SE England - new mega-airport required soon!!
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Yes Ringwayman,
I am suggesting people overfly Britain to get a better choice of destinations, I do. Heathrow is a nightmare for UK destined conx pax. Both Amsterdam and Dublin offer more UK destinations than Heathrow and as for MAN, unless your destination is Greater Manchester you would be much better off flying to your local airport via a continental airport. Why would I want to travel to Manchester when my final UK destination is Hartlepool, Harrogate, Leicester, Liverpool, Leeds, Nottingham, Carlisle, Wolverhampton, Bristol, Belfast, Cardiff, Edinbrough, Glasgow etc. all of which either have their own airport or one closer than Manchester. UK flights from Amsterdam, Dublin and Antwerp are all less than one hours flying time to a local UK airport which is surely far less congested than either London or Manchester and closer to ones final destination.
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Every man has his price and the incorruptible man the highest price of all.
I am suggesting people overfly Britain to get a better choice of destinations, I do. Heathrow is a nightmare for UK destined conx pax. Both Amsterdam and Dublin offer more UK destinations than Heathrow and as for MAN, unless your destination is Greater Manchester you would be much better off flying to your local airport via a continental airport. Why would I want to travel to Manchester when my final UK destination is Hartlepool, Harrogate, Leicester, Liverpool, Leeds, Nottingham, Carlisle, Wolverhampton, Bristol, Belfast, Cardiff, Edinbrough, Glasgow etc. all of which either have their own airport or one closer than Manchester. UK flights from Amsterdam, Dublin and Antwerp are all less than one hours flying time to a local UK airport which is surely far less congested than either London or Manchester and closer to ones final destination.
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Every man has his price and the incorruptible man the highest price of all.
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Good to see a lively discussion! 
Over the weekend I was talking to my brother in law and we moved on to the subject of increasing the number of runways in the south east and as soon as I mentioned EGSS he baulked at me as if all the aircraft being vectored on to final would overfly his house at 1000'. Unfortunately I didn't dare explain that where he was situated (Hornchurch) there wasn't much danger of that, just the usual activity at 4-5000'. A definite NIMBY 
Next time he decides to moan due to his charter flight to Spain being delayed, perhaps he might like to ponder that one of the reasons for the delay might well be the limited runway capacity vs the ever increasing pax traffic!
[This message has been edited by Crosswind Limits (edited 04 June 2001).]
Over the weekend I was talking to my brother in law and we moved on to the subject of increasing the number of runways in the south east and as soon as I mentioned EGSS he baulked at me as if all the aircraft being vectored on to final would overfly his house at 1000'. Unfortunately I didn't dare explain that where he was situated (Hornchurch) there wasn't much danger of that, just the usual activity at 4-5000'. A definite NIMBY Next time he decides to moan due to his charter flight to Spain being delayed, perhaps he might like to ponder that one of the reasons for the delay might well be the limited runway capacity vs the ever increasing pax traffic!
[This message has been edited by Crosswind Limits (edited 04 June 2001).]
Guest
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AOG,
A few "facts".
1 Overfly UK and return add at least 2.5 hours to the journey.
2 All repeat ALL of your "destinations" are less, repeat LESS than that by Rail, Coach or even private car.
we aim to please [it keeps the cleaners happy]
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chiglet
A few "facts".
1 Overfly UK and return add at least 2.5 hours to the journey.
2 All repeat ALL of your "destinations" are less, repeat LESS than that by Rail, Coach or even private car.
we aim to please [it keeps the cleaners happy]
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chiglet
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Chiglet
Your "facts" have not been my experience, but we see them as we find them. I will still plus through Amsterdam when my final is Derby, Newcastle, Liverpool, West Bromwich etc.
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Every man has his price and the incorruptible man the highest price of all.
Your "facts" have not been my experience, but we see them as we find them. I will still plus through Amsterdam when my final is Derby, Newcastle, Liverpool, West Bromwich etc.
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Every man has his price and the incorruptible man the highest price of all.
