NON UK PASSPORT HOLDERS SHOULD GO!
 

I beleive that the UK Govt asked all Airlines for lists of non UK passport holders working as aircrew. As in the USA, should all of the above be given a 12 month period to leave their flying jobs in the Uk? If not non UK passport holders how about non EU passport holders. There seems an awful lot of "foreigners" in Uk jobs at a time when we have Uk pilots facing unemployment. Now, I don't believe this to be xenophobic just a natural step to protect the UK indusrty. After all, if this was in the Southern Hemisphere or USA all Europeans would be told to go! When times get better and a UK or Eu citizen cannot be found to fill a vacancy then we can consider looking outside the EU.

Retreating through long grass awaiting barage!

BB,

have you given it a seconds, no half a seconds, thought what would happen to the UK pilot-employment rate if all the worlds pilots with a UK passport would be send back to your little island. Hundreds of high flyingtime very experienced pilots would swarm the market looking for jobs that will certainly not be yours.

Good luck with protectionism. It never worked so far but you never know ....

Sq

Idiot !!

I think you've got the wrong end of the stick, BB.

I suspect that, rather than wanting to protect our jobs, it's a security measure in time of war.

Your overt xenophobia does you no credit at all, either. Removing "foreigners" from jobs in UK airlines will not protect the industry.

My last airline had upwards of a dozen nationalities working for it. And it was the better for it. I worked with Libyans, Iraqis, Swedes, Norwegians, Finns, Spanish, French, Dutch, Greeks, Bruneians, even Irish ;) and I can think of no better way to promote international understanding and harmony than to work and make friends with people from all origins.

Unfortunately, as in all times of conflict, innocent people get caught up in things. I am seriously concerned for some of my former colleagues, many of whom have lived in this country almost all their lives.

Furthermore, I know of many, many Brits working elsewhere in the world. Many other countries are suffering the fall-out of the 11th. September. If they are to lose their jobs to "locals", then we are back to square one here. You think that's a good result, to uproot people all over the world, to disrupt their lives any more than is already happening?

The barrage you get will not have its roots in your opinions but rather in the poor logic and prejudiced manner of your thinking.

Xenophobia raises its ugly head again, it seems.

For a start, virtually all pilots flying here either have the passport or the right to "live and work". Only a tiny minority do not.

Second, times are tough all over the world, and I have yet to see the commonly-blamed Southern Hemisphere countries throw out Brits who are working out there (they never have, to my knowledge).

Third, what we have in this country (UK) are not "British" jobs, or even "European" jobs. They are jobs for which employers seek the best qualified and skilled applicants. Living here confers no rights whatsoever regarding jobs of this nature.

It seems that some Brits are the last to realise that aviation is a global activity, with a global workforce. Instead of whinging about a "foreigner" getting "their" job, wannabes (for example) should try making themselves attractive enough to an employer that they can get that job on merit.

Finally, it shows a callous disregard for those you would uproot in your quest to protect "British" jobs.

:mad: :mad: :mad:

My Kiwi Dad and a lot of other colonials spent from 1939 until 1945 in and around UK/Africa with Monty helping "take jobs" off you Brits.

Funny we never heard anyone complaining about their presence then??

What a short-sighted view!!

Hey BavarianBoy,

You are a sick puppy. I can't believe they let you fly a plane, or maybe they don’t anymore. With a mind like that you're liable to do anything.

Get some help!!
:mad: :mad: :mad:

Bavarian Boy may not have said things in a very well thought out way but I know what he means.However not a day goes by now that the subject of conversation on the flight deck is about the dozens if not hundreds of Australian, SA and New Zealand accents heard flying a/c for mainstram UK carriers. There is no level playing field as the average British pilot can not go "down-under" to work but any body with vague ancestoral rights can come here and steal a seat. It is almost immposible to work in France,Germany or Italy if you don't speak the local language AND hold a licence issued by that state. The airline I fly for has an Australian/Italian who until he arrived at our airline had never set foot in Britain- now he occupies a right seat that I believe he should not. End of story!

Jacksman,

Can't help it if you can't speak any other languages.

You should have got yourself a real education. ;)

CAPTAINSQULECH,FIREWALL,HUGMONSTER AND RAWDATA,

WELL DONE, PEOPLE LIKE BB LIVING IN DARKNESS, JUST WOULD LIKE TO KNOW WHAT UK PILOTS LIVING AND WOKING ABROAD THINK OF HIM.
THE ONLY WAY FORWARD,(BB) IS TO GET WHATEVER FLYING JOB YOU CAN GET AND GAIN ENOUGH EXPEREINCE, MAKE YOURSELF MORE ATTRACIVE TO THE AIRLINES.

