EASYJET to scrap 6-on 3-off roster?
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: England
Posts: 188
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
7 On 2 Off
OUTOFSNCH
Just because easyJet management have agreed that something is a good idea does not mean that they will do it. If it is something that could improve the well being of crews then it will certainly be of a low priority.
As for the takeover perhaps it was smother Go before it put easyJet out of business.
Just because easyJet management have agreed that something is a good idea does not mean that they will do it. If it is something that could improve the well being of crews then it will certainly be of a low priority.
As for the takeover perhaps it was smother Go before it put easyJet out of business.
Join Date: May 2001
Location: uk
Posts: 123
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
NW will only be as good as he is, IF he is given the resources he has at Go.
I wish easyJet would try e-mailing me! Rather than posting crap 1st class letters through the post- from some idiot called pepsi cole(a).
For gawds sake!
(Babs- Please start another!)
I wish easyJet would try e-mailing me! Rather than posting crap 1st class letters through the post- from some idiot called pepsi cole(a).
For gawds sake!
(Babs- Please start another!)
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: West London
Posts: 115
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Go guys.
What you need to realise is that at easyJet there is a need to ensure that we are rostered for maximum duty not flying hours. There is also no max. duty day and at amy moment you can be sent off for a duty including a night and day stop without notice.
NW will not be given any allowances to make 'lifestyle' decisions, instead he will be asked to sit crews in airports from 5am finishes to wait for the first flight to pax back to their home base to save on hotel bills after the commercial dept. has made a change that meant the co. is overcrewed in one particular base. take LPL cabin crew the moment for example.
There is and has never been any commmitment to reasonableness and the current pay negotiation is testament to same.
A rostering clerk is unlikely to have any ability to change the situation and I have little hope that he wil be given the resources. Not only that but the culture has developed where the crewing dept. don't see your roster as having anything to do with the way your month might go. I have arrived to work and been put on airport standby after a completing 2 sectors where there was no chance of operating while crewing decided wheter or not we might be used, for > 2 hours.
What you need to realise is that at easyJet there is a need to ensure that we are rostered for maximum duty not flying hours. There is also no max. duty day and at amy moment you can be sent off for a duty including a night and day stop without notice.
NW will not be given any allowances to make 'lifestyle' decisions, instead he will be asked to sit crews in airports from 5am finishes to wait for the first flight to pax back to their home base to save on hotel bills after the commercial dept. has made a change that meant the co. is overcrewed in one particular base. take LPL cabin crew the moment for example.
There is and has never been any commmitment to reasonableness and the current pay negotiation is testament to same.
A rostering clerk is unlikely to have any ability to change the situation and I have little hope that he wil be given the resources. Not only that but the culture has developed where the crewing dept. don't see your roster as having anything to do with the way your month might go. I have arrived to work and been put on airport standby after a completing 2 sectors where there was no chance of operating while crewing decided wheter or not we might be used, for > 2 hours.
Join Date: Jan 2000
Location: UK
Posts: 55
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
December roster has 7 days straight included, no flexi days, it is already here! Seems the workers have generously donated the a company an extra days work! They are good at informing the troops.
Join Date: Oct 1999
Posts: 134
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Didn't rostering blank out most of December from the 6/3 pattern and make "no promises"? I thought that being on the Winter schedule that things would ease off a bit so it would be OK - I haven't seen my Dec roster yet.
outofsynch
Don't take issues mentioned here so personally. We're all in the same boat now. I had a "discussion" with a mate of mine (ex Go - now ej) the other day along similar lines - We didn't get anywhere!
I don't think that easyJet pilots would like anything more than stable rosters (maybe a 40% payrise!) like Go used to have but I don't think it's going to happen overnight. There are other issues that are p1ssing off "old" ej pilots at moment. Think back to April this year - I think most of our crews were happy and morale was high!
outofsynch
Don't take issues mentioned here so personally. We're all in the same boat now. I had a "discussion" with a mate of mine (ex Go - now ej) the other day along similar lines - We didn't get anywhere!
I don't think that easyJet pilots would like anything more than stable rosters (maybe a 40% payrise!) like Go used to have but I don't think it's going to happen overnight. There are other issues that are p1ssing off "old" ej pilots at moment. Think back to April this year - I think most of our crews were happy and morale was high!
It is all very well saying that you cannot work more than 900 hours in a year, but that only refers to flying. In fact you can work over 2000 hours in a year - duty hours - and this is where EZY and GO differ in their crew utilisations - EZY maximise crew usage - high duty hours - Go maximised aircraft utilisation.
I believe that Go crews actually flew more hours in a twelve month than EZY but EZY used many more duty hours - positioning, airport standby, home standby etc.
I believe that Go crews actually flew more hours in a twelve month than EZY but EZY used many more duty hours - positioning, airport standby, home standby etc.
