BBC Concorde Incompetence
Ecce Homo! Loquitur...
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BBC Concorde Incompetence
Total scaremongering on behalf of the BBC. I almost can't believe it, it's as bad as the tabloids. Concorde shuts down an engine and descends and slows to a subsonic cruise speed/level, and the BBC start reporting the aircraft "plunging" and all the usual bull**** about women crying and babies screaming. And for this they extort a licence fee.
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Last edited by ORAC; 5th Nov 2002 at 19:11.
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But surely most of the people (?) reporting aircraft mishaps on pPrune are the same as those of the Beeb and follow a well worn format.....'Just heard a BoeingBus 307 has come off the runway at EGKX..NO ONE HURT...THANK GOD... WELL DONE THE CREW....(any good pix?)'
And quite honestly,if I had paid what those punters had paid to get to or from New York on that old thing...I'd be (S).....hiting ... myself if anything went wrong.Anyone who has flown on it (and I have, many times)will tell you,it doesn't breeze along;it's a busy feeling plane and any slight hickup would be worrying.
Don't get me wrong..if you are going to New York it is the only way to travel(great wine list..but on the day,only one sort of white,one of red,two champagnes and half a dozen 'designer' waters),a cabin crew who think they're God's Gift,and a flight crew who welcome you to the 'Concorde Experience' spoken through a nasal mike as though paying that sort of money deserves some sort of a circus ride.
I don't like Greg Dyke's politics..but give his reporters a break peeerrleezz
And quite honestly,if I had paid what those punters had paid to get to or from New York on that old thing...I'd be (S).....hiting ... myself if anything went wrong.Anyone who has flown on it (and I have, many times)will tell you,it doesn't breeze along;it's a busy feeling plane and any slight hickup would be worrying.
Don't get me wrong..if you are going to New York it is the only way to travel(great wine list..but on the day,only one sort of white,one of red,two champagnes and half a dozen 'designer' waters),a cabin crew who think they're God's Gift,and a flight crew who welcome you to the 'Concorde Experience' spoken through a nasal mike as though paying that sort of money deserves some sort of a circus ride.
I don't like Greg Dyke's politics..but give his reporters a break peeerrleezz
Ecce Homo! Loquitur...
Thread Starter
Sorry don't agree. An aircraft shuts down engine and proceeds to it's planned destination. It might have been worth a couple of lines, buts that all. That the BBC made a headline story out of it is bad enough, to add the standard tabloid rubbish is worse, but to then gratuitously throw in a reference to the Concorde crash, strikes me as the absloute worst of scaremongering and sensationalism. I might have expected it of the Star, but not the BBC. How low are the mighty fallen.
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Its totally pathetic.
Sound like during the 15min decent to 33,000 someone dropped a plate or two. How they can equate this to July 2000 is beyond belief.
It doesn't really go into too many technical details (if any) but I guess the "bump" may have been an engine surge. Not too uncommon, not too pleasant on Concorde.
Sound like during the 15min decent to 33,000 someone dropped a plate or two. How they can equate this to July 2000 is beyond belief.
It doesn't really go into too many technical details (if any) but I guess the "bump" may have been an engine surge. Not too uncommon, not too pleasant on Concorde.
Last edited by gordonroxburgh; 8th Nov 2002 at 15:56.
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Selling point of the Concorde is speed and exclusivity and one pays accordingly ($ 7000 me thinks?). Any refund if the merchandise is not delivered?
With the Paris incident in the back of my head my mind would go wondering a bit too, guess not many people aren't as cool as ORAC?
Cheers
KAOS
With the Paris incident in the back of my head my mind would go wondering a bit too, guess not many people aren't as cool as ORAC?
Cheers
KAOS
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I agree with ORAC. It's irresponsible reporting, written as if the aircraft and occupants were in mortal danger. Whatever happened to reporting the facts?
I've been on many an aircraft when crockery has crashed to the floor in light to moderate chop! The same chop caused passengers to be frightened...so what?
As Mr ORAC says...Total scaremongering by the BBC
I've been on many an aircraft when crockery has crashed to the floor in light to moderate chop! The same chop caused passengers to be frightened...so what?
As Mr ORAC says...Total scaremongering by the BBC
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It's a bit ironic. Concorde is the only aircraft I know where the safety card (at least on BA) says what'll happen if it has to get downstairs in a hurry, and I think a lot of good would be done if that was standard on every pressurised flight.