Jacksman, how easy do you suppose it would be for anyone else to hold down a flying job in the UK without speaking English? I'm not talking about Aeronautical English, which won't exactly get you very far away from the R/T, but English as she is spoke?

Furthermore, your post assumes that, because you can't get a job elsewhere, nobody can. This is arrant rubbish. I know of many Brit pilots in the USA, Canada, Oz, NZ, etc.

So please stop talking this xenophobic claptrap and wasting our time.

Bavarian Boy who the hell do yoy think you are? I am a Canadian citizen, hold a canadian passport and fly for a major British airline.I have also lived and worked in the U.K for 28 years. so, I ask you again who are you to say that I should be forced to quit my job in favour of you?

For those who say how easy it is for pilots from 'Downunder' to get work in the UK need to check out the UK immigration rules. Only those who have parents or grandparents who were born in the UK can apply to work in the UK. Australia has a "Multi-cuture" back ground and the number of "Aussie's" who fit the UK immigration laws is lower than you think. Out of the 80-100 pilots from "downunder" that I know only 3 would meet the requirements to work in the UK.

I think the name bavarianboy says it all !!!
Ein volk, Ein Reich, Ein Fuhrer! :D :D :D

Jacksman, you are as pathetic a xenophobe as BB. Brits CAN work downunder, god knows how many do already, if you make the points reqiurement for citizenship. Being a professional (sorry, no wannabe's), and speaking English alone qualifies you for most of the required points. The "average " Brit pilot (whatever that means?), already enjoys expatriate status in most countries bar the U.S. And finally, that Aus/Italian pilot you speak of is probably me, so next time , express your views directly to my face, instead of hiding behind your fake little smile, you knob!

I know for a fact that the US embassy has been contacting the HR departments of major airlines in Europe enquiring about pilots of 'middle-eastern origin'. It is bad enough when xenophobia comes from warped and twisted individuals but when it comes from a state body like that it turns my stomach. :(

Ah, yes... WE'RE the xenophobic ones....

Did you notice the title of this thread?

Wow, Huck, you're sensitive, aren't you?

The main thrust of this thread is that the UK government has been asking British airlines about pilots of non-British origin.

If the US government has also been asking European airlines about pilots of 'Middle Eastern origin' or whatever isn't that equally reprehensible? In fact, if anything there is an extraterritorial nature about the US request which is not present in the UK government's asking its own airlines about non-UK pilots, making it more reprehensible.

That's if either of these rumours are indeed true, which they may not be.

As for the silly whingers who have latched onto this to bring up the usual moan about 'colonials' etc. working in Britain, well, that is so pathetic that it doesn't even warrant a response.

[ 30 October 2001: Message edited by: foghorn ]

Barvarian Boy/Jacksman
Good to see such well balanced people, with a chip on both shoulders! Having worked and flown in a few different parts of the globe your attitiudes astound me, a tad insecure are we? What do you think would happen to your company if all the 'foreigners' left tomorrow? I hope I have the pleasure of telling you one day as I beileve we work for the same outfit, see you in a crew room soon!

Grow up and live in the real world. Nation states are bunk.

forhorn, you're likely right that the US is over reacting to the possible threat of middle eastern pilots. However, it's somewhat understandable that the US might be a little sensitive. After all, did not four aircraft flown by middle eastern "pilots" do their level best to destroy human life in the US? Further, was this action not praised by the overwhelming majority of the residents of the middle east?(and by Muslims world wide). The US government would be stupid not to conduct a threat analysis in these circumstances. If any government doesn't wish to cooperate in this effort, no problem: Keep your aircraft outside US airspace. Perhaps in your view the UK should have been more cordial to the German pilots who visited in WW2. :mad:

BB & J'man

Are your willys on the small side or what.

If they aren't then you wouldn't be so gutless as to have to hide in this forum and would say what have done in the open where you could be judged for what you are. :(

Underboost, Your peurile posting displays a complete misunderstanding of the revulsion shared by the vast majority of Muslims worldwide to the events of 11/9.

Bet there are more Englishmen working outside the UK than non-citizen pilots inside the UK.

Be careful what you wish for, you may get it.

I am french, I am holding US certificates, and UK Certificates, which entitled me to ask, and to get a JAR certificate ..
I am presently flying a "N" Registered light twin all across Europe (not necessarily to EU members) My girlfriend is from asian origin, and work presently for a Swiss Airline ....I hate xenophobic ideas

Amazing no ?

@ wassup:

He`s talking about non UK passports! So please don`t start that anti german bull**** again.

regards, erwin (a real bavarian boy)

Here we go again...I rarely reply to this sort of verbal garbage but sometimes it is hard to hold your tongue.

Bavarian Boy must indeed be a sad little wannabe trying to make his way into a grown up world. When are you going to let go of this stupid idea someone has taken your job.