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I have to agree with AOG-YYZ. I'm flying to OZ in September. I fly from Brimingham to Frankfrut with BA and then connect with the OZ bound Qantas flight there. It is costing me the same as flying from Heathrow to Oz via Bangkok/SingaPore route. Yes it means a few hours more in a flying time and two stops Vs one stop, but the actual 'door to door' traveling time is about the same. It's no contest really..
OzPax1
[This message has been edited by OzPax1 (edited 05 June 2001).]
OzPax1
[This message has been edited by OzPax1 (edited 05 June 2001).]
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Madly expensive as it sounds, here in Cambridge, Marshalls have said they would be prepared to move and give up the Cambridge Airport site for housing IF an alternative location should be found and paid for nearby. If Cambridge Council, Marshalls and BAA / a.n.otherAirportOperator got together it might just be feasible to reopen Alconbury / Wyton etc.
Riping up Cambridges perfectly good runway complete with ILS and local maintainence facilities seems an expensive way of doing it however! EGSC even has a fast (45min) railway line to London running alongside the site! Cambridge is a NIMBY hotspot however.
http://www.streetmap.co.uk/streetmap...258629&A=Y&Z=3
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Just keep it Ginger!
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Heathrow is busy because it's in the right place - eg: West of London, and easily accessible via rail, M3 and M4. The M25 also allows access from further north and further south, too. Gatwick's too far into the bottom right hand corner, Stansted is too far into Essex (If it was on the M1, maybe, perhaps even the A1, but the M11 is a step too far). East Midlands is too far to serve London (plus no rail link) and Birmingham is rendered impossible by the game of chance of the M6.
So where?
Greenham would have been perfect (an hour from West London on the Motorway, within easy spitting distance for a new Motorway spur - or if they'd built the by-pass on Eastern side, instead of the West) and with existing railway existing to Newbury racecourse - within walking distance of the base). What a huge missed opportunity!
Fairford's might be OK but would need major road and railway building.
How about Brize? Blackbushe? Boscombe? Lyneham (good proximity to the M4 and Swindon)? Or how about Odiham? Or Upper Heyford?
So where?
Greenham would have been perfect (an hour from West London on the Motorway, within easy spitting distance for a new Motorway spur - or if they'd built the by-pass on Eastern side, instead of the West) and with existing railway existing to Newbury racecourse - within walking distance of the base). What a huge missed opportunity!
Fairford's might be OK but would need major road and railway building.
How about Brize? Blackbushe? Boscombe? Lyneham (good proximity to the M4 and Swindon)? Or how about Odiham? Or Upper Heyford?
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I reckon they should wait until whatever government it is shuts all the RAF bases in this country then the civil world could then take their pick. 
With an army of about 7, an airforce of roughly 2 and a couple of canoes to defend us (as well as more cuts on the horizon), it surely can't be a long time coming.
[This message has been edited by bow5 (edited 05 June 2001).]
With an army of about 7, an airforce of roughly 2 and a couple of canoes to defend us (as well as more cuts on the horizon), it surely can't be a long time coming.
[This message has been edited by bow5 (edited 05 June 2001).]
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I’m surprised that Manston is not mentioned more. There’s bugger all around it, most approaches could be flown over the sea and it has loads of room to expand.
Not far from the M2 (and the Thanet Way is mostly 2 lane these days) and when (if) the Channel Tunnel fast rail link gets built it won’t be that far away.
My bet is that, once the infrastructure was sorted, a passenger could get to the centre of London pretty much as quickly as from LHR or LGW.
Not far from the M2 (and the Thanet Way is mostly 2 lane these days) and when (if) the Channel Tunnel fast rail link gets built it won’t be that far away.
My bet is that, once the infrastructure was sorted, a passenger could get to the centre of London pretty much as quickly as from LHR or LGW.
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AOG-YYZ - just a small historical correction. This has only been "Great" Britain since the Act of Union (with Scotland) in 1707. The Romans called the island "Britannia" from around the 1st Century BC(apparently it had been known to earlier Greek traders as "Prettania"). The Romans knew Britanny as "Armorica".
rgds
rgds
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Thanks for the correction Sigmund. I would be interseted in your source material as mine is obviously outdated. Thanks in advance for any info you can supply.