If everyone knew that there are things that can go wrong that need a dive, and that normally they're not particularly hazardous, then the "Death Plunge At Thirty Thousand Feet" school of reporting will be out of date overnight. After all, there are no reports in the press that "Flight BA456 was gripped by terror when the air was sucked out and oxygen masks were desperately strapped on by the passengers". Everyone knows that this might happen as they're told about it every flight, so that's never news. The odd time it actually happens, it gets reported with the emphasis on the dive because the unexpected rapid descent makes the pax think that whatever's gone wrong means the aircraft is dropping out of the sky.
In this case, it's only news because most people don't know what Concorde does when it loses power *and* because for most people today Concorde + Engine Trouble = Paris. One is ignorance, one is understandable. Just because both are objectively nothing to worry about doesn't make this story non-news. It is news, and people will be talking about it tomorrow. Journalists would be falling down on the job if they didn't write up stuff that people were interested in. Where the Beeb is culpable is in not saying that the loss of an engine in cruise on Concorde isn't exactly unknown (anyone know what the figures are?), and that while it's always a matter of concern the normal procedures were followed and, as usual, the safety of the flight wasn't threatened. I think the story should have been reported, but that it should have been reported better so that next time, it's not a story.
If the carriers were more candid with the customers about what can actually happen on a flight, then there'd be far less for journalists to overblow.
R
If everyone knew that there are things that can go wrong that need a dive, and that normally they're not particularly hazardous, then the "Death Plunge At Thirty Thousand Feet" school of reporting will be out of date overnight. After all, there are no reports in the press that "Flight BA456 was gripped by terror when the air was sucked out and oxygen masks were desperately strapped on by the passengers". Everyone knows that this might happen as they're told about it every flight, so that's never news. The odd time it actually happens, it gets reported with the emphasis on the dive because the unexpected rapid descent makes the pax think that whatever's gone wrong means the aircraft is dropping out of the sky.
In this case, it's only news because most people don't know what Concorde does when it loses power *and* because for most people today Concorde + Engine Trouble = Paris. One is ignorance, one is understandable. Just because both are objectively nothing to worry about doesn't make this story non-news. It is news, and people will be talking about it tomorrow. Journalists would be falling down on the job if they didn't write up stuff that people were interested in. Where the Beeb is culpable is in not saying that the loss of an engine in cruise on Concorde isn't exactly unknown (anyone know what the figures are?), and that while it's always a matter of concern the normal procedures were followed and, as usual, the safety of the flight wasn't threatened. I think the story should have been reported, but that it should have been reported better so that next time, it's not a story.
If the carriers were more candid with the customers about what can actually happen on a flight, then there'd be far less for journalists to overblow.
R
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For crying out loud...
We sure have media all over Concorde, but check this one out. That happenned 3 weeks ago to a B747 an route from the US to Japan and no one notices/reports... Maybe because there were no dead, no hole in the ground, no pilot error and no drunks on the flight deck. Just lucky 400+ sobs on board.
http://www.ntsb.gov/ntsb/brief.asp?e...18X05344&key=1
We sure have media all over Concorde, but check this one out. That happenned 3 weeks ago to a B747 an route from the US to Japan and no one notices/reports... Maybe because there were no dead, no hole in the ground, no pilot error and no drunks on the flight deck. Just lucky 400+ sobs on board.
http://www.ntsb.gov/ntsb/brief.asp?e...18X05344&key=1
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When a subject relating to my profession is reported on the TV or in the newspapers, I used to be amazed at the frequency of inaccurate and overly dramatic reporting. The only change these days is that I am no longer amazed.
Makes you wonder what garbage we're being fed in general and whether the licence fee or the cost of the newspaper is'nt money wasted.
I could give them some news regarding the airline industry -- but on second thoughts maybe I won't; I need to keep my job !
Makes you wonder what garbage we're being fed in general and whether the licence fee or the cost of the newspaper is'nt money wasted.
I could give them some news regarding the airline industry -- but on second thoughts maybe I won't; I need to keep my job !
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Stories must be reported of course; but what is appalling is the ignorance of the people who people trust for giving exact news. If it's not ignorance then it is something ethically inadmissible for a news professional, distorting a new like you wrap up a candy bar in colored paper to make it more appetizing.
The irony is that the pax should get a lot more worried if they are halfway across the pond in a two engined flying machine which suffers an engine failure compared to the same situation on Concorde.
The main problem is that we do not tell the media that flying is potentially risky. If you are going to pack scores of people into narrow tubes and shoot them through the air at 1200 mph supported on wings full of inflammable explosive then nobody should be surprised if very occasionally things go wrong.
