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PIA pilot fals breath test
Pilot arrested after failing alcohol test.
A Pakistan International Airlines pilot was arrested at Manchester Airport after he failed a breath test for alcohol as he prepared for a longhaul flight. The 51-year-old pilot from Pakistan was arrested on Saturday on suspicion of being over the legal limit to fly. The man was due to fly 350 passengers on a Boeing 747 from Manchester to Lahore. A spokeswoman for Greater Manchester Police said that the pilot was bailed "pending further tests" until 24 March, reported the BBC. The flight was delayed for 90 minutes while a replacement pilot was found. No one from Pakistan International Airlines was available for comment. Hope the guy is innocent. Over to you BJCC. Should keep you going for another month or so. |
From the Mcr Evening News.......
Drink cops arrest pilot on plane POLICE at Manchester Airport boarded a jumbo jet moments before take-off and arrested the captain on suspicion of having drunk too much to fly. Officers went into the cockpit of the Pakistan International Airlines Boeing 747 with 350 passengers on board following claims that the pilot had been seen drinking earlier at a nearby hotel. The captain was escorted back into Terminal 2, where he was breathalysed. He was arrested and taken to Stretford Police Station where he provided a blood sample before being released on bail pending the results. Flight PK713, which was scheduled to depart at 10.30am on Saturday, eventually left at 11.54am after PIA drafted in a replacement pilot for the 4,000 mile trip to Karachi and then on to Lahore. The Manchester Evening News understands police acted after receiving a report from a member of staff at the Britannia Hotel in Northenden. A police spokesman said a 51-year-old man from Pakistan was arrested on suspicion of being over the legal limit to fly. No one at the airline was available for comment. In December, Finnair captain Heikki Tallila, 51, from Finland, became the first pilot in the country to be jailed after he was breathalysed shortly before a flight from Manchester to Turkey. |
Is there something special about Manchester that pilots seem to be breathalysed there more than anywhere else in the UK? :confused:
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arrested the captain on suspicion of having drunk too much to fly. |
This is the same Manchester that breath tested two pilots after
a dealing in a minor gear indication problem in an "unflappable" way ?? This after a call from one of their passengers!! |
There are simply too many who are enviously on our profession. Not only in Manchester...
regards |
Yeah, so envoius of us that they don't want to fly with us when we are pissed!! What a bunch of party poopers!
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If there are many more cases like this it will be too embarrassing to admit to being an airline pilot, especially in Manchester!
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It's a fact of Life that some people have a problem with alcohol, regardless of their professions.
It's also highly likely that there are people who are alcohol dependent, employed in jobs where this dependency may well create a risk to other people or persons. A quiet word by one of the other co-employees, suggesting the person step down for the day, would be a far better scenario than that described here. My Father was admitted to hospital for removal of his adenoids and tonsils many years ago, the Doctor (who had obviously also beem imbibing pre-op, judging by the smell of alcohol on his breath) also removed Dad's uvala! |
Unfortunately these incidents are becoming more frequently reported..what's the solution..a ban on drinking down route? Who's to say...but as mentioned above...over do it, call in sick...other guy did it? call yourself in sick
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Must be something in England, MAN in particular, that drives pilots to the bottle...
Seriously though. Alcohol seems to be a much larger problem than I thought it would be. Or has it allways been like this and just the increase in random testing that brings the whole thing to light? Slightly edited for those with no sense of humor. |
looking at it percentagewise it's miniscule, but the press gets it and sensationalizes it......which is good....
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How many negative tests are conducted? We never get to hear about them; from the public's perspective the police have a 100% record. Every time the public hear about a pilot getting breath tested, it turns out the pilot is over the limit. Scary?
M.C. |
In response to Monkey C, the police do in fact publish the ratio of negative/positive tests - particulary at Christmas time. However negative tests are not news so you will very rarely see them published anywhere.
Off the top of my head I think must police forces had about a 10% positive rate last Christmas. |
I'm probably sticking my neck out here, but I think all pilots and cabin crew should be breathalysed at reporting time.
