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Massive birdstrike on PrecisionAir ATR72

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Massive birdstrike on PrecisionAir ATR72

Old 9th Dec 2018, 15:40
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Massive birdstrike on PrecisionAir ATR72

A picture is worth a thousand words
https://www.aviation24.be/forums/vie...375675#p375674






Last edited by Senior Pilot; 11th Dec 2018 at 02:25. Reason: Add images
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Old 9th Dec 2018, 17:41
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A picture is worth a thousand birds!
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Old 9th Dec 2018, 20:18
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perhaps these... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quelea
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Old 9th Dec 2018, 20:25
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Wow, they will need one or two of these to make it look shiny again:

https://www.turtlewax.com/our-produc...ug-tar-remover
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Old 9th Dec 2018, 20:29
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Originally Posted by Phororhacos View Post
Q. quelea is a major pest to small-grain cereal crops
well, not only to cereal crops, apparently....
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Old 9th Dec 2018, 22:03
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Robust aircraft.

Humanity is a major pest to the Quelea.

Last edited by evansb; 9th Dec 2018 at 22:21.
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Old 10th Dec 2018, 00:59
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Robust aircraft
With little critters like these it's engines you need worry about. October 4, 1960: Eastern Air Lines Flight 375 crashed on takeoff from Logan International Airport, killing 62 of 72 on board. The crash was eventually determined to be the result of bird (starlings) ingestion into three of the four engines. The bird damage caused the No. 1 propeller to autofeather and the engine to shut down at the same time that damage to the No. 2 and No. 4 engines prevented those engines from developing full power at a critical stage of flight. The aircraft was unable to climb and the power interruption to the port engines probably caused the left wing to stall; the wing dropped and the aircraft crashed into the water. There was also evidence that birds had crashed into the windscreen, reducing the pilots' visibility; in addition, bird remains had clogged the pitot tubes, making the pilots' airspeed indicators unreliable.
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Old 11th Dec 2018, 00:55
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Would a large modern passenger aircraft have that same susceptibility to a flock of smaller birds such as those starlings?
(By the photos, the thread ATR72 seemed messy but not particularly damaged. But what about engines w/ ducted fans versus large propellers...and ingestion further back into compressor and combustion stages?)

Last edited by dogsridewith; 11th Dec 2018 at 01:18.
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Old 11th Dec 2018, 01:59
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Largely depends on the speed you hit them
a bigger aircraft can sustain quite a bit of damage from even a small bird when you hit them at 300 knots
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Old 11th Dec 2018, 02:16
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Originally Posted by megan View Post
With little critters like these it's engines you need worry about. October 4, 1960: Eastern Air Lines Flight 375 crashed on takeoff from Logan International Airport, killing 62 of 72 on board. The crash was eventually determined to be the result of bird (starlings) ingestion into three of the four engines. The bird damage caused the No. 1 propeller to autofeather and the engine to shut down at the same time that damage to the No. 2 and No. 4 engines prevented those engines from developing full power at a critical stage of flight. The aircraft was unable to climb and the power interruption to the port engines probably caused the left wing to stall; the wing dropped and the aircraft crashed into the water. There was also evidence that birds had crashed into the windscreen, reducing the pilots' visibility; in addition, bird remains had clogged the pitot tubes, making the pilots' airspeed indicators unreliable.
Wings don't stall because engines fail. Power failure and loss of airspeed indicators would be hard to handle. Pure seat of the pants flying time. :-(
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Old 11th Dec 2018, 05:52
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Wings don't stall because engines fail
Two photographs were taken of the aircraft one second apart, the first indicated an IAS of 118 knots, the second 103 knots, so de-accelerating at a rate of 15 knots/sec. Stall speed at the particular configuration/weight was 108 knots, the extreme yaw compounded the ability of the left wing to develop lift due to blanketing.
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Old 11th Dec 2018, 06:30
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Originally Posted by megan View Post
Two photographs were taken of the aircraft one second apart, the first indicated an IAS of 118 knots, the second 103 knots, so de-accelerating at a rate of 15 knots/sec. Stall speed at the particular configuration/weight was 108 knots, the extreme yaw compounded the ability of the left wing to develop lift due to blanketing.
Have a look at the pilot tubes in the photos, Id say bird guts in the tubes could have given erroneous readings.
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Old 11th Dec 2018, 06:43
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Originally Posted by megan View Post
With little critters like these it's engines you need worry about. October 4, 1960: Eastern Air Lines Flight 375 crashed on takeoff from Logan International Airport, killing 62 of 72 on board. The crash was eventually determined to be the result of bird (starlings) ingestion into three of the four engines. The bird damage caused the No. 1 propeller to autofeather .....
Sounds as though the whole aircraft was completely autofeathered!
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Old 11th Dec 2018, 07:44
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Originally Posted by misd-agin View Post
Wings don't stall because engines fail. Power failure and loss of airspeed indicators would be hard to handle. Pure seat of the pants flying time. :-(
Not that I know, but Id have thought that in a critical situation the loss of prop wash wouldnt help.
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Old 11th Dec 2018, 08:29
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Originally Posted by FlightlessParrot View Post
Not that I know, but I’d have thought that in a critical situation the loss of prop wash wouldn’t help.
Well no, it clearly wouldn't.

But the key to the Electra accident lay (in the words of the CAB) "in the unique and critical sequence of a rapidly occurring chain of events", as alluded to above.
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Old 11th Dec 2018, 10:19
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FR had an incident with a flock of starlings @ CIA, flamed out both engines and the aircraft suffered a 'heavy landing'.
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Old 11th Dec 2018, 16:25
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What a mess! One of my areas of interest is common events that impact more than one sensor such that it is difficult to determine which one (or ones) is providing incorrect data. I hope we learn what the impact was on airspeed and AOA measurements. It clearly took some savvy flying to bring this one home. Well done to the crew and all who may have provided assistance.
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Old 11th Dec 2018, 16:31
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I feel for the people(s) that have to clean that, dried on bird innards is really difficult.

Qudos to the drivers though.
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Old 11th Dec 2018, 16:39
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Hats off to PW and the nacelle designers

Looks like an inertial separator did the job.
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Old 11th Dec 2018, 17:05
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Originally Posted by FCeng84 View Post
What a mess! One of my areas of interest is common events that impact more than one sensor such that it is difficult to determine which one (or ones) is providing incorrect data. I hope we learn what the impact was on airspeed and AOA measurements.
At the moment, we don't have any evidence of any in this instance.
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