Air Nostrum F-50 runway overrun at Mellila
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Switserland
Posts: 34
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Air Nostrum F-50 brakes in two pieces after landing
Passenger jet makes rough landing at Melilla airport
Fri Jan 17, 8:38 AM ET
MADRID, Spain - A passenger plane carrying 17 people overshot the runway at the Melilla airport in the Spanish enclave of the North African coast while landing on Friday, crashing into a fence and alarming passengers.
Nine people, including a pregnant woman, were reported to be slightly injured and taken to the city's hospital, said Antonio Ramirez, spokesman of the Interior Ministry in Melilla. Most of the injured were treated for contusions and nervous breakdowns, Ramirez said.
The nationalities of the injured were not immediatly released
The plane, a Fokker 50 owned by Air Nostrum, was attempting to land after flying from Malaga when it overran the runway and ended up crashing into the airport's perimeter fence next to a highway that surrounds the airport.
As of result of the emergency landing, the plane broke in two, Ramirez said.
The accident forced the closure of the highway but the airport remained operative, said Miguel Marin, director of the Melilla airport.
The airline said the cause of the accident had not been determined. Air Nostrum is a former subsidiary of the national airline, Iberia.
The Melilla-Malaga route has had three plane incidents in recent years resulting in 42 deaths.
Fri Jan 17, 8:38 AM ET
MADRID, Spain - A passenger plane carrying 17 people overshot the runway at the Melilla airport in the Spanish enclave of the North African coast while landing on Friday, crashing into a fence and alarming passengers.
Nine people, including a pregnant woman, were reported to be slightly injured and taken to the city's hospital, said Antonio Ramirez, spokesman of the Interior Ministry in Melilla. Most of the injured were treated for contusions and nervous breakdowns, Ramirez said.
The nationalities of the injured were not immediatly released
The plane, a Fokker 50 owned by Air Nostrum, was attempting to land after flying from Malaga when it overran the runway and ended up crashing into the airport's perimeter fence next to a highway that surrounds the airport.
As of result of the emergency landing, the plane broke in two, Ramirez said.
The accident forced the closure of the highway but the airport remained operative, said Miguel Marin, director of the Melilla airport.
The airline said the cause of the accident had not been determined. Air Nostrum is a former subsidiary of the national airline, Iberia.
The Melilla-Malaga route has had three plane incidents in recent years resulting in 42 deaths.
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Canada
Posts: 690
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Quote: The Melilla-Malaga route has had three plane incidents in recent years resulting in 42 deaths.
How long is 'recent years'?
Where there any common factors in the 3 past accidents?
Who else operates on the route and with what else?
How long is 'recent years'?
Where there any common factors in the 3 past accidents?
Who else operates on the route and with what else?
Join Date: Apr 1999
Location: is a point of view
Posts: 359
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
note:
the F50 is owned by a dutch wet-lease specialist called "Denim Air" They used to be a subsidairie of Airnostrum but are now under dutch management and ownership (again)
the F50 is owned by a dutch wet-lease specialist called "Denim Air" They used to be a subsidairie of Airnostrum but are now under dutch management and ownership (again)
Join Date: May 2001
Posts: 87
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Recent years is within the past 2 and a half years
No common factors:
The first one was a BA146 operated by Pauknair,wet lease Panair (TNT Spain), during approach in marginal Wx conditions. All Pax and crew died.
Second one a Binter Mediterraneo (Iberia subsidiary) CN235 during final approach in AGP. One Eng out during short final and did not make the runway. Incident under investigation. This is not a proper melilla incident but press refer to it as it actually happened in Melilla.
At the present time just AirNostrum operates the Malaga Melilla route with IB colours and callsign (and fares...).
Regards
CM
No common factors:
The first one was a BA146 operated by Pauknair,wet lease Panair (TNT Spain), during approach in marginal Wx conditions. All Pax and crew died.
