Pilots jobs could go at British European
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Oh dear RD, perhaps you had better take your own advice and get out the dictionary.
Having now referred to mine (I must admit you had me worried for a moment or two) I find the word means precisely what I intended in its use with respect to your posts:
obfuscate [ób fuss kayt] (3rd person present singular obfuscates, present participle obfuscating, past obfuscated, past participle obfuscated) verb:
1. intransitive and transitive verb make something obscure: to make something obscure or unclear, especially by making it unnecessarily complicated.
Quite apt, then, methinks. While you are looking up 'obfuscate' again, you might flip back to learn how to spell 'budjets', then forward again for the word 'publically'.
OK, finished with my response to your abuse (and nothing 'tongue-in-cheek' intended here).
Now to your paragraph about bonding. Could not agree more, though I wonder how you have come to arrive at this position after your earlier statements with regard to bonding. Never mind, though. Welcome aboard. Oh, sorry, forgot that you will have led the field in this matter. Who am I, then, to welcome you on board? I promise to sit back and be a good boy, stop using words you have difficulty comprehending, and keep my mouth shut on any issue you feel strongly about. OK?
Having now referred to mine (I must admit you had me worried for a moment or two) I find the word means precisely what I intended in its use with respect to your posts:
obfuscate [ób fuss kayt] (3rd person present singular obfuscates, present participle obfuscating, past obfuscated, past participle obfuscated) verb:
1. intransitive and transitive verb make something obscure: to make something obscure or unclear, especially by making it unnecessarily complicated.
Quite apt, then, methinks. While you are looking up 'obfuscate' again, you might flip back to learn how to spell 'budjets', then forward again for the word 'publically'.
OK, finished with my response to your abuse (and nothing 'tongue-in-cheek' intended here).
Now to your paragraph about bonding. Could not agree more, though I wonder how you have come to arrive at this position after your earlier statements with regard to bonding. Never mind, though. Welcome aboard. Oh, sorry, forgot that you will have led the field in this matter. Who am I, then, to welcome you on board? I promise to sit back and be a good boy, stop using words you have difficulty comprehending, and keep my mouth shut on any issue you feel strongly about. OK?
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So a turbo prop is not a lesser type??Try saying that to easyJet when you apply for a direct entry command!Jet Hours are jet hours make no mistake.
RD should be quite worried as one or two FOs will be senior to himself and no doubt be bidding for command at EDI.
My position as a CPT in BHD is some what dubious and as I have roughly 4 years seniority to RD how is he going to feel flying a turbo prop from BHX when I and about three others take his job!
I would also like to know when my letter will arrive informing me of my options as the last post man was shoot by the UDA!
I believe from colleagues that we have until Aug 7th to place our bids.For you guys in Ext I have not yet recieved notification of the changes and until I recieve a letter sent by registered post you can get stuffed as I believe until formal notification that I have to bid for my cuurent position, I am still BHD based.
RD should be quite worried as one or two FOs will be senior to himself and no doubt be bidding for command at EDI.
My position as a CPT in BHD is some what dubious and as I have roughly 4 years seniority to RD how is he going to feel flying a turbo prop from BHX when I and about three others take his job!
I would also like to know when my letter will arrive informing me of my options as the last post man was shoot by the UDA!
I believe from colleagues that we have until Aug 7th to place our bids.For you guys in Ext I have not yet recieved notification of the changes and until I recieve a letter sent by registered post you can get stuffed as I believe until formal notification that I have to bid for my cuurent position, I am still BHD based.
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Oh no, tilii, speak forth! The entertainment value is enormous.
Obfuscate: 1 Obscure or confuse (a mind, topic, etc) 2 Stupefy, bewilder. (Concise Oxford)
Nope, didn't do any of those. What a relief. Of course, nothing I can do if some minds are unable to comprehend the simple facts I stated.
This is such a fun game, what other words would you like to argue over?
"budjets" was a deliberate piece if fun, pity you didn't pick it up. Comes from being so anal, I suppose. Whatever turns you on.
Regarding bonding, if you go back far enough in my various posts, you will find I have always been vehemently opposed to bonding. I just couldn't resist having a bit of fun with you last time, as you are so completely unable to detect when your chain is being pulled. Besides, it is good practice to take a contrary view from time to time, it sharpens the wit nicely.
roland rat: bad news old bean, certain positions are "protected". Hope your is one of them... read the letter when you get it (or read the copy I placed on the BE forum). I have nothing to worry about from BHD captains (or F/O's for that matter). I appreciate your concern though.