Some may argue this violates our rights as crew, but what do you have to fear if you play by the rules? |
I agree... just as it should be made the same for MP's entering the Houses of Parliament ( imagine how diabolical it might be were they under the influence when voting on matters of State ), and likewise for Judges befor they enter a court, and so to for Doctors & Surgeons & Nurses, and then there's the local lollypop lady, and what about the teachers at my kids school, and the ...... anybody for any more...... we can't be too careful can we ?
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I agree with mandatory testing on arrival. Not to highlight alchohol problems amongst the aviation industry, but to save money. It is far more beneficial for a company to pay for a day off sick rather than replace a fully qualified and competent pilot. Due to the new legislation we all have to re educate ourselves and maybe change, slightly, our lifestyles. As said in other posts the business we are in is not like it was, nor will ever be. Luckily, I am leaving the airline and will be flying for fun from the beginning of March. I am happy to be doing it after 20 years of commercial flying.
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I simply said just because he was a PIA pilot don't assume he's muslim..thats it !
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Interesting thread. Though I hate to see it being turned into a slagging contest. So much has been said regarding the offending PIA pilot being a muslim, that a phone call to Karachi and a PIA pal was in order. I'll try to state the facts:-
1. Yes it was a PIA captain detailed to operate the B-777 MAN-LHE service. 2. Parents- Father (Muslim) Mother (Catholic). 3. PIA has/had employed Christians, Parsis, Hindus, Buddhists etc. A few years ago the DFO was a christian pilot, and other christian pilots have held management positions in PIA Flight Ops. 4. Pakistanis irrespective of their religion like to drink alcohol. Most Parlaimentarians, Judges, Ministers, Bureaucrats, Generals & those occupying the highest offices drink alcohol habitually; despite its being banned for Muslims. 5. Most world class brands of alcohol are freely available on the black market as is the locally produced beer and spirits. 6. An inquiry is being held, and if found guilty as charged the concerned PIA pilot faces dismissal from service. Cheers :ok: |
Not different at all. Just a point to say that they can drink, but don't have to.
As for drinking on duty, that is [as has been said before,] sheer stupidity no matter what your Faith/Beliefs watp,iktch |
***WARNING***
The next muppet to introduce religion into this thread will get an automatic ban from PPRuNe. I am fed up to the back teeth with idiots who ruin anything posted on here with their prejudices and ignorance.
The religion of the pilot is irrelevant to this thread and no thanks to the dipstick who introduced the issue into the debate in the first place, as soon as you did that the thread starts to wander off into the murky arena of spotters and anoraks debating the rights and wrongs of different religious practices. So what if the pilot was or wasn't a Muslim? Have none of you ever heard of secularism? Are some of you so brainwashed by media hype that anyone of a particular faith has to be an orthodox follower of that faith? Give me and everyone else on here a break and go find yourselves an anorak website where you can go and debate your pathetic worries or prejudices and leave us alone on here to deal with every day real issues that affect aircrew. I don't want to see any more posts on the issue of religion and what is allowed or not by it. The faith of the pilot concerned is irrelevant and I'll thank you not to bring it up on this website. Savvy? :* |
This business of the police acting on reports from hotel staff, bus drivers, and the like is becoming worrying. It appears that anybody who wishes to can make a nuisance call, and have a departure disrupted. And unnecessary suspicion directed at a professional going about his work. And unsettle the passengers on the flight. And upset the pilot concerned, who may consequently refuse to operate the flight.