My information came from an old edition of the 'Encyclopedia Britannica' Quote "The Roman general Gaius Julius Ceaser (q.v.) visited Britain in 55BC and returned the following year to conquer the island for Rome ,naming it Grande Britannia."
The same publication gives reference to the Greek navigator Pytheas who visited the British Isles in the fourth century BC and gave the first known description of the islands and their inhabitants.
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Every man has his price and the incorruptible man the highest price of all.
[This message has been edited by AOG-YYZ (edited 05 June 2001).]
My information came from an old edition of the 'Encyclopedia Britannica' Quote "The Roman general Gaius Julius Ceaser (q.v.) visited Britain in 55BC and returned the following year to conquer the island for Rome ,naming it Grande Britannia."
The same publication gives reference to the Greek navigator Pytheas who visited the British Isles in the fourth century BC and gave the first known description of the islands and their inhabitants.
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Every man has his price and the incorruptible man the highest price of all.
[This message has been edited by AOG-YYZ (edited 05 June 2001).]
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YYZ-AOG, thanks for the reply. I know this is slightly off the original thread but your encyclopaedia is misinformed and this is a case for going to the primary sources. Julius Caesar (who did not conquer Britain - that was Claudius in AD43- though he did visit twice on exploratory raids in 55 and 54BC) nowhere calls these islands Great - just "Britannia". Plain old "Britain" is similarly mentioned by a number of other classical authors and the term "Great" is only seen much later.
The First act of Union (1 My 1707) formally created Great Britain (the second Act in 1801 added Ireland). In practice, as James I was originally James VI of Scotland there had been unity since 1603, though I don't think it was referred to as Great at that time.
rgds again!
The First act of Union (1 My 1707) formally created Great Britain (the second Act in 1801 added Ireland). In practice, as James I was originally James VI of Scotland there had been unity since 1603, though I don't think it was referred to as Great at that time.
rgds again!
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Why not just get rid of the RAF from Brize Norton and use that? It's big enough, is close to the motorway and has a lot of room for expansion. Besides, it doesn't take that long to get there from London.
Surely it would also take a bit of weight off of LHR & LGW -since everyone in the West wanting to fly wouldn't have to go all the way to London to do so.
Just a thought.
Surely it would also take a bit of weight off of LHR & LGW -since everyone in the West wanting to fly wouldn't have to go all the way to London to do so.
Just a thought.
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Crazypilot
You may not be far off the mark there. Wheels are already in motion to move those occupying the southern part of the airfield up north by a mile or so and it is rumoured that a well known public figure associated with aviation bought the option to buy some adjoining land to the south a few years ago. Carterton is the only town in Oxfordshire with planning permission to expand significantly over the next few years and the rail link is pencilled in for 2006(I think). The next bunch of aircraft currently programmed to arrive are dual role civ/mil A330's or maybe B767's but this is perhaps somewhat of a red herring as I would bet that by the time they arrive, the civilian side of the airfield will be doing business.
I doubt whether this will turn Brize into a huge international airport but it may well relax some of the pressure LHR is set to receive over the coming years.
[This message has been edited by Club Tropicana (edited 06 June 2001).]
You may not be far off the mark there. Wheels are already in motion to move those occupying the southern part of the airfield up north by a mile or so and it is rumoured that a well known public figure associated with aviation bought the option to buy some adjoining land to the south a few years ago. Carterton is the only town in Oxfordshire with planning permission to expand significantly over the next few years and the rail link is pencilled in for 2006(I think). The next bunch of aircraft currently programmed to arrive are dual role civ/mil A330's or maybe B767's but this is perhaps somewhat of a red herring as I would bet that by the time they arrive, the civilian side of the airfield will be doing business.
I doubt whether this will turn Brize into a huge international airport but it may well relax some of the pressure LHR is set to receive over the coming years.
[This message has been edited by Club Tropicana (edited 06 June 2001).]