Besides, there are lots of other options...
Obfuscate: 1 Obscure or confuse (a mind, topic, etc) 2 Stupefy, bewilder. (Concise Oxford)
Nope, didn't do any of those. What a relief. Of course, nothing I can do if some minds are unable to comprehend the simple facts I stated.
This is such a fun game, what other words would you like to argue over?
"budjets" was a deliberate piece if fun, pity you didn't pick it up. Comes from being so anal, I suppose. Whatever turns you on.
Regarding bonding, if you go back far enough in my various posts, you will find I have always been vehemently opposed to bonding. I just couldn't resist having a bit of fun with you last time, as you are so completely unable to detect when your chain is being pulled. Besides, it is good practice to take a contrary view from time to time, it sharpens the wit nicely.
roland rat: bad news old bean, certain positions are "protected". Hope your is one of them... read the letter when you get it (or read the copy I placed on the BE forum). I have nothing to worry about from BHD captains (or F/O's for that matter). I appreciate your concern though.
Besides, there are lots of other options...
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Roland, read the letter (it's on the private forum).
What is the definition of "protected"? I'm pretty sure I know, but ask MW for a precise meaning. Who is protected? "Key workers".
Anyway, I'm not moving. The bond is more or less finished now. It pays to have an insurance policy in your back pocket these days... I would have thought most of you BHD guys would have done that...
[ 30 July 2001: Message edited by: Raw Data ]
What is the definition of "protected"? I'm pretty sure I know, but ask MW for a precise meaning. Who is protected? "Key workers".
Anyway, I'm not moving. The bond is more or less finished now. It pays to have an insurance policy in your back pocket these days... I would have thought most of you BHD guys would have done that...
[ 30 July 2001: Message edited by: Raw Data ]
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Raw Data
You know, old chap, I really think you have gone way over the top in your post to me above. Clearly the moderators don't think so, which is perhaps to their discredit. Words like 'petty', 'arrogant', 'aggressive' and 'abusive', while not pleasant, are at least not in the same ballpark as 'anal'.
Frankly, I think you are an absolute p**ck of a person, an arrogant Kiwi ar*eh*le with your nose stuck so far up your management's collective behinds that you are in danger of having to pick the s*ite from between your toes.
I sincerely hope you get your just desserts at BE in due course.
Moderators, there is no need for you to ban me for the abusive content of this post. While the likes of Raw data and The Guvnor are permitted to constantly debase any reasoned discourse, I do not wish to participate on this site and will now remove it from my computer.
[ 31 July 2001: Message edited by: tilii ]
You know, old chap, I really think you have gone way over the top in your post to me above. Clearly the moderators don't think so, which is perhaps to their discredit. Words like 'petty', 'arrogant', 'aggressive' and 'abusive', while not pleasant, are at least not in the same ballpark as 'anal'.
Frankly, I think you are an absolute p**ck of a person, an arrogant Kiwi ar*eh*le with your nose stuck so far up your management's collective behinds that you are in danger of having to pick the s*ite from between your toes.
I sincerely hope you get your just desserts at BE in due course.
Moderators, there is no need for you to ban me for the abusive content of this post. While the likes of Raw data and The Guvnor are permitted to constantly debase any reasoned discourse, I do not wish to participate on this site and will now remove it from my computer.
[ 31 July 2001: Message edited by: tilii ]
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Ho ho ho! Now that's what I call taking the bait!!
Tell you what tilii, and I'm being serious now, shall we start again, this time promising not to lower ourselves to insulting each other, but stick to reasoned debate? We could even agree to disagree like adults. It's a brave new world!!!
As I obviously got to you, I apologise unreservedly for my terminology and inference. I'm sure you're a nice chap really. Buy you a beer sometime?
Tell you what tilii, and I'm being serious now, shall we start again, this time promising not to lower ourselves to insulting each other, but stick to reasoned debate? We could even agree to disagree like adults. It's a brave new world!!!
As I obviously got to you, I apologise unreservedly for my terminology and inference. I'm sure you're a nice chap really. Buy you a beer sometime?
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Tilii is such an amusing character, don't you think? I just love the way he comes out with as many polysyllabic words as he can find ... yet seems to misunderstand their correct context; and then throws his toys out of the cot when he's shown to be wrong! You don't think he's really DASH/Natterjack in disguise, do you?
