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IcelandAir fires Boeing 737 Max Pilots

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IcelandAir fires Boeing 737 Max Pilots

Old 5th Jun 2019, 01:17
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IcelandAir fires Boeing 737 Max Pilots

Link: https://simpleflying.com/icelandair-...37-max-pilots/

After coming to the conclusion that the 737 MAX will be grounded longer than was first anticipated, Icelandair has fired its Boeing 737 MAX pilots.Icelandair made the announcement that it would be terminating 45 of its 737 MAX pilots during a training session, according to Aviation24.be.

Of the number of pilots let go, 21 included newcomers to the airline who had just begun working on the 737 MAX before it became grounded. The other 24 pilots to lose their jobs had been with the airline since last autumn, flying the ill-fated Boeing aircraft.

Having now made changes to its summer schedule to not include the 737 MAX, the Nordic carrier has announced that it has agreed to wet-lease one B757-200 from an unspecified carrier. The leased aircraft will be used during the summer season, between now and September.

This latest aircraft comes on the heels of two B767-300ERs Icelandair already leased from Portugal’s euroAtlantic Airways.

When ch-aviation asked Icelandair where they were leasing the 757-200 from, all Icelandair would say is that the aircraft will be equipped with 185 seats.Icelandair’s fleet

With its almost unique position halfway between North America and Europe, Iceland’s national flag carrier has built a business around stopover transatlantic flights. This is in addition to the demand for service in Iceland.

Their current fleet of all-Boeing aircraft is based at Keflavík International Airport in Reykjavík. It consists of 25 Boeing 757-200’s, two 757-300’s, four 767-300ER’s and 5 Boeing 737 MAXaircraft.

With an average age of 20 years, Icelandair was in the process of retiring the 757’s and replacing them with the Boeing 737 MAX.

On paper, and given Icelandair’s history of working with Boeing, the 737 MAX looked like the ideal aircraft for the carrier, given its location in the middle of the Atlantic Ocean.

Icelandair even said so much themselves when talking about the 737 MAX on their websitesaying,

“With the addition of 16 737 MAX 8 and 9 – the first aircraft arriving in early 2018 – our fleet is perfectly suited to serve both Europe and North America from our unique location in Iceland.”What now for Icelandair and the 737 MAX?

No airline wants to have aircraft sitting on the ground that they cannot fly!

Icelandair and dozens of other airlines around the world are in this position now following the grounding of the 737 MAX after the Lion Air and Ethiopian Airline disasters.

To make matters worse for Boeing the FAA is telling airlines to check 179, 737 MAX’s for improperly manufactured parts.

Called a leading-edge slat track a (part of the wing) that helps provide lift during take-off and landing was found to be susceptible to “premature failure or cracks resulting from the improper manufacturing process”, the FAA said on Sunday as reported by the Guardian.

While not threatening, it is just another bit of bad news for the American plane manufacturer.

Icelandair still needs to eventually replace their ageing 757 aircraft and with Emirates President Tim Clark telling reporters at the IATA’s AGM in Seoul that “If it (737 MAX) is in the air by Christmas, I’ll be surprised,” Then maybe it’s time Icelandair started looking at the A321neo? What do you think?

Last edited by Senior Pilot; 5th Jun 2019 at 01:30. Reason: Add quote: this helps PPRuNers know what you're posting about!
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Old 5th Jun 2019, 02:11
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Sad to see pilots lose their jobs due to the 737 MAX debacle, eventually when the plane flies again airlines will still have to deal with passengers who would rather book their flight on a different plane due to the bad reputation it has earned, in the end it could have a fate similar to the DC-10.
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Old 5th Jun 2019, 04:24
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Hmmm.. sorry, i feel the pain of those that lost their job...but according to Boeing and FAA they are not MAX pilots, they are NG pilots with a tablet training for MAX...
i might sound rude, and I apologize to those are affected but according to authorities, there is no such thing as a MAX pilot
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Old 5th Jun 2019, 05:03
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Originally Posted by Byros View Post
Sad to see pilots lose their jobs due to the 737 MAX debacle, eventually when the plane flies again airlines will still have to deal with passengers who would rather book their flight on a different plane due to the bad reputation it has earned, in the end it could have a fate similar to the DC-10.
Southwest Airlines has removed the word Max from the flight safety cards so passengers won’t know they are in a Max. I would think the word Max won’t be appearing on any paintwork either.
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Old 5th Jun 2019, 05:18
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Originally Posted by Byros View Post
Sad to see pilots lose their jobs due to the 737 MAX debacle, eventually when the plane flies again airlines will still have to deal with passengers who would rather book their flight on a different plane due to the bad reputation it has earned, in the end it could have a fate similar to the DC-10.
for two weeks, until something else takes over the news of the day.
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Old 5th Jun 2019, 07:21
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"...would be terminating the pilots during a training session..."

Are they actually planning to fail the recurrent check so they have an excuse to fire the pilots?