Yes there are Australians and Kiwis working here in the UK, as well as many other Nationalities,and we dont need your permission.

If you meet the imigration requirements ,as we do here then I invite you to go downunder and submit your CV to Quantas or VB. While you are there you may as well check out the regionals as well. If you have the required qualifications and prove to be the best candidate for the job I hope you enjoy a long and happy career. If not you may like to go and get some experience and then try again.

I find it very sad that space on this forum can be taken up by such rubbish and yet we cant use the same space to advertise our unwanted items.

Come on underboost, are you living on the same planet as the rest of us?

SQ7000

Of course the problem with getting a real education in yhe UK is choosing which of the many available foreign langusges to study. Our system gives us the choice of French or French. Not much use outside France.

In the rest of the world, the choice is English or English. Useful worldwide.

And therefore you speak good French, Arkroyal? I hope so, to prove you took advantage of your educational opportunities.

My various nieces and nephews have been offered French, German, Italian, Spanish, Russian, Latin, Greek (both modern and classical), Arabic and Chinese (both Mandarin and Cantonese).

Opportunities do not end at school, either. There are many ways to improve your abilities. Two that spring to mind immediately are night school classes and Linguaphone courses - that's how I've been teaching myself Dutch, for example.

Furthermore, French is of use in rather a lot more areas than France. How about Canada, Suriname, Senegal, Morocco, Tunisia, Vietnam, Cambodia, Guadeloupe, S. Maarten, Martinique...?

All in all, your post isn't much use, is it? Wrong on every count... :rolleyes:

[ 30 October 2001: Message edited by: HugMonster ]

There would be a very long line of unemployed Brit pilots if every country in the world repatriated them.

BB get a life!!

Arkroyal, see if you can get some facts right when you post! :mad:
Rest of the world is only offered English as a foreign language in school? :rolleyes:

In my home country, kids from age 12 upwards can choose between German, English, French and Spainsh at school.
My own kids, living in a different country, can stll choose between English, French and German, or pick all 3 on top of their 2 mother tongues.

The world does NOT end at your national border man!
And anybody working in our industry should be amoong the first to realize that fact, instead of displaying the very ante-deluvian attitudes voiced by some on this thread.

yawn

Well well well, obviously hit a raw nerve with some of you guys and gals.Glad to see so many responses though.
First of all, I am talking about the UK Govt possibly taking the same action as that of their US counterparts.
Secondly, I am not a wannabe or someone under threat of losing their job to a non EU passport holder, thankfully I am pretty safe in my company.
The point is that in the US they seem to be giving non US passport holders 12 months to either get citizenship or leave their flying jobs. The UK Govt may well do the same.
The fact is that I have heard this discussed in crewrooms up and down Europe, how there are significant numbers of nonEU pilots working in the UK and EU while there are suitably qualified EU pilots available.
My apologies if this offends you but the fact is that many other EU pilots think this is unfair. Why should it be allowed in the UK and Europe and not in the US?
It is just a topic for discussion and am glad to see all your responses.

Still in the long grass..... aghhhhh!!

&rse

What with a lot of the correspondents to this thread having apopletic fits at the thought of Britain taking a hard view at non E.U. pilot employment in the UK, it would be most interesting to find out whether they are E.U. nationals standing up against xenophobia, or, perhaps, Australian, New Zealand, or Canadian pilots working here voicing their opinions? Please let us know!

Tosh (from Scotland)

Well BB still:

Good luck with protectionism. It never worked so far but you never know ....

Sq

At my airline, more than half of the pilots are Brits, several of them holding top positions, most of them not even trying to learn the native language. However I never heard any of the locals complain about the Brits taking their jobs away.

'Ecky Thump!
What a load of Horses doovers!
A "few" FACTS
1, I applied for an ATC job in the Antipodes, and was told to "go away!", I couldn't 'afford' it??
2, If I apply for a post in "Greater" Europe, and am not a "Native Language speaker", I stand about as much chance as dating Madonna!
3, ANYONE can live and work in the UK,
BUT it is not true t'other way, unfortunately
I stand to be flamed/corrected :rolleyes:
we aim to please, it keeps the cleaners happy

Tosh - good question! I suspect all their knees are joined together, as they all jerked at once at first mention of the 'x' word. Political Correctness usually goes hand in hand with naivety - they mean well, but will only understand the big picture as they grow older!

ArkRoyal - Agree fully. My Gujarati evening classes start next week.

BB - Got them going nicely! Ref your actual question, I'm not sure that non UK Passport holders should actually have to leave our shores. It would probably be legally difficult to remove someone from a job once they're contracted for a given time. The onus will be on UK employers when recruiting starts again. Of course, you can bet your life the dreaded 'R' word will then appear!