However, his tendency to resort to verbal abuse of individuals (and in particular the rather nasty post above) shows underlying psychotic personality issues he needs to address. Drop me an email, dear boy, and I'll refer you to one of my former colleagues for counselling.
Raw Data
- I think you've hurt his feelings!
[ 31 July 2001: Message edited by: The Guvnor ]
However, his tendency to resort to verbal abuse of individuals (and in particular the rather nasty post above) shows underlying psychotic personality issues he needs to address. Drop me an email, dear boy, and I'll refer you to one of my former colleagues for counselling.
Raw Data
- I think you've hurt his feelings![ 31 July 2001: Message edited by: The Guvnor ]
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Guys, try sticking to the issue and do not let this degenerate into playground name calling. Peoples lives are being turned upside down with this situation.
RD, am glad to see that you agree with most about current bonding practices in BE however am a little stunned by your arrogance toward RR, a fellow BE employee. I would be extremely careful about "protection" it isn't all done and dusted yet. From what i hear , the guys affected at BHD are also "protected " but there are too many for one base and some will have to move. That may well mean they are as "protected" as you but also senior.
Tilli, I agree with your bonding arguement, it is unfair for those guys at the end of a 3 year jet bond being forced to a D-8 re-bonded which may well happen.
Oh, lets be realistic here, a D-8 is a fine aircraft but not a jet(ok, 146) Nonetheless, it is not the same worth on you licence or in your logbook. Guys trying for heavier jets will not get them off the dash while 146 drivers have recently got direct commands on medium 737 like jets or co-pilots on heavies. It is an unfortunate term but the Dash 8 is a lesser type. FACT!
Have to wonder if the Ops Dctr is bringing bodyguards with him on his tour of bases. Funny that the new MD isn't going along and that the 146 fleet manager decided on a 2 week holiday at this crucialtime for his crews????? EXT???? nough said BB
[ 31 July 2001: Message edited by: BavarianBoy ]
RD, am glad to see that you agree with most about current bonding practices in BE however am a little stunned by your arrogance toward RR, a fellow BE employee. I would be extremely careful about "protection" it isn't all done and dusted yet. From what i hear , the guys affected at BHD are also "protected " but there are too many for one base and some will have to move. That may well mean they are as "protected" as you but also senior.
Tilli, I agree with your bonding arguement, it is unfair for those guys at the end of a 3 year jet bond being forced to a D-8 re-bonded which may well happen.
Oh, lets be realistic here, a D-8 is a fine aircraft but not a jet(ok, 146) Nonetheless, it is not the same worth on you licence or in your logbook. Guys trying for heavier jets will not get them off the dash while 146 drivers have recently got direct commands on medium 737 like jets or co-pilots on heavies. It is an unfortunate term but the Dash 8 is a lesser type. FACT!
Have to wonder if the Ops Dctr is bringing bodyguards with him on his tour of bases. Funny that the new MD isn't going along and that the 146 fleet manager decided on a 2 week holiday at this crucialtime for his crews????? EXT???? nough said BB
[ 31 July 2001: Message edited by: BavarianBoy ]
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Bavarian Boy - I have to say that as an impartial bystander (and someone completly uninvolved with JY) that I don't think that there was anything wrong or arrogant about RD's response to Roland Rat. I can see both sides of the picture there (perhaps it's my Libran personality! and I can see on the one hand why RR isn't getting any mail at the moment (and I though Burundi was bad!) - but on the other hand, the full letter has been posted on the British European private forum and therefore he can't say that he's unaware of the provisions in it.
As for the issue of Q400s being lesser aircraft, looking through various ads in Flight etc I see that they are asking for x hours of turbine time. Given that the Q400 is an EFIS aircraft, I'm sure that helps as well.
We're not exactly talking about moving people from 747s to King Airs, are we!
Legally, I don't think JY would have a leg to stand on if someone on the RJ decided to leave instead of moving over to the Q400s. JY would have to take on the bonding inebtedness, as they are apparently doing for people moving over to the Q400.
and I can see on the one hand why RR isn't getting any mail at the moment (and I though Burundi was bad!) - but on the other hand, the full letter has been posted on the British European private forum and therefore he can't say that he's unaware of the provisions in it. As for the issue of Q400s being lesser aircraft, looking through various ads in Flight etc I see that they are asking for x hours of turbine time. Given that the Q400 is an EFIS aircraft, I'm sure that helps as well.