Second one a Binter Mediterraneo (Iberia subsidiary) CN235 during final approach in AGP. One Eng out during short final and did not make the runway. Incident under investigation. This is not a proper melilla incident but press refer to it as it actually happened in Melilla.
At the present time just AirNostrum operates the Malaga Melilla route with IB colours and callsign (and fares...).
Regards
CM
Join Date: May 1999
Location: Planet Earth
Posts: 44
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
glad everyone is ok
17jan03 PH-FZE Fokker 50 20182 Denim Air/Air Nostrum/Iberia Regional w/o ex EC-HUB IB 8276 In daylight and good weather, the aircraft overran the end of the runway during landing. Before coming to a stop, the Fokker crossed the airport fence and ran over rough, downsloping terrain. A wing was broken and a small fire errupted. It is believed the aircraft will be considered a write-off. Melillas runway 15/33 is only 1.340 m in lengh
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: _
Posts: 350
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
<<It is believed the aircraft will be considered a right off>> A good understatement, if ever there was one, particularly when you see the picture:
http://www.airdisaster.com/news/0103/17/news.shtml
http://www.airdisaster.com/news/0103/17/news.shtml
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Sweden
Posts: 1
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Maybe they had too many beers the night before?
According to Spanish newspapers both the Commander and the Co-pilot had alcohol (0,3 at the time of the test at the hospital) and signs of drugs (cocaine) in their blood. Definitely not in line with JAR-OPS 1.085.
Tragically enough the other accident with the BAe 146 shows some similarity as the Commander had 0,41 of alcohol in his blood at the time of the autopsy. Ironically it was his last day flying for the company, Pauknair, as he was to start for another major carrier. At least it said so in a Spanish aviation magazine.
Now please do not be sarcastic about Spanish operators and their pilots drinking habits. In this last case it was a dutch registered aircraft operating under a dutch AOC with a dutch Commander and a Canadian Co-pilot and recently it has happened to other European operators.
For those who understand spanish:
http://www.elmundo.es/elmundo/2003/0...042975128.html
According to Spanish newspapers both the Commander and the Co-pilot had alcohol (0,3 at the time of the test at the hospital) and signs of drugs (cocaine) in their blood. Definitely not in line with JAR-OPS 1.085.
Tragically enough the other accident with the BAe 146 shows some similarity as the Commander had 0,41 of alcohol in his blood at the time of the autopsy. Ironically it was his last day flying for the company, Pauknair, as he was to start for another major carrier. At least it said so in a Spanish aviation magazine.
Now please do not be sarcastic about Spanish operators and their pilots drinking habits. In this last case it was a dutch registered aircraft operating under a dutch AOC with a dutch Commander and a Canadian Co-pilot and recently it has happened to other European operators.
For those who understand spanish:
http://www.elmundo.es/elmundo/2003/0...042975128.html
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: home and abroad
Posts: 582
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
It has also been reported that the Spanish pilots don't like to have foreigners flying there. And apparently, AN are going after the newspaper for libel. So who gave the story to the press and is it based on fact?
Until official results of the investigation are made public, nobody can be sure of the facts as they are reported. But we already know that, don't we?
Until official results of the investigation are made public, nobody can be sure of the facts as they are reported. But we already know that, don't we?
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: The bit of the UK thats always cloudy
Posts: 14
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Fading memories.......only IAP for MLN is/was NDB/DME cloudbreak which took you 8-10 miles out to sea before turning back in again towards the A/D at right angles to the runway. Some of the locals couldnt be bothered with all this and designed their own let downs using VORs on the Spanish mainland eg MGA, AMR etc which are about 100 miles away or more!. The story at the time (1997?) was that the Paulknair was doing a DIY let-down but lost the plot and flew in to a cove with rising headland whilst trying to stay VMC with the ocean. Was interesting to be on the ground watching a Casa break cloud from a direction where you would least expect! Usually the wx was Cavok but straight in to R/W 15 could still be tricky due to steep profile required to miss high ground and a downsloping R/W. Add to that packs of wild dogs running across the A/D from time to time and the odd local running across the runway made for an entertaining time.