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: UK
Posts: 339
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I hear lots of good things about Nick and welcome his arrival, however I would not expect him to be allowed to make strategic decisions. Just wait for next summers roster and see if the night ATH, PMI, AGP etc etc have disappeared - I bet they'll still be there (and more of them so that you GO chappies can join in) but with bells on and now we can all look forward to doing them without any hot food - can't wait! Ryans pay their pilots more and make bigger profits but don't do night flights so why do we need to do them!
I haven't seen any changes as a result of the consultant brought in after the summer shambes and experience shows that whenever the whatsit hits the fan eJ run to a consultant but once the storms over its back to ops normal.
Fact is that the problem in eJ starts at the top because it is there that the dislike and animosity to pilots starts. Nothing will be allowed to stand in the way of the even bigger rewards which in recognition of hard work, everyone (except pilots and cc) will be entitled to.
I haven't seen any changes as a result of the consultant brought in after the summer shambes and experience shows that whenever the whatsit hits the fan eJ run to a consultant but once the storms over its back to ops normal.
Fact is that the problem in eJ starts at the top because it is there that the dislike and animosity to pilots starts. Nothing will be allowed to stand in the way of the even bigger rewards which in recognition of hard work, everyone (except pilots and cc) will be entitled to.
Join Date: Oct 1998
Location: UK
Posts: 38
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Some good points here, certainly the most important being those which identify the constraints which will be applied by senior management to the NMC, Rostering, and Day to Day crewing managers.
In the past those of us from the "old easyjet" have had to put up with a continual torrent of b/s that comes from the "Orange Castle" regarding "people come first", "pilot lifestyle matters", "rostering stability has priority in our thinking" etc etc.
In the background we have had a CEO who refuses point blank to have any kind of a rostering / working agreement. He did condescend to have a "Crew Contribution policy" which basically meant we will stick to the roster until there is a managment balls up, ( deicing and Carmen come to mind), and then all arrangements are thrown out the window. Flight crews will be expected to pick up the pieces regardless of any personal commitments etc. This has happened many, many times. The last noteworthy slap in the face on this subject was our Rostering Manager (not) JS, throwing the CCP out of the window in mid summer when the pressure went on, without any consultation with flight deck or cabin crew reps. Anybody who believes that JS or any other manager in easyJet has the authority to make such decisions is dreaming. Any and all decisions are made by one person only.
For those "old Go" people who may not know, our CEO worked for Air New Zealand in the past. This organisations management, was described by Chief Justice Mahon in his summing up of the Mount Erubus DC10 disaster, as issuing, quote, "an orchestrated litany of lies", unquote, in the defence of its actions that led to this disaster.
Perhaps, just perhaps, it was this environment, which has led to the situation we have in eJ now, where no agreement is honoured. This most importantly affects those instructions that are currently being issued to NW and others, coming in from the "old Go", about the style of rostering which will be acceptable. These instructions, however good they may appear at the moment, will not be binding. They will be changed to suit the management, at short notice, regardless of the impact on flight crews, in their never ending quest for the bottom line. (read here lining their pockets).
As a group of pilots we must, repeat must, have a signed, sealed, inviolate rostering agreement, in place, before intergration takes place.
In the past those of us from the "old easyjet" have had to put up with a continual torrent of b/s that comes from the "Orange Castle" regarding "people come first", "pilot lifestyle matters", "rostering stability has priority in our thinking" etc etc.
In the background we have had a CEO who refuses point blank to have any kind of a rostering / working agreement. He did condescend to have a "Crew Contribution policy" which basically meant we will stick to the roster until there is a managment balls up, ( deicing and Carmen come to mind), and then all arrangements are thrown out the window. Flight crews will be expected to pick up the pieces regardless of any personal commitments etc. This has happened many, many times. The last noteworthy slap in the face on this subject was our Rostering Manager (not) JS, throwing the CCP out of the window in mid summer when the pressure went on, without any consultation with flight deck or cabin crew reps. Anybody who believes that JS or any other manager in easyJet has the authority to make such decisions is dreaming. Any and all decisions are made by one person only.
For those "old Go" people who may not know, our CEO worked for Air New Zealand in the past. This organisations management, was described by Chief Justice Mahon in his summing up of the Mount Erubus DC10 disaster, as issuing, quote, "an orchestrated litany of lies", unquote, in the defence of its actions that led to this disaster.
Perhaps, just perhaps, it was this environment, which has led to the situation we have in eJ now, where no agreement is honoured. This most importantly affects those instructions that are currently being issued to NW and others, coming in from the "old Go", about the style of rostering which will be acceptable. These instructions, however good they may appear at the moment, will not be binding. They will be changed to suit the management, at short notice, regardless of the impact on flight crews, in their never ending quest for the bottom line. (read here lining their pockets).
As a group of pilots we must, repeat must, have a signed, sealed, inviolate rostering agreement, in place, before intergration takes place.
