally important - and made you important too - which now count for nothing - and you might regret that initially. Try to keep the knowledge that "you can do it" in the bank as a confidence booster.

You have a need for something intensive to take the place of your intensive job. Actually this is not such a problem! You can dust off your old bike / skis / lathe / walking boots / sports car / spade / dinghy and get in some quality time. You will slow down in good time - meantime enjoy the activity.

Your life is not ordered by a schedule. So it is actually quite important, after the initial luxurious lazy period, to make your own schedule. Try to get one useful thing achieved each day, even if it's ringing Mum or ordering your paperwork. Pretty soon a meaningful routine will be achieved.

Have something to look forward to. If you like travelling - plan a trip. If you like your home, plan some work on it and the garden.

And here, let us say that PPRuNe is a good way to keep in touch with the old life and mates (though the internet shouldn't be allowed to soak up all your valuable time!)

Lastly, enjoy this last year - remember the good things, laugh at the bad ones - there is only a year of them to put up with.

Good Luck,

FC.

retirement
 

What a great thread...I nearly cried. Aviation being about passion tends to have passionate people.
Good luck on your retirement guys and rather than keeping the nose up......keep your pekker up instead :-)

as others have said...what a moving and touching thread.

thank you double back and others for sharing your thoughts with us..

i guess whether you are one or the other of those..'' the glass is half full/ the glass is half empty ''..has a lot to do with how we each handle this....and by the way double back..even those of us who have given years to teaching others to fly have similar feelings about ever giving it up...except its not quite so dramatic in that termination is a voluntary ( unless medical ) thing...but we all, i feel, identify in one way or another with what you have said...

reminds me of a most moving post brilliantly phrased ( i'm not good at searching ) penned by a us pilot who had just retired and going to work that day with sears if memory recalls correctly some time back here on pprune.

posts such as yours and the other contributors and well wishers serve to remind us how privilaged we have been...to take to the skys...see the sights we have seen...and be a part of a band of brothers ( masculine and feminine ) apart...

good luck to you...:ok:

gear up.

the dean.

Well, I retired six months ago (fed up with it all, really). I gave myself a year to make my mind up and let the idea sink in for me and my wife.
One day, it was all so easy. Only three serious unknowns: not being terribly important any more, the money and the Last Flight.
The money has worked out very well and the Last Flight was easy. I didn't even cry.
I was very lucky, having been a sim person for some years. Now I can pick and choose my sims and continue to give new pilots Skill Tests or LPCs. I keep my hand in and am still terribly important. Gradual let-down.
Good luck.

I knew it!
I waited a long time before I found courage to post my thoughts. I am not an active poster, more of a lurker.
I feared it would drown between all these posts of incidents/accidents and management wars, because we are hardware oriented people and we tend to shy away from our "soft spots".
But finally I thought, what the...., I just go for it.

Most of us, including myself, have some macho resistance to open your self up, especially in a worldwide read forum.
I was taught to fly in an era that considered anything they did not comprehend, as softy or weak. A pilot needed to be strong, had no doubts, made ONLY right decisions.

Now back to reality.
Over the years I saw that keeping too many thoughts to oneself, is no good at all.
Any large company had pilots leave the job because of psychological matters, or even lost them due to dreadful actions of that person.
Many of these have or had introvert characters, luckily I am not.

As already has been said, there is no company or flightmanual that has a text in it how to cope with it. These books are our Bibles, we were taught to live by them, yet they do not cover all.
But sooner or later it affects us ALL, or HAS already affected our lives. That was the main drive for me as topicstarter. I just want to know about others, an not only in our company.

Heartwarming indeed to find so many positive reactions, also from people not even employed in aviation as Roadster280 did. No, I didn't fly millions, but a lot yes. I take your compliments as one of the many that do the trick everyday, safe and comfortable, with great pride and respect for nature's laws.
Too easy it is forgotten that it is not a trick that comes all by itself, even we ourselves tend to forget that. And then a few times a year this proves to be wrong with a terrible outcome and the loss of many lives.

Rostering just called, reserve duty tomorrow swapped for a Shanghai in the afternoon, sunday back.

Never a dull moment...see, that's what I will be missing......
Maoming Lu, here I come!

Great post guys, i am in my last year too and I am in away heartbroken to leave a career that has provided me with my life and has been my life.

Just leave you all with some of my thoughts. I have been saddened to see how our profession has deterioated over the years. The BALPA non reaction to budget airlines has i think been very poor. I believe the captain of a jet airliner should be in the same salary league as a doctor. I also believe the CAP document on fatigue of aircrew needs completely re-writing, there are too many tired pilots flying around. there also needs to be a stricter control of when roster control can contact pilots and connecting that contact with duty start.

The two guys at the front should be the only thing non-budget in a budget airline because the flying public still demand the same saftey, whatever the airline.