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: The Hague, The Netherlands
Posts: 1
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I think that the fake wilber burroughs is just trying to cause damage to the healthy, professional relationship between Spanish and foreign pilots working in the same environment. I fly for Denim Air and respect my Spanish colleagues, whether they fly for Air Nostrum, Iberia, Spanair or fly for cargo and general aviation companies. I certainly don’t treat them like trash and neither do they treat me like trash. After the recent management buy-out by Denim Air (which was a win-win situation for both parties) Air Nostrum management has clearly stated in a newsletter to their own staff that it was because of the flexibility and low operating costs of Denim Air that Air Nostrum was able to expand so rapidly especially in times of crisis (ANS management quote: “Denim Air has been and will be our source of flexibility which helped us get through a growth crisis when many abandoned our project and are now helping us to resolve the crisis in this sector”). Denim Air is a wetlease (ACMI) capacity provider, which means we help out other companies by not only providing them with crew, but also with our own aircraft. I really do feel sorry for the 300 Spanish experienced ATPL line captains without a job, but we are NOT taking your jobs! We are operating our own aircraft for Air Nostrum to help them out and help them to expand so they are able to hire these pilots in the future. It would be a different story if these 300 pilots had their own regional aircraft, but unfortunately they don’t. There are also lots of major financial/tax advantages that benefited Air Nostrum via all sorts of constructions with Denim Air (e.g. by phasing-in the new Dash 8’s via Denim Air, Air Nostrum was able to get back some of the taxes on these aircraft in a few weeks time, in stead of the year-and-a-half or longer it takes them in Spain). And for your information: we also have several Spanish captains and first officers working at Denim Air on a permanent contract, who could not get a job in Spain in the first place! Some of them were working all over the world, being away from Spain and their family/relatives for up to 10 years. Thanks to Denim Air/Air Nostrum they are now living in Spain again. It’s funny that I haven’t heard anybody in Holland complaining about these Spanish pilots stealing jobs from Dutch pilots! Must be a culture difference!
Now to come back on the Melilla-accident. It seems that a reporter who started this ridiculous story about the drugs and alcohol found in the blood of the pilots has interpreted the amounts (on purpose?) as being in milligrams (1/1,000th of a gram), in stead of nanograms (1/1,000,000,000th of a gram), which was the correct amount they had in their blood! This is about the same amount a newborn baby has in its blood!!! Air Nostrum already has its legal department standing by to take corrective action against the false accusations by the media, as soon as the official report has been published.
Denim Air has been operating about 30.000 flights per year for Air Nostrum over the last 5 years and has been flying to Melilla more than 7 times a day during the last year. Because Denim Air relies on contracts from other airlines, it meets the highest quality requirements regarding execution of flights, crew training and maintenance of its aircraft. We Denim Air pilots know our colleagues and their professionalism and trust that the outcome of the investigation will clear their name and deliver a hard slap in the face of all those pathetic people who, being frustrated with their own situation, just couldn’t wait to point their finger at our colleagues before knowing the REAL FACTS!!!
Hasta LogoLight!
Commandante Kebab
Now to come back on the Melilla-accident. It seems that a reporter who started this ridiculous story about the drugs and alcohol found in the blood of the pilots has interpreted the amounts (on purpose?) as being in milligrams (1/1,000th of a gram), in stead of nanograms (1/1,000,000,000th of a gram), which was the correct amount they had in their blood! This is about the same amount a newborn baby has in its blood!!! Air Nostrum already has its legal department standing by to take corrective action against the false accusations by the media, as soon as the official report has been published.