(I am assuming that the police have tested many pilots and had 99% negative results) Is BALPA doing much to ensure that the police act according to a national SOP in this area? |
(I am assuming that the police have tested many pilots and had 99% negative results) Try "the police have tested very FEW pilots and had 99.9% negative results". Once again, take the numbers of pilots taking control of a commercial airliner every day, multiply that by 365 and then compare that to the number of pilots breath tested every day and found to be over the limit and multiply that by 365 and then compare the two results. It's one thing to be breath tested and it's another to be found over the limit. Now we wait for the inevitable chorus of the righteous brigade who will gladly throw away a few more of our civil liberties and demand that every pilot be breath tested before every flight. :rolleyes: In reply will come the other chorus of the statistics brigade who will point out that you can count the number of airline accidents related to alcohol in the last 20 years on the fingers of one hand that has had an 80% amputation. :rolleyes: I think it's safe to say that I'm in the second camp. If you want to guarantee a 100% safety record in aviation... stop flying. :hmm: |
Thanks a bunch Matey (Touch'n'oops)! When you eventually get a job you will regret that suggestion. As you may find out, there are enough plonkers in Aviation Prevention (Security, Cleaners, Airport Operations, Loaders etc...) already. The risk to Joe Public is so small that it is not worth the effort for such a programme. A suggestion like that deserves you to be tested before you drive your car - every day, for life - because that is where the real risk is!
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So far as has been reported then 5 pilots have been tested, and 3 failed. That's 60% fail.
BALPA can try to make Police act is a SOP in that area, but BALPA don't make the decision, the police officer does. In any event is it right that a union should dictate what a police officer can and cannot do? Sorry to say this, but welcome to the real world, where people do ring police about many things, some real, some not. |
Landmark, your mail is full of typos, indicating you may well be over the limit! The police have been informed anonymously, and are keeping an eye on your property in case you should decide to attempt to drive your vehicle in the next 12 hours.
Get my drift? There is nothing wrong with prosecution of drivers who are over the limit, be they motorists or pilots. But there has to be some form of organised procedure to prevent malicious or hoax calls being followed up on every occasion. Public hysteria and media piffle is contributing to this problem. And I was not suggesting a union should devise procedures or laws, simply help the authorities tackle the problem in an advisory capacity from a position of professional expertise. (I am not a BALPA member, incidentally). What does dissing mean? |
Roy Hudd
I think "dissing" is a with it Chav word! Nuff said. |
"Dissing" .... To show disrespect to, often by insult or criticism
I wonder how I've got this far through life without ever running into the word:{ |
Actually I had drunk a half bottle of wine when I typed that, then again, not sure being drunk in charge of a PC is an offence and I had no intention of driving.
Other than the very obvious ones, could you enlighten the emergency services on how to spot a hoax/malicious call.It would save thousands. Somebody rings the police suggesting that a driver/pilot is drunk, then I would think the police are duty bound to make enquiries into it. Imagine the situation if something did happen and it was on record that the police had done nothing..............I think some people on this forum would be looking for the nearest rock to crawl under. |
drinkin
its far too risky to even smell a beer the day before dont care what they do. Dont put yourself in that position. Where could uot turn. Absoloutly :mad:
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I can SWEAR that yesterday i-e Monday I read a post here by the PIA pilot. It was his letter to his Chief Pilot Training, detailing the incident in MAN. It's surprising that the post has been deleted in totality. Yes it had the name of the MAN hotel and other names in it, but still this is denying information and a blow to free speech :eek:
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VVV
I saw the post to which you refer. However, the post, supposedly by the PIA Captain, made some very serious accusations against a named hotel and it's staff. We cannot be suprised if the PPRuNe lawyers were not happy with this. I'm sure that he will be given the chance to prove these allegations in court, and if proved, they would make an excellent defence. Airclues |
...he was complaining that this hotel has changed water for the wine.
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It's surprising that the post has been deleted in totality. The letter did expose another side to the story and let's hope it helps the guy expose the truth |
The post was made but it was decided to pull it as it made certain allegations that couldn't be verified at the time and also had a lot of information including names of private individuals that had nothing to do with the core details of the incident. I will post the edited version here, shortly.
