BA CSD's salary revealed in Daily telegraph
 

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I registered and........
 

then I 'copied and pasted' the article for all my friends at pprune!! :ok:


Cash clinic: flight director keeps feet on ground over retirement plans
(Filed: 02/10/2004)


Mother wants to maximise savings and provide financial security for her two daughters before giving up work in five years' time, writes Harriet Meyer

With five years to go until she will stop working, Tineke Tilstra, 55, is keen to maximise her savings in time for retirement.

Mrs Tilstra, from Sunningdale, Berkshire, has worked for British Airways as a cabin service director since she arrived in England from Amsterdam, her birthplace, in 1969. She was 20 years old.

Although she can retire now, Mrs Tilstra, a divorcee, enjoys her job so much she has decided to continue working until she is 60. She said: "It is British Airways' policy that flight crew can retire at 55, but a lot don't want to go.

"I have crystalised my final salary pension, which I contributed to for 35 years, and am happy with it as I have been told I can expect to receive £27,000 a year from age 60." However, she still pays £10 a month in additional voluntary contributions [AVCs], which are currently worth £32,000.

She said: "Once I am 60 I will buy an annuity with the AVCs, but I am not sure which one to get." With her savings and state pension entitlement on top of her company pension, Mrs Tilstra is confident she will have enough to provide for a comfortable retirement, although she is keen to be reassured on this point.

Along with sums in various savings accounts, including £25,000 in an ING Direct savings account, in which she deposits £500 a month, Mrs Tilstra has her home to consider. She bought her four-bedroom home for £186,000 in 1994 and, after some improvements, it is now worth around £480,000.

Those sort of salaries are no more - the staring salary for a short haul CSD at LGW is more like £15,000 basic plus allowances.

The box halfway down the page, which doesn't cut and paste, is labelled 'Vital Statistics' and shows a salary of £48,000.

And arfu-sixpence of what relevance is a LGW SH STARTING salary?

I know for a fact that "basic salary" is only half the story for Heathrow BA Cabin Crew.

Literally.

The other 50% of their take-home being made up in a disgracefully large amount of allowances.

If this Doris is on £48k basic, you can add about the same again in (tax free) allowances, making her total package....

... a disgrace.

(and before the Mathematical Police get on my case, the £27k pension is worked out on basic, allowances not being pensionable, thanks)

48K for serving tea and coffee......any wonder BA is a financial shambles?

I must admit I can't remember when I last saw a (Long Haul) BA CSD doing anything as mundane as serving tea & coffee ("I'll get one of my team to bring you some").

I guess they are too busy being "managerial". (or should that be "majesterial"?)

Knock the girls down a peg or two and then we are next.
Ever heard the saying "a rising tide raises all boats"
For those who find it difficult to think laterally try "think before you open your mouth"

To be fair, crystallising your pension can add around 50% to it's value. I feel this girl has put the time into the company, and she is reaping the just rewards. Imagine working for BA for 35 years, she deserves a medal !:ok:

I'm with fire wall on this. Good luck to her !

Can anyone explain why Tineka Allum (as she used to be known) decided to reveal all her assets in the Daily Telegraph?

all that "hard" work and worry about future preps and then you die.......

Whoever you are and whatever you do, we all end up a pile of bones six foot under! Reality is hard, ay!

Yup.

Ever heard the expression an overloaded boat sinks and drowns everybody?

I too cannot for the life of me understand why she should want to reveal all but it finally silences the bleating from the CC defenders that they only earn x + allowances and demonstrates how grossly overpaid some of them are.

It would also go some way to explain their arrogance and sense of self-importance.

I regularly fly with young pursers who are twice as good for half the money. You’ve got to ask yourself how somebody could get that much money for an equivalent job outside.

It’s a disgrace.

http://www.80scartoons.8k.com/roobarb10wee.gif

I’ll take on the opposition anyday. It’s my management I can’t beat!

Many of BA's staff are of a high quality and commited to Customer Service despite the slanderous comments made by some contributers. BA like most service companies has a wide range of staff with a wide range of attitude. The salaries have been reduced of late and if BA is to survive then ground / flight operations staff will have to forgo pay rises in the future, unless the industry sees a rapid rise in air travel / seat income. I am sure you all agree that the latter is unlikely.

