MAX’s Return Delayed by FAA Reevaluation of 737 Safety Procedures
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I gained the impression that it would be difficult to move the pivot point from its current position close to mid-section.
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The FAA will eventually come to an accommodation with other authorities, and I can’t help thinking that sim training will be part of the final agreement, especially as accident reports will soon be released that will make it absolutely clear how under the cosh both crews were.
If Boeing had to chose between further training for MAX crews or retro fitting servos to the stab trim systems of 7000+ NGs I suspect that they would jump at the extra training.
If Boeing had to chose between further training for MAX crews or retro fitting servos to the stab trim systems of 7000+ NGs I suspect that they would jump at the extra training.
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The answer is obvious, Ian W : Boeing and FAA top brass should go flying on a random third world airliner, with a crew chosen at the last moment, and having just performed whatever training Boeing and the FAA deemed necessary.
If it's 3/4 of an hour on a tablet, so be it.
Maybe they'll suddenly realize that a little bit more might not be a bad idea...
If it's 3/4 of an hour on a tablet, so be it.
Maybe they'll suddenly realize that a little bit more might not be a bad idea...
From another thread - this applies absolutely to the Max. See 1.2 of link
UK CAA LOC due failure to keep aircraft trimmed
Last edited by Ian W; 12th Sep 2019 at 15:11. Reason: Edited to cross link the UK CAA notice
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More concerns for Boeing.
Boeing CEO expects 737 MAX to resume flying around November, but possibly not in all countries
By Dominic Gates
Seattle Times aerospace reporter
Boeing chairman and chief executive Dennis Muilenburg on Wednesday reiterated his projection that, despite concerns publicly expressed by Europe’s air safety regulator, the 737 MAX should begin to return to service around November.
However, he conceded that lack of alignment among international regulatory bodies could mean that the grounded jet may first resume flying in the United States, with other major countries following later.
www seattletimes com/business/boeing-aerospace/boeing-ceo-expects-737-max-to-resume-flying-around-november-but-possibly-not-in-all-countries/
Boeing CEO expects 737 MAX to resume flying around November, but possibly not in all countries
By Dominic Gates
Seattle Times aerospace reporter
Boeing chairman and chief executive Dennis Muilenburg on Wednesday reiterated his projection that, despite concerns publicly expressed by Europe’s air safety regulator, the 737 MAX should begin to return to service around November.
However, he conceded that lack of alignment among international regulatory bodies could mean that the grounded jet may first resume flying in the United States, with other major countries following later.
www seattletimes com/business/boeing-aerospace/boeing-ceo-expects-737-max-to-resume-flying-around-november-but-possibly-not-in-all-countries/
Last edited by T28B; 17th Sep 2019 at 16:32. Reason: Removed irrelevant content
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If that's the case, it seems likely that the resolution will take rather a longer time than Boeing and the FAA have publicly suggested. It doesn't appear that EASA intends to be hurried.
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Actually that's probably what happened to the Lion Air accident flight, not to the Ethiopian flight. There was not much trimming done on the Ethiopian flight, but on the Lion Air accident flight they did a lot of trimming while fighting MCAS. And the control column forces recorded by the DFDR seem to indicate that the Lion Air captain handed over control to the FO shortly before they lost control.
Boeing chairman and chief executive Dennis Muilenburg on Wednesday reiterated his projection that, despite concerns publicly expressed by Europe’s air safety regulator, the 737 MAX should begin to return to service around November.
However, he conceded that lack of alignment among international regulatory bodies could mean that the grounded jet may first resume flying in the United States, with other major countries following later.
However, he conceded that lack of alignment among international regulatory bodies could mean that the grounded jet may first resume flying in the United States, with other major countries following later.
In fact, did he ever start ?
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From those slides presented to the European Parliament, EASA said they found 4 significant technical problems that would need to be addressed:
And, according to the same slides, the solutions Boeing has been working on are:
It seems none of those directly address the issue with the high force that may be required to move the manual trim wheel. I wonder what Boeing's plan is regarding that. I'm guessing they will just try to convince the EASA that it is not actually an issue. But, if after the flight tests the EASA is still not convinced, things could get very messy.
- Lack of exhaustive monitoring of the system failures resulting in a stabiliser runaway
- Too high forces needed to move the manual trim wheel in case of a stabiliser runaway
- Too late disconnection of autopilot near stall speed (in specific conditions)
- Too high crew workload and risk of crew confusion in some failure cases, especially Angle of Attack single failure at take-off
- Too high forces needed to move the manual trim wheel in case of a stabiliser runaway
- Too late disconnection of autopilot near stall speed (in specific conditions)
- Too high crew workload and risk of crew confusion in some failure cases, especially Angle of Attack single failure at take-off
- Extensive change to the Flight Control Computer architecture and logics (incl. Autopilot)
- Improved crew procedures (and associated training)
- Improved architecture and/or logics for the Angle of Attack system
- Improved crew procedures (and associated training)
- Improved architecture and/or logics for the Angle of Attack system
It seems none of those directly address the issue with the high force that may be required to move the manual trim wheel. I wonder what Boeing's plan is regarding that. I'm guessing they will just try to convince the EASA that it is not actually an issue. But, if after the flight tests the EASA is still not convinced, things could get very messy.
Surprise !
The Sims are being updated.
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Unfortunately I suspect that senior management at Boeing see the FAA as a sub-contractor charged with sorting out their regulatory problems for them. Even worse, I’m sure there are people at the FAA who see themselves in that role too!
From those slides presented to the European Parliament, EASA said they found 4 significant technical problems that would need to be addressed:
And, according to the same slides, the solutions Boeing has been working on are:
It seems none of those directly address the issue with the high force that may be required to move the manual trim wheel. I wonder what Boeing's plan is regarding that. I'm guessing they will just try to convince the EASA that it is not actually an issue. But, if after the flight tests the EASA is still not convinced, things could get very messy.
And, according to the same slides, the solutions Boeing has been working on are:
It seems none of those directly address the issue with the high force that may be required to move the manual trim wheel. I wonder what Boeing's plan is regarding that. I'm guessing they will just try to convince the EASA that it is not actually an issue. But, if after the flight tests the EASA is still not convinced, things could get very messy.
Either it is necessary or it is not
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Any solution involving hardware changes to the stabilizer trim system would open the "What about the NG?" can of worms, and I'm guessing Boeing would prefer to avoid that.
The MAX wasn’t simultaneously grounded by the worlds aviation authorities and a return to the skies is unlikely to occur at exactly the same time either. If and when agreement is reached, the first flights will almost certainly be in the US which has the most aircraft on the ground and the best means of getting them back in the air.
Other countries would follow suit suit in their own time with China being the last one as a display of independence and a response to US trade tariffs.
Other countries would follow suit suit in their own time with China being the last one as a display of independence and a response to US trade tariffs.
Somebody brought up a query from post #3. This topic was explored in a Tech Log thread. THS hinge point
I gained the impression that it would be difficult to move the pivot point from its current position close to mid-section.
I gained the impression that it would be difficult to move the pivot point from its current position close to mid-section.