VERY SAD BAD NEWS MY FLIGHT PK716 POLICE ARRESTED CAPT.777 History of PIA Forum Index -> PIA & Pakistan Aviation Discussion Forum View previous topic :: View next topic Author Message umar744 Registered Member -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Feb 8, 2005 Chief Pilot Training PIAC Karach i Reference: PK 716, Feb 052005, Man-Lhe Sir: I had accompanied my friend Mr **** **** (deaf and dumb person), his wife and infant daughter alo.ng with a triend of Mr ****, Mrs **** **** also a deaf and dumb lady with a 9year old son, ****, and F/O **** for dinner at Hotel ***** at 1920 hours. The 9-year old son, ****, wanted roast lamb trom the buffet and I carved a piece for him. As I was doing this, the chef appeared and objected, saying that I have carved a double or triple piece and I was not allowed to do this. I told him that it was for the little boy and left 20 pounds with him for socalled damages although this was a buffet and we assumed that we could help ourselves to the food available there. The chef complained to the police the next morning at 8:40 am after we had departed for the airport at 0830 AM. The Manchester police came to the aircraft at 1010 AM and said that they were arresting me on the complaint of the chef upon whose insistence they wanted me to take a breath test. This was done in the first class toilet, outside the cockpit. Then they took me to the police station for a blood test, as breath tests are conducted for road traffic violations. However, since 1 had not broken any traffic laws therefore it was decided that on the chef's insistence I should undergo a blood test. Please note that the Manchester police officers were unclear as to what specific charges under their jurisdiction they were arresting me for. Although I tried to contact PIA traffic and PIA Operations at Manchester airport, no one was available to me so I could point out these issues to them on the spot or the fact that the Manchester Police had entered a Pakistan aircraft upon the insistence of a British citizen and applied unknown/inapplicable British laws to me. Furthermore, the management of Hotel ***** colluded in this plot to deliberately defame the airline as they provided my flight departure information to the police ten minutes after I had checked out. Given the strained relations between PIA and the hotel in view of past tensions and the early cancellation of contract with Hotel ***** , the management had incentive to defame the airline and its crew. It is quite possible that I was administered something in my food or water and coke over dinner the night before. I would also like to point out that the Hotel management did not approach me to resolve the issue or ask me my version; instead they took the extreme step of involving the police after I had checked out of the hotel. This was a fabricated and premeditated case lodged against me due to racial and religious discrimination and motivated by the desire to defame the national airline. This is being submitted for your information. Capt ***** ***** |
That's an incredible read...
So maybe one has to test oneself now in case the hotel is trying to shaft someone, or a hidden camera film crew is trying to shaft someone... or a receptionist at a hotel gets dumped by a pilot....and guess what... yep she's going to try and shaft him (or him/her) it really is getting silly. I don't think it will be long before pilots check themselves out before report to be sure (even if they were being extra careful thinking they were drinking nothing 24 hours before). I understand that some airlines now have random testing of crew (not CAA/JAA) but the actual airlines themselves. Searching on google for breathalysers brought up a few products, one company of which is now advertising here on prune -Site So even as JAR says, the prudent pilot should not drink 24 hours before a flight it would not have helped the above story if they were slipping him something!!:ugh: FS |
Once again - now the names are anonymous - I know the Captain concerned personally and he is an honest, straight forward, friendly type.
I hope that justice will be done. FC. |
A strange story- the chef (not the waiter or restaurant manager) complains you have taken some extra slices of meat so you give him 20 quid to shut him up - then he reports you! Are buffets really that expensive in Manchester? If it happened to me I would ask to see the manager and try to sort it out with him.
Would the chef really be able to insist the pilot was given a blood test? Normally that is up to the police or you can insist on it yourself. A policewoman friend once told me that if you fail the breath test then it is not wise to ask for a blood test as it normally gives a higher result. |
A policewoman friend once told me that if you fail the breath test then it is not wise to ask for a blood test as it normally gives a higher result. Seen it happen.:uhoh: |
Depends on your stomach contents (food:alcohol), your body mass and your metabolism. The point she made to me was that the breath testers are set very much to underread your alcohol level.
Bit off topic, but worth remenbering when you have an extra shandy and are cycling home from your local!!! |
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