There should be a Government Health Warning on all a/c which says something like "Flying is Risky - Possibility of Death of Serious Injury - Only Board if you accept this Risk"!
The main problem is that we do not tell the media that flying is potentially risky. If you are going to pack scores of people into narrow tubes and shoot them through the air at 1200 mph supported on wings full of inflammable explosive then nobody should be surprised if very occasionally things go wrong.
There should be a Government Health Warning on all a/c which says something like "Flying is Risky - Possibility of Death of Serious Injury - Only Board if you accept this Risk"!
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Best would be if there's no pax at all in the airplane, would make flying a lot more fun.....but wait....darn...they pay for the wages.....no pax, no flying....double darn.....well guess all them Biggles still have to deal with these ignorant people in the back......life's hard sometimes.....
Cheers
KAOS
Cheers
KAOS
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ABRA
- I think if you look at MOST posts on Pprune after an incident there is some informed speculation on cause, concern for any injuries, and an awful lot of "lets wait for the enquiry".
As for Concorde being a "busy" aircraft, I have flown in it and, apart from the acceleration at T.O. and going supersonic, the thing I found most impressive was that it DID just "breeze along", albeit faster and higher than most, and even as it goes through M1 it does not even ripple the champagne!
- I think if you look at MOST posts on Pprune after an incident there is some informed speculation on cause, concern for any injuries, and an awful lot of "lets wait for the enquiry".
As for Concorde being a "busy" aircraft, I have flown in it and, apart from the acceleration at T.O. and going supersonic, the thing I found most impressive was that it DID just "breeze along", albeit faster and higher than most, and even as it goes through M1 it does not even ripple the champagne!
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Fireflybob in your rush to get your point across you have invented a new oxymoron "inflammable explosive". How's that work then? And to think all those maintenance guys getting licences who thought that a fuel/air mixture got burnt in the combustion chambers.......
Methinks that there is too much protestation here not supported by facts.
I have seen first hand the alarm that can envelop passengers when an engine cocks up with severe imbalance at high windmill speeds. It doesn't subside just because you shut it (the engine) down. Videos of what's going on in the cabin are alarming to anybody who doesn't understand that this is nothing more than sustained turbulence for several minutes.
I doubt that the passenger manifest on this aircraft are your typical first time touristy passengers. Could it be that the news is simply reporting the passenger's feelings.
I have seen first hand the alarm that can envelop passengers when an engine cocks up with severe imbalance at high windmill speeds. It doesn't subside just because you shut it (the engine) down. Videos of what's going on in the cabin are alarming to anybody who doesn't understand that this is nothing more than sustained turbulence for several minutes.
I doubt that the passenger manifest on this aircraft are your typical first time touristy passengers. Could it be that the news is simply reporting the passenger's feelings.
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Big Hole in bottom of Concord?
Yeah! Right! I did chuckle to myself because in several BBC reports, one of the passengers was quoted as saying that "crockery fell to the ground during the descent". So -- does that particular Concord have a big whole in the bottom through which all the crockery fell through to the ground? If it does, then I guess the passengers would have some cause for concern ...
To be slightly more serious -- just how quickly did it descend from cruise to a lower altitude? And what did that do to their fuel burn rate? My understanding is that Concord doesn't really have the fuel capacity for low altitude operation, so that could mean things getting a bit iffy ...
To be slightly more serious -- just how quickly did it descend from cruise to a lower altitude? And what did that do to their fuel burn rate? My understanding is that Concord doesn't really have the fuel capacity for low altitude operation, so that could mean things getting a bit iffy ...
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Last edited by Web-Footed Flyer; 6th Nov 2002 at 13:15.
Panman, thank you for pointing out the new oxymoron but I am somewhat at a loss as to how you presume that my posting was made in a "rush" .
All I am pointing out is that an activity such as aviation carries risk of injury or even worse death. That it not to say that sensible precautions are not taken or lessons learned or to belittle the tragedy of even one life being lost.
Yes flying is relatively safe but many seem to be promoting the idea that it is completely risk free.
All I am pointing out is that an activity such as aviation carries risk of injury or even worse death. That it not to say that sensible precautions are not taken or lessons learned or to belittle the tragedy of even one life being lost.
Yes flying is relatively safe but many seem to be promoting the idea that it is completely risk free.
BBC at it again!
Looks like it is get Concorde season at the BBC this week.
Here we go again!
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/2410957.stm
Here we go again!
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/2410957.stm