Last edited by iggy; 5th Jun 2019 at 07:23. Reason: Typo
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Old 5th Jun 2019, 08:11
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Originally Posted by FrequentSLF View Post
Hmmm.. sorry, i feel the pain of those that lost their job...but according to Boeing and FAA they are not MAX pilots, they are NG pilots with a tablet training for MAX...
i might sound rude, and I apologize to those are affected but according to authorities, there is no such thing as a MAX pilot
of course there is such thing as a "max pilot"...any pilots at a specific airline assigned only to the "max", would be a "max pilot" as per the airline yes? the pilots assigned to fly the the Max at Iceland, aka the "max pilots" were sent packing. they weren't employed by Boeing or the FAA..they were employed by Iceland Air...so they were Iceland Air "Max pilots"....make sense now??
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Old 5th Jun 2019, 10:54
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they just don't want to have extra crew in the payroll, I guess they are being careful trying to save some money. I don't think they have any other 737, so all the training was to introduce a new type in their boeing fleet.
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Old 5th Jun 2019, 11:23
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Originally Posted by ironbutt57 View Post
of course there is such thing as a "max pilot"...any pilots at a specific airline assigned only to the "max", would be a "max pilot" as per the airline yes? the pilots assigned to fly the the Max at Iceland, aka the "max pilots" were sent packing. they weren't employed by Boeing or the FAA..they were employed by Iceland Air...so they were Iceland Air "Max pilots"....make sense now??

i think he’s trying to say they’ll have 737NG TR anyway, so won’t be short of offers for the old skool version. I hope they get something soon.
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Old 5th Jun 2019, 11:33
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The summer leased 757 is from Privilege Style of Spain
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Old 5th Jun 2019, 16:46
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Originally Posted by PilotRoger View Post
they just don't want to have extra crew in the payroll, I guess they are being careful trying to save some money. I don't think they have any other 737, so all the training was to introduce a new type in their boeing fleet.
Would it not have been reasonable for IA to have kept the pilots on the payroll in anticipation of eventually taking delivery of the Max, and then negotiating these extra payroll costs from Boeing as part of the inevitable overall compensation package that IA, and indeed many other airlines, will be demanding?

Last edited by yellowtriumph; 5th Jun 2019 at 17:35.
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Old 5th Jun 2019, 16:55
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Fired! What is this? Some daft 'Reality' TV series?

They are being made redundant. Fired suggests it's their own fault. Who wrote this?
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Old 5th Jun 2019, 16:57
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Originally Posted by yellowtriumph View Post


Would it not have been reasonable for IA to have kept the pilots on the payroll in anticipation of eventually taking delivery of the Max, and then negotiating these extras payroll costs from Boeing as part of the inevitable overall compensation package that IA, and indeed many other airlines, will be demanding?
They might have had some info as to the date of return to service being quite remote ?
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Old 5th Jun 2019, 17:23
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Originally Posted by TURIN View Post
Fired! What is this? Some daft 'Reality' TV series?

They are being made redundant. Fired suggests it's their own fault. Who wrote this?
I do hope it's like this.
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Old 5th Jun 2019, 17:41
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Originally Posted by LTNman View Post


Southwest Airlines has removed the word Max from the flight safety cards so passengers won’t know they are in a Max. I would think the word Max won’t be appearing on any paintwork either.
Probably more airlines will follow that, if I'm not mistaken the aircraft are actually the 737-8 and 737-9, the MAX seems more like an ill fated marketing term.

Anyway, judging by the reactions Boeing's social platforms are getting to new developments, I doubt people will forget about the MAX situation any time soon.
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Old 5th Jun 2019, 18:08
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Originally Posted by yellowtriumph View Post


Would it not have been reasonable for IA to have kept the pilots on the payroll in anticipation of eventually taking delivery of the Max, and then negotiating these extra payroll costs from Boeing as part of the inevitable overall compensation package that IA, and indeed many other airlines, will be demanding?
There are real questions regarding how much compensation any airline will receive for the grounding event, but as a general point of law the harmed party has a duty to mitigate their losses and not run up the tab. Boeing could rightfully claim that IA had no duty to keep pilots on the payroll that they could no longer use absent some other contractual obligation to do so. It would have been a nice gesture on IA’s part, but it is also possible that they are looking at abandoning any plans to employ the 737 in their fleet.
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Old 5th Jun 2019, 18:33
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Originally Posted by TURIN View Post
Fired! What is this? Some daft 'Reality' TV series?

They are being made redundant. Fired suggests it's their own fault. Who wrote this?
Being made redundant is management speak for being fired. Only makes it sound better..
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Old 5th Jun 2019, 18:49
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Originally Posted by TURIN View Post
Fired! What is this? Some daft 'Reality' TV series?

They are being made redundant. Fired suggests it's their own fault. Who wrote this?
A non-native English speaker who does not know about the subtle differences between being laid off, made redundant, and fired.

So, to those who don't know the difference: being fired usually means that your employment is being terminated "for cause", meaning you ****** up and the company decided to punish you with termination. This usually happens only after you don't perform, or kick your manager in the face for example. If you have been fired, future empoyers will think twice before hiring you.

In this particular case, nobody was being "fired". The employees were made redundant (laid off). This was due to no fault of their own and future employers will not hesitate to hire them, as everyone understands the mechanics of economics.

Also note that this difference is especially important in at-will employment jurisdictions such as most states in the U.S. In my home state California, for example, my employer can let me know at any time for pretty much any reason. This is referred to as "at-will" employment. I can also quit my job at any time for any reason. The flip side of this is that I'll easily be rehired by someone else as this is without risk. This is in sharp contrast with most employment protections that employees have in most of the European Union, where in some cases an employer can only terminate an employee with permission from the government. Not to start a debate on which one is better, but just as an explanation.
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Old 5th Jun 2019, 19:22
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The B737 story is begging to look like the career of some famous actors who try and stay in the job far too long and end up making a complete fool of themselves. You can only do so much with make up, there comes a time when even the best plastic surgeon can no longer fill the boobs, stretch the wrinkles. Whilst all those unfortunate MAX crews get down to writing up their CV`s , Boeing might be starting to write a biography of their 737.
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Old 5th Jun 2019, 19:41
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"Made redundant" is very different from fired they are two different things completely.

Majority of pax not the sharpest when it comes to flying or anything in general, so after a while all will be forgotten about name's and accidents and it will be once again a race to the bottom for xyz to get to xyz the cheapest they can.

Fear not all will be forgotten
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