Denim Air has been operating about 30.000 flights per year for Air Nostrum over the last 5 years and has been flying to Melilla more than 7 times a day during the last year. Because Denim Air relies on contracts from other airlines, it meets the highest quality requirements regarding execution of flights, crew training and maintenance of its aircraft. We Denim Air pilots know our colleagues and their professionalism and trust that the outcome of the investigation will clear their name and deliver a hard slap in the face of all those pathetic people who, being frustrated with their own situation, just couldn’t wait to point their finger at our colleagues before knowing the REAL FACTS!!!
Hasta LogoLight!
Commandante Kebab
Last edited by Rish'Kebab; 11th Feb 2003 at 23:45.
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Embedded in a pocket of resistance
Posts: 269
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Indeed well spoken Commandante Kebab !!
Instead of constructive critisism, it´s really sad to see some ´aviation professionals´ trying to exploit a crash and turn it into a personal vendetta, while leaking blatant lies to tabloid newspapers.
Unfortunately it´s not unique to Spain, as here in Switzerland we continue to see the same pathetic behaviour.
Instead of constructive critisism, it´s really sad to see some ´aviation professionals´ trying to exploit a crash and turn it into a personal vendetta, while leaking blatant lies to tabloid newspapers.
Unfortunately it´s not unique to Spain, as here in Switzerland we continue to see the same pathetic behaviour.
"The INTRODUCER"
As an observation, the reputation of Spanish aviation would be greatly helped if the investigating authorities were in the practice of publishing full accident reports in a remotely timely manner. Unfortunately too many Spanish accidents remain mysteries to the rest of the world forever. Even some third world countries do better than that these days, and so do some previously paranoid Oriental states.
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: where ever I lay my head
Posts: 142
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Well spoken Cpt Kebab.
Dear Wilber Burroughs one of the joys of aviation is that it is an international affair, there are Spanish registered Emb 120s, A300s etc flying in other European countries, should they all be banned? If you know the market correctly you will find that Spain has one of the lowest no's of Atpl's sitting at home as they are welcome to fly with most EU airlines no problems. The Spainish market on the other hand has always been closed.
The benefit of airlines operating within other countries is that the national authorithies are forced to look at the best solution rather than on the historical solutions!
Safety is learning from your mistakes and of others and the best way is to look at what is happening Europe wide rather than country wide.
Dear Wilber Burroughs one of the joys of aviation is that it is an international affair, there are Spanish registered Emb 120s, A300s etc flying in other European countries, should they all be banned? If you know the market correctly you will find that Spain has one of the lowest no's of Atpl's sitting at home as they are welcome to fly with most EU airlines no problems. The Spainish market on the other hand has always been closed.
The benefit of airlines operating within other countries is that the national authorithies are forced to look at the best solution rather than on the historical solutions!
Safety is learning from your mistakes and of others and the best way is to look at what is happening Europe wide rather than country wide.
Join Date: May 2001
Posts: 26
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Am I being censored ?
capt.kebab is wrong. You are all wrong.
I, amongst others suitably qualified to fly F 50´s have consistently been turned down and mis-lead by West Air,New Air, Denim Air, etc. with promises of employment.
Protectionism, obviously.
I dont care to publish my personal qualifications but believe me, I have more than enough experience, as do my colleagues.
There are non-spanish pilots in Spain, so thats also baloney.
I see I have been censored by the moderator and all of a sudden I cannot post a reply, but if this happens to "allowed in " then take note capt.kebab that I dont appreciate being referred to as " pathetic " and if you want, you can leave me your private e-mail and we can sort it out.
I doubt you will.
I, amongst others suitably qualified to fly F 50´s have consistently been turned down and mis-lead by West Air,New Air, Denim Air, etc. with promises of employment.
Protectionism, obviously.
I dont care to publish my personal qualifications but believe me, I have more than enough experience, as do my colleagues.
There are non-spanish pilots in Spain, so thats also baloney.
I see I have been censored by the moderator and all of a sudden I cannot post a reply, but if this happens to "allowed in " then take note capt.kebab that I dont appreciate being referred to as " pathetic " and if you want, you can leave me your private e-mail and we can sort it out.
I doubt you will.
"we are all wrong"