I guess if you put " Director" in her job title then no wonder she gets this type of deal. Anyone in BA should be really worried about the long term future of the company with this kind of non sensible pay deal for a member of cabin staff.

But there's no such thing as a short haul CSD at LGW. Only pursers to keep the costs down. Now imagine how much we'd save if all the £48K short haul CSDs at LHR were replaced with £15K LGW pursers!

it is all a load of c$££p....48K???...probably what the Telegraph paid her to tell porkies..

Having started with BOAC in 70's and earning an average of £500 a month, then working through the ranks to CSD and staying loyal to the Company, gaining all the increments then in my view she deserves to earn such a good salary. She is probably on her original BOAC contract and therefore she can work until she is 60.

And if people want to stay with a Company for 30+ years then good luck to them.

I started with BOAC in 1972 and sometimes wished I hadn't left in 1980, perhaps I would have been on the same salary and conditions now instead of my £1 per hour!!!

Allowances by the way are not part of the pension.

I am sure in her position I would have done the same. It does rather show why, despite the continual whining and moaning about BA as an employer, relatively few of them leave.

One also has to question how a salary of that level can be justified for somebody who has some SEP training, is good with people (well some are) and serves food and drink!

Although from my observations CSDs do little of the latter.

Andy Pandy....HERE HERE. On there grossly over-paid salaries it's no wonder they stay until well past their sell-by date ( and of course it's the vastly exaggerated allowances LH c/crew get that really takes the biscuit....+ of course 'not keen to go there' destination payments !!) - but's that's another topic.

This was a topic I kicked off a while ago about how they could justify the difference in salery between an engineer who can take upto to ten years to train to certification, and cabin crew who take six weeks and then can take home more than the engineer with ten years behind him.:confused: :confused: :confused:

Chicken or Beef := :=

Have you something against 'older' cabin crew??? I detect agism here - also perhaps for once the unions have negociated the various pay scale rises and allowances over the years. I was in another union not so long ago and management would ride 'roughshot' over the crews and they stood back and did nothing.

Don'tdoit;

I beg to differ! 4k a month in Allowances-EVERY month??????? I think not!!! Our better paid trips are SIN's and NRT's. A 9day SIN/MEL or SYD will take out 13days inc Days Off.A NRT takes out 8.IF, and a very big IF, you were to do 1 of those 2 trips again in that month, your allowances may be a third of that figure.

And yes, we are taxed on our allowances!!! Her 48k after 35years on an old contract is probably correct -BUT will include allowances as that's how our P60's are formed.It also will mean she flies a lot in that year and will rarely be sick over all the years to sustain a salary like that.

Boy,I hope she does more than pour tea&coffee for that amount!

FYI, LHR cabin crew are better paid (L.haul),because we fly the routes that trigger more overtime. Nowadays we are lucky to see the better paid trips come around once in a blue moon.:ugh:

This woman is not a criminal - however galling it is to the pilot world, she has been given this money by her employer and did not obtain it dishonestly. You cannot blame her for saying anything else other than 'thanks very much'! These types of salaries are clearly no longer on offer which we all recognise as a good thing. Her package is no more foolish than the old deals on offer to senior BA captains who retire on £75k+ pensions. Nor is is it any more wrong than the many crazy salaries enjoyed by Delta, AA, Cathy Pacific pilots for many years - to name but a few . There is a new realisation in the industry that the 'good old days' are gone, and few would argue with it as they were simply unsupportable economically.

This lady's case is symptomatic of another much bigger problem - countless people including many pilots and cabin crew were historically massively overpaid relative to the income their company was generating. This situation has been further exacerbated by over-generous allowances that in no way reflect what expenses occurred.

Somebody, somewhere must pay the bill for all this - that someone is the passenger and he now has more choice than ever before. The bottom line for any company is that money in must exceed money out. Only once you have established that fact can you then argue about the relative merits of cabin crew, pilots and engineers.

For a start she probably knows how to spell salary :-

More fool the engineers for training for 10 years to earn 30k.