6 on 3 off
Join Date: Oct 1999
Location: Allendale, Northumberland
Posts: 188
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
My issued rosters at ez have been pretty good for a a good time now; unfortunately, during the summer they were horribly disrupted by the now over-covered problems. The crewing people had to sort out the mess cause by totally unrealistic planning. Now the cards have been shuffled and we have a new and highly respected rostering manager, but the problem has been shuffled sideways into crewing. I wonder if the excellent rapport I have had for a long time with that department will suffer as a consequence? PS not a single change to my roster yet this month apart from due weather.
PS Just in from my last day of the six; it`s 2.25. On my day off. Roll on the death of the awful flexi-day!
PS Just in from my last day of the six; it`s 2.25. On my day off. Roll on the death of the awful flexi-day!
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: LHR
Posts: 27
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Apparently Channex received over 400 applications mostly Easyjet.My interview day they were all easyjet,and said they would all leaveto join Channex even if it did mean they would be almost 10k worse off.Are things really that bad at Easy?
Join Date: Sep 2000
Posts: 12
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
BTB
You must be a skipper because as a Luton F/O my roster resembles a war zone with all the changes. Changes ranging from early morning SBY (first one in 5 months) "stand down at 8am to do the night Athens" to making a last minute guest appearance for 2 days in Gatwick. Last week 5 changes in 1 day!! The company appear to want 24 hour 6/7 day useage or option to use, standing down at an early hour to then do the night Athens does nothing for my family/social arrangements not to mention my body clock, try running that change past somebody in Orange Porta-Land! I would like to see some sort of roster stability but unfortunetly for me personally not a great deal has changed since those heady days of summer.
NW do your thing but I think your hands will be tied tighter than you think, Go guys beware!
You must be a skipper because as a Luton F/O my roster resembles a war zone with all the changes. Changes ranging from early morning SBY (first one in 5 months) "stand down at 8am to do the night Athens" to making a last minute guest appearance for 2 days in Gatwick. Last week 5 changes in 1 day!! The company appear to want 24 hour 6/7 day useage or option to use, standing down at an early hour to then do the night Athens does nothing for my family/social arrangements not to mention my body clock, try running that change past somebody in Orange Porta-Land! I would like to see some sort of roster stability but unfortunetly for me personally not a great deal has changed since those heady days of summer.
NW do your thing but I think your hands will be tied tighter than you think, Go guys beware!
Join Date: Oct 1999
Location: Allendale, Northumberland
Posts: 188
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Cheques Please: You have to remember that the idiot that used to run our rosters is now the idiot in charge of crewing. This particular idiot has refused to talk to me on a recorded phone; I will not speak to him on an unrecorded phone. What has he to hide? I submit that for the forseable future our rosters will be fine, but day-to day crewing may be bobbins. Yes I am a skipper, and have a great relationship with our rosterers and crewing because I believe in the company and care about people, and will help out if I can. Have you ever been in NMC when things have gone to ratchet and crewing have had to sort out the mess originally caused by diabolical rostering? 
out of, have a look at the flying programme the 'separate' companies fly before we join up. The GO programme has bigger buffers in the programme for aircraft swaps and you fly less sectors a day approx 180 vs eazy's 290ish, with a not-dissimilar number of aircraft. Thus the eazy machines are operated on a more frequent basis, and if the wheels come off the programme, in general terms it's easier to put the GO one back together, hence less disruption of schedules and crew hours etc. I expect easy's system makes more money, coz there are more bums on seats each day too.
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: UK
Posts: 1,178
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
A note of caution
Just remember if you are recording a telephone conversation you must, BY LAW, inform the other person. That's why the EZ exchange message states the fact when you first connect.
Most telephone recorders also emit a beep every 10 secs or so. I have a feeling this might be reqired by law also, but I'm not 100% sure.
Most telephone recorders also emit a beep every 10 secs or so. I have a feeling this might be reqired by law also, but I'm not 100% sure.
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: midlands
Posts: 28
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Well when I originally posted the question I didn't expect so many replies!
To those of you thinking of moving on remember that the grass is not always quite as green as it may first seem.
I was told PERSONALLY by my AME that he had been approached by a senior management type from Ryanair to see if he and his partner wanted to do ALL their pilots Class 1 medicals, for half price! They declined. They weren't too impressed that RYANAIR (quote) "DON'T CARE ABOUT THE WELFARE OF THEIR PILOTS,SO LONG AS THEY GET THE PIECE OF PAPER".
I always discourage people from working for and flying with Ryanair. It is my opinion (to which I am entitled) that Ryanair will have a fatal accident, and I don't want my friends or family on board when it happens.
To those of you thinking of moving on remember that the grass is not always quite as green as it may first seem.
I was told PERSONALLY by my AME that he had been approached by a senior management type from Ryanair to see if he and his partner wanted to do ALL their pilots Class 1 medicals, for half price! They declined. They weren't too impressed that RYANAIR (quote) "DON'T CARE ABOUT THE WELFARE OF THEIR PILOTS,SO LONG AS THEY GET THE PIECE OF PAPER".
I always discourage people from working for and flying with Ryanair. It is my opinion (to which I am entitled) that Ryanair will have a fatal accident, and I don't want my friends or family on board when it happens.