There are too many airline directors who do not understand the unique importance and value of pilots. Management has been looking for a big stick for many years to deal with pilots and it arrived via budget airlines.

Budget airlines have been a great boost to the industry but have done great long term harm to our profession.

Fly safe

As someone said to me once:
If you find yourself missing the job just set the alarm for 1am. When it goes off get dressed, take the clock downstairs and sit in the understairs cupboard watching it by the light of a 10W bulb for the next 8 hours!
There's a load of whinging in this job but the bottom line is that the vast majority love it to pieces, warts & all.

One of the nicer threads here on pprun
 

I really like this thread, brings back some of my childhood memories. I always wanted to become a pilot, With age 10 I could spell in the ICAO alphabet (I learned it, because I knew I will need it someday).
Today I am in my 40th. I fly. There is not much I like any more in my job . I am ready to give up this profession. And I don’t think I am the only one.
Wondering if we will read posts like these in 20 Years from now?

Best Wishes
 

Double Back - Best wishes for the day when it comes. As a relative infant at this game, I only hope that you will not also 'retire' from the pprune forums. With such a depth of knowledge, experience and perspective your viewpoints will no doubt make up for the ever decreasing opportunity to absorb that knowledge and experience in the comfort of the 'crew room' environment. I am a firm believer in learning from the experience of others, so when you finally cut the last fuel switch make sure you don't cut the computer lead too. :ok: :D

I made my last commercial flight just over one year ago, some 49 years after going solo. I have always been blessed with good health and I made it to 65. My last flight was just as enjoyable as the first one. It turned into a bit of a farce for the organisers - the pair of regulation fire engines turned up on the taxiway as advertised to create a water-salute for me to taxi through but they could do nothing as it was 0400Z, the temperature was -4°C and the aeroplane had to do a quick turn round after I got off!

I really thought that I would miss the aeroplane and the lifestyle desperately but it hasn't worked out that way.

Luckily, I have a little aeroplane and I am having great fun rediscovering grass airfields around UK that I haven't seen in a very long time. I also enjoy taking friends who are much older than me and who have lost their licences out for the day. A few weeks ago I did a flight where the total age of the four of us came to 308!

Like some of you, I am still pretty active in the simulator. I managed to stay retired for three months before my old company found the entrance to my escape tunnel. I am still training young pilots and that keeps me on my feet. Life is pretty good.

Hey Pop,

Maybe there should be a Retired Pilots Forum on PPrune so we can keep these postings away from all those that are working so hard to pay the retirees pensions.
You can't expect them to fly with all those tears in their eyes. :{


;)

You obviously missed the second smiley, FC

FAs?

I think there should be a special fund for those poor Bs who had to fly them.

You need 420 kts min.

Thanks
 

What can I say, I have just read this thread and must say it has left me somewhat touched. Can I echo the thoughts of others by adding my thanks for the many happy landings......

Yes, I am a mere SLF - and a Tourdriver of a different sort. I got the flying bug a few years ago and still look up to the sky every so often when I see the trans-atlantics shaping up for their early morning arrival at Gatwick and think what if!

The truth is, whilst I have a dream, I don't think I will ever be able to realise it, with middle-agedness and the thought of losing £70,000 if it all goes horribly wrong.

Pure jealousy it may be, but there are very few people in this world that can say that they have truly worked at a vocation which has been their life and had the experiences that you guys have had. So yes, when retirement beckons remember how fortunate you have been, and how fortunate you will be to begin a new phase of your life with your loved ones sharing a drink or two recalling the good times........

Thanks

Double back
As I approached my 55th, I also looked at retirement with doubts. It is a young age to retire and I felt that I was not ready yet. I looked around the market for 55 year old pilots and eventually came up with 6 offers to continue flying as Captain on the B747 ( no type change or bonding necessary). I have been very happy with my post-55 employment, but as I get nearer to 60, I find the constant time changes and inevitable night flights more tiring and take longer to recover from. I am now looking forward to retirement and would like to give you the following advice:-
1/. if you would like to carry on, make sure your licence, medical and log-books are up to date. There are jobs out there for you, it all depends what you are prepared to do, such as relocate or fly 17 - 19 day patterns.
2/. if you do retire, your wife will assume your rostering duties and you will not get the time off that you enjoy between trips now! So chocolates, flowers and champagne will still work with her, as it did in your airline!
Whatever you decide, best wishes for the future.

Not sure what the thoughts on this would be, but for DoubleBack and others who are soon to retire from flying - is there a possibility of starting a program within your airline for soon-to-retire pilots? A program to help them deal with the transition from flying to retirement, a program that assists in finding ground jobs within the airline (if thats what they want) etc, a program of how to deal with being a full time husband (or wife) :E etc? I know its all a bit "touchy-feely, warm & fluffy" etc but it could be a good way to keep you busy, keep your finger in the airline pie, and assisting others who are soon to go through their last year too.