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Kabul FIR still safe?

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Kabul FIR still safe?

Old 15th Aug 2021, 11:21
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Kabul FIR still safe?

Is the Kabul FIR in danger of collapsing, now that the Taliban has taken over in Afghanistan?
Will there be problems in the overflight of the Kabul FIR, could it be closed?
Who operates the radio at this moment?
Who picks up the phone at the ATC center?
Where is it located and does it have electical power?
Do we need to re-route via the middle east on the Europe-Far East route?

Last edited by fox niner; 15th Aug 2021 at 12:16.
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Old 15th Aug 2021, 12:08
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Can’t help thinking that the Taliban will already know what they’ve captured and what they haven’t, and probably won’t need PPRuNe as a source of intelligence. FAA have issued a notam forbidding US registered aircraft from going anywhere except Kabul, but don’t think overflights at high level are an issue.
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Old 15th Aug 2021, 16:20
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TV news says BA have announced they will no longer be overflying Afghanistan.
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Old 15th Aug 2021, 17:33
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KBL for MIL only?

NATO Official: Commercial flights into and out of Kabul Airport are suspended immediately. Only military flights are allowed in and out. Evacuation efforts continue.
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Old 15th Aug 2021, 19:32
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KLM and Air France have stopped overflying Kabul FIR, BA as said previously.
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Old 15th Aug 2021, 22:12
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The last restriction I saw (yesterday, FAA) was overflight was allowed by US carriers, with a minimum altitude being specified.

May have missed it but not heard of any change today.
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Old 15th Aug 2021, 22:41
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Eyewitnesses have described chaos at the Kabul airport with a stampede on the tarmac injuring civilians
Taliban enter Kabul, Afghan government collapses.

https://www.bbc.com/news/live/world-asia-58219963
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Old 15th Aug 2021, 23:18
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Indeed Wiggy you are correct I regret to say.
The last FAA NOTAM was 25 July and prohibits flights below FL 260 except for operations to/from Kabul airport.
As “Ginger Ninja” said earlier, what happens in the event of an emergency?
I fear the FAA (and perhaps also United) are asleep at the switch here.
Surely a prudent operator would literally steer clear anyway, e.g. as recent BA tracks show?
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Old 16th Aug 2021, 06:53
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It may be that there is not much in the way of ATC left...
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Old 16th Aug 2021, 06:57
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I am watching footage of people climbing up what appears to be a A340 to get onboard. The airport has been over run with citizens trying to get the hell out of there.

Have no idea how this Turkish crew will get this Triple out.

Airspace is now closed for commercial operations.

Last edited by PoppaJo; 16th Aug 2021 at 07:12.
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Old 16th Aug 2021, 07:16
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Just a wild quess: they anticipated no ground services (push, fuel etc) and the apron is most likely very crowded by people (based on videos), hence taxied straight to holding point to unload/load and being ready to leave asap. Most probably that area is also covered by the US forces as they need the runway, too.
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Old 16th Aug 2021, 08:10
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NOTAM issued by Pakistan NOTAM OfficeA0630/21 NOTAMN
Q) OAKX/QAFAM/IV/NBO/A/000/999/3434N/6912E/999
A) OAKX
B) 2108160715 C) 2108180445 EST
E) FOLLOWING NOTAM IS ISSUED ON REQUEST OF KABUL ACC.
DUE SECURITY REASON KABUL ACC IS RELEASED TO MILITARY.
NO ATS WILL BE AVAILABLE. AIRCRAFT TRANSITING THROUGH
KABUL FIR WILL BE FLYING IN UN-CONTROLLED AIRSPACE AT
THEIR OWN RISK.

1. TRAFFIC ON ATS ROUTE L750 TO CONTACT ON FREQ 134.5 MHZ
AT POINT RANAH.

2. TRAFFIC ON ATS ROUTE N644 TO CONTACT ON FREQ 134.5 MHZ
AT POINT LEMOD.

3. TRAFFIC ON ATS ROUTE A466 TO CONTACT ON FREQ 134.3 MHZ
AT POINT AMDAR.

4. TRAFFIC ON ATS ROUTE P500 TO CONTACT ON FREQ 133.1 MHZ
AT POINT MOTMO.
CREATED: 16 Aug 2021 07:39:00
SOURCE: OPKCYNYX
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Old 16th Aug 2021, 08:48
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Twitter is showing videos of Apaches trying to clear people off the runway in order to get this 777 out.
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Old 16th Aug 2021, 08:50
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Turkish 777 now airborne, as reported the first takeoff was rejected due to people on the runway

What a miserable state of affairs. Glad to see the 777 on itís way now.
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Old 16th Aug 2021, 08:57
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News and tweets here.
https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zon...irports-runway
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Old 16th Aug 2021, 11:36
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At what point does the "world" step in and help extract people...
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Old 16th Aug 2021, 11:59
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There's thousands of troops of various countries already on the ground at Kabul Airport. However, the airport perimeter has been comprehensively breached and there's many people just milling around desperate to escape. Just look at the video of that C17 departing with people falling from it to their deaths. There is no way to operate aircraft safely there without re-establishing a secure perimeter and being prepared to defend that perimeter with significant force. That would not look great on TV.

I imagine that the best short-term solution would be to just let the situation settle and maintain the much smaller areas within the airport that are currently militarily secure.
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Old 16th Aug 2021, 12:14
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It’s like the scenes from Da Nang in 1975.
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Old 16th Aug 2021, 13:14
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I don’t get it, if Americans pulled out why are there any civil aircraft at the airport? Whichever airlines decided to go land there need there head examined. The Americans have messed up very badly if they pulled out and left civilians behind!
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Old 16th Aug 2021, 13:28
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Today United is using the same for flight to India


Flight UA829 from New York to Mumbai used airway P500 over Afghanistan
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