It's like watching dodgy car dealers at the moment at LHR :-

Much sucking of teeth followed by :-

"Can't get the parts chief,can't get the parts"

Good luck to her..... I say

well, think she is worth every penny, if she has to put up with serving the likes of some of the posters on this forum and their petty avarice. By the way the sums are well out and in fact a CSD approcahing retirement age of 55 who is allowed to chrystalise their pension would be on a basic of at least £35 + depending on how many years they had done and this would also mean that another 20k in allowances/flight pay/ovetime etc;

I say good luck to the lady and good luck to anybody who can earn a large sum of money for serving tea or coffee.
If BA paid me that I would look at the pay cheque and laugh my head of at the suckers. Anyway BA are now "paying" for it in high operating costs.
Good luck to all the people who,s only crime has been to accept whats been offered. Sit back and enjoy your high pensions and watch BA go under.
Not long left I say(high price of fuel, high cabin crew wages).

Is it any wonder BA cannot afford the correct number of check in staff.

With National Insurance and Pension contributions she is probably costing BA around £75000 pa!!

747 Astute observations and a view shared by many of us within BA dispite that you may read. However I have to say that we have just been voted seventh in the UK best loved brands via 'Marketing' magazine, a periodical that I am sure everyone is familiar with-not.

HZ123, yes Virgin was voted top!!!!!!!!!!

MR SKINNER

You are quite right, Yes, and more fool the engineers for working solidly for 12hrs through all weathers without breaks when YOU are stuck down the line desperate to get home.

Unfortunately, when engineers decide to try and do something about their income, IE industrial action, Pilot's and cabin crew suddenly find 'nil defects' on each flight!!:mad:
Uncanny that isn't it?

When Pilots and CC take IA the airline stops.

Good luck to you all I say but please don't blame engineers for not being very enthusiastic when they can't find the spares!

The problem is not of their making as has been discussed elsewhere on PPRUNE. :ok:

Andy Pandy
 

quote by AndyPandy-

the relevance, Andy, is that although a long serving CSD managed to get this salary as a result of having joined the BA of old, anyone joing now will never make that kind of money adjusted for inflation) as BA have cracked down hard on the salaries for cabin crew in the last few years.

They also, it has to be said, have a large difference in salary between LGW and LHR the latter getting higher rates of pay).

More importantly does she have a daughter and what does she look like.

I think what galls more people than the amount of money is the attitude of some of these older csds who think and are led to believe that the chain of command on the aircraft doesnt apply to then. They see themselves (encouraged by their management and misuse of crm) as co commanders instead of cabin managers answerable to a commander. I think thats whats causing the animosity to this poor woman and her hopefully pretty and available daughters.:}
Failing that 55 isnt over the hill.:E

Give Me A Break!
 

In her time as an FA/CSD this woman has probably.......
1.Cleaned excrement from toilet floors
2.Been vomitted on
3.Been physically threatened
4.Been verbally abused
5.Discovered a dead pax
6.Dealt with an attempted suicide...Pax/Crewmember
7.Advised a crewmember that a loved one has passed
away.
8.Dealt with medical emergencies..heart attacks,child
birth.
9.Advised a pax that their partner has passed away
inflight
This is more what the life of a crew member is all about.Throw in the safety aspect of the job and she has been underpaid.Not to mention looking after her crew in port.
Coffee and Tea Indeed!!!!

jetjockey7

Do you mean like a policeman?

.....OR A NURSE?

Good God, the rampant jealousy on this thread is almost sick making. Why do you all have such a problem with what someone else gets paid?

You all do a job. Are you paid wenough in that job to keep you doing it? Clearly the answer is yes, so quit harping on about how much CSDs earn

Sheesh

Chips

I am not jealous just sick to death of being told what a mess we are in financially, that we all have to cut more costs and yet we see a bunch of glorified prima donnas walking off the aircraft stranding passengers overnight, when they get to the minute of their industrial agreements, yet being overpaid at rates that many far more able and competent people can only dream of.

jetjockey7

I was a Policeman, paid less than this lady and many of the things that you list I dealt with on a shift basis plus a great many other unpleasent things, never mind during a career. Added to which I had to make decisions at the age of 19 that are bigger than she will ever make. So yes I do think she is over paid.

As regards to is that the norm, well my daughters mother is a purser with BA, according to the Child Support Agency the amount she gets paid (for 50% part time) is not far short of what I get now for full time.