CitiExpress Lose Pilots!!
Join Date: May 2000
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Putting aside for one moment the issue of the TPs, is it, or is it not correct that part of the negotiations on Scope would have given the BACX jet pilots preferential access to BA mainline once recruitment began and could have granted positions on the BA master seniority list to all BACX jet pilots? If it is correct, do you believe your reps were right to reject any negotiation with BA BALPA? Even if the TP pilots had, unjustifiably or otherwise, been specifically excluded from the deal, the deal itself would have allowed jet pilots to move into mainline thus freeing up jobs within the BACX jet fleets.
Join Date: May 2002
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Quote...../////
Putting aside for one moment the issue of the TPs, is it, or is it not correct that part of the negotiations on Scope would have given the BACX jet pilots preferential access to BA mainline once recruitment began and could have granted positions on the BA master seniority list to all BACX jet pilots?
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no, the deal was for a `few ` `select`jet Capts (extremely few ) who would be able to apply into mainline at some point in the future.If accepted would go where mainline decided (ie no choice to bid for any base or fleet).When you put it into prespective,a few BACX pilots given the opportunity to apply into mainline out of 600 BACX pilots,it was a derisory,especially when the flipside was to accept BA`s scope for BACX,which involved determining our aircraft size,which meant we wouldn`t be able to fly 146/Rj aircraft,which would mean mass redundancies.You can see why the offer was thrown out by BACX balpa.
Putting aside for one moment the issue of the TPs, is it, or is it not correct that part of the negotiations on Scope would have given the BACX jet pilots preferential access to BA mainline once recruitment began and could have granted positions on the BA master seniority list to all BACX jet pilots?
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no, the deal was for a `few ` `select`jet Capts (extremely few ) who would be able to apply into mainline at some point in the future.If accepted would go where mainline decided (ie no choice to bid for any base or fleet).When you put it into prespective,a few BACX pilots given the opportunity to apply into mainline out of 600 BACX pilots,it was a derisory,especially when the flipside was to accept BA`s scope for BACX,which involved determining our aircraft size,which meant we wouldn`t be able to fly 146/Rj aircraft,which would mean mass redundancies.You can see why the offer was thrown out by BACX balpa.
Join Date: Oct 1999
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My personal opinion is that the upper management of BACX should go back to flying aeroplanes because they don't stand a chance of sorting the enormous mess they have created.They show a total disregard for the welfare of their loyal hardworking employees and they display not the slightest hint of business acumen. With these charlatans running our once glorious company and with their total and absolute inability to conceive a cohesive strategy (both long and short term) we are all doomed.
The smart people will be the ones that secure alternative employment before these morons have no other option than to dump several hundred pilots and other crew on the market.
Join Date: Jun 2001
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Regardles of the wishes, first 5 years of a mainline contract you can go anywhere.. having said that, they are not too bad at looking at preferences, and the guys doing the behind the scens work in postings are excellent.
Join Date: Jul 2001
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Secret Squirrel....
Totally agree with your argument re the ex-CFE turboprop guys.
And don't forget at CFE there were a few ex mainline guys (and long-haul from other carriers) who retired off the big jets at 55 and then got chopped off the TP course as they couldn't come up to standard.
A 4 sector day to and from the channel isles in an ATR, in cr@p weather, and with tight fuel loads no doubt provides a far better training ground than sitting at 35,000 feet for hours with the autopilot on.
Totally agree with your argument re the ex-CFE turboprop guys.
And don't forget at CFE there were a few ex mainline guys (and long-haul from other carriers) who retired off the big jets at 55 and then got chopped off the TP course as they couldn't come up to standard.
A 4 sector day to and from the channel isles in an ATR, in cr@p weather, and with tight fuel loads no doubt provides a far better training ground than sitting at 35,000 feet for hours with the autopilot on.
Join Date: Jan 2002
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WELL SAID GREEN HAM. Divide and rule on both sides of the burning bridge?
One point to mull over that may provide a clue why/how the Turboprop pilots are not invited.
TP pilots when converting onto jets within BA would require base training regardless of whether CAA approved ZFT simulators existed. TP pilots would also take quite a few extra sectors on average to become familiarised with the different energy management considerations for jets.
If TP guys are excluded it's a quite disturbing and unfair exclusion but I think the likeliest culprit would be found in the short term budget projections at Flight Ops.
"The cost of everything the value of nothing" - If only the experiences of TP pilots could be quantified eh?
Does this mean BA will stop employing ex-Hercules pilots now?
One point to mull over that may provide a clue why/how the Turboprop pilots are not invited.
TP pilots when converting onto jets within BA would require base training regardless of whether CAA approved ZFT simulators existed. TP pilots would also take quite a few extra sectors on average to become familiarised with the different energy management considerations for jets.
If TP guys are excluded it's a quite disturbing and unfair exclusion but I think the likeliest culprit would be found in the short term budget projections at Flight Ops.
"The cost of everything the value of nothing" - If only the experiences of TP pilots could be quantified eh?
Does this mean BA will stop employing ex-Hercules pilots now?
I'm not sure about the ex Brymon crews, but certainly a reasonable number of the ex BRAL turboprop Captains have previous jet experience. BRAL used to prefer that you had flown the Embraer before your first turborop command. I know its not a big jet, but it was a jet!
Join Date: May 2002
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Atropos
wrote:
When I was recruited in 1997 BA quoted the figure of hours on a jet over 40,000kgs, so maybe it is not just as straightforward as time on jets? When is a jet not a jet?!!!!
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I guess this means, size does matter
wrote:
When I was recruited in 1997 BA quoted the figure of hours on a jet over 40,000kgs, so maybe it is not just as straightforward as time on jets? When is a jet not a jet?!!!!
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I guess this means, size does matter
Join Date: Jul 2000
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"energy management" - a jet has a lot more energy than a TP, so it's easier to manage. Just my opinion having gone from ATR to Avro RJ and now 330. Jets far easier to fly. Never had it so easy.
Tha whole attitude to TP pilots is a load of cods !!! If you can fly a TP you can fly anything. Good luck to all you BACX guys - I was CFE and have left BA, best move I ever made. (no offence to the nigels- I just didn't like the way the company was run)
Tha whole attitude to TP pilots is a load of cods !!! If you can fly a TP you can fly anything. Good luck to all you BACX guys - I was CFE and have left BA, best move I ever made. (no offence to the nigels- I just didn't like the way the company was run)
Join Date: Jan 2002
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White Knight,
I have yet to fly a jet that can keep 220 kts to 5 miles and still be configured by 1000R. However the ATP with the props to max. Jumpers for goalposts hmmm.
Anyway, I was just being a Devils Advocate. The more TP pilots in BA the better. Anyone who can succesfully do the Fail to Feather drill on a six monthly basis has my vote.
I have yet to fly a jet that can keep 220 kts to 5 miles and still be configured by 1000R. However the ATP with the props to max. Jumpers for goalposts hmmm.
Anyway, I was just being a Devils Advocate. The more TP pilots in BA the better. Anyone who can succesfully do the Fail to Feather drill on a six monthly basis has my vote.
Join Date: Mar 1999
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Land ASAP
Having flown the ATP I know what you mean, but it can be done in the 145 except for the QAR !!
I have yet to fly a jet that can keep 220 kts to 5 miles and still be configured by 1000R