We're not exactly talking about moving people from 747s to King Airs, are we!
Legally, I don't think JY would have a leg to stand on if someone on the RJ decided to leave instead of moving over to the Q400s. JY would have to take on the bonding inebtedness, as they are apparently doing for people moving over to the Q400.
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Guvnor, point taken, however BE are trying to leave pilots with bond via a well known bank, even if on the RJ, they are telling them that they can go D-8 with new bond or leave and pay jet bond. That is a bit outrageous don't you think?
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Tilli you are banned from this thread, we at BE are worried about how we will pay our mortgages and all you can do is fight with Raw Data. Stand in the corner until I decide you can come out!
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BavarianBoy - I agree with you and as I said in my last thread I believe that if JY try to enforce that, it will be seen to be illegal.
Furthermore, I would strongly suspect that any new bonding agreement could (and should) only last as long as the original bond - ie if the CRJ bond is due to expire in January 2002 then so should the new one.
It will be interesting to see how things resolve at JY - from what I hear, there's a good bunch of dedicated people working there and I hope that management doesn't alienate them with something as petty as this.
Furthermore, I would strongly suspect that any new bonding agreement could (and should) only last as long as the original bond - ie if the CRJ bond is due to expire in January 2002 then so should the new one.
It will be interesting to see how things resolve at JY - from what I hear, there's a good bunch of dedicated people working there and I hope that management doesn't alienate them with something as petty as this.
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Well we now have the big date...
As of 3rd Sept BHD-STN is no longer available for sale. Flights still showing, but with no availability...
BHX - TLS same story... but AF still have some capacity on sale. JY have 4 seats available some days it seems.... Do JY sell as JY on this route?
BHX - BHD still on sale.
BHX - SNN drops to a Dash-8 - they have two a/c currently on sale for the same flight.
As of 3rd Sept BHD-STN is no longer available for sale. Flights still showing, but with no availability...
BHX - TLS same story... but AF still have some capacity on sale. JY have 4 seats available some days it seems.... Do JY sell as JY on this route?
BHX - BHD still on sale.
BHX - SNN drops to a Dash-8 - they have two a/c currently on sale for the same flight.
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Guvnor, that makes sense, as you say, i really hope the management do not alienate the crew as they may have done with the weekends letter. Funny thing is, having talked to quite a few crew at BE they know the airline has to make changes it is the way they are treating people in the process. On the management side, I believe the OPS Director knew nothing about these cuts till late last week and has been forced to try and deal with the consequences. However, that is his job.
Lets hope BE goes on to prosper but i fear that they have damaged the present crew so much that most will leave to further careers and for peace of mind. A sad outcome, a senior Captain told me yesterday that if they are not careful the company will find itself very short as huge numbers try and move on, especially at the bases severley affected.
As a person proud to have flown with a lot of those crews I wish them the best, unfortunately the management did not see the writing on the wall that the crew were yelling was there for years.
Rgds BB
[ 31 July 2001: Message edited by: BavarianBoy ]
Lets hope BE goes on to prosper but i fear that they have damaged the present crew so much that most will leave to further careers and for peace of mind. A sad outcome, a senior Captain told me yesterday that if they are not careful the company will find itself very short as huge numbers try and move on, especially at the bases severley affected.
As a person proud to have flown with a lot of those crews I wish them the best, unfortunately the management did not see the writing on the wall that the crew were yelling was there for years.
Rgds BB
[ 31 July 2001: Message edited by: BavarianBoy ]
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BavarianBoy: You know, if I was the sensitive type, I could have taken roland rats post to be quite vicious and nasty- he was clearly delighted at the thought of my suffering during the current troubles. However, I take very little on PPRuNe seriously, and my response to him was pretty tame, really... as you can see, we concluded with no ruffled feathers (at least I think we did... rr?)
By the way, the "protected" positions are training and management positions. At least, they are today!
Now, on to the important stuff... don't have the details yet as I have been flying all day, but I understand that there has been significant movement on bonds today. I also understand that todays' meeting with BALPA was productive and cordial. Let's see what the company can come up with...
By the way, the "protected" positions are training and management positions. At least, they are today!
Now, on to the important stuff... don't have the details yet as I have been flying all day, but I understand that there has been significant movement on bonds today. I also understand that todays' meeting with BALPA was productive and cordial. Let's see what the company can come up with...
