Shannon stopover on way out?
Join Date: May 2001
Location: EIDW,Eire
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I DUNNO
Nice to see you with an actual opinion rather than just chirpping in with your usual c**p 2 lines.
Anyways...i say the Shannon stopover should go....but nobody in government will sign the papers if they really want to ever see the inside of Dail Eireann again.
It is such stupidity to have to stop or fly round robin flights via Shannon...and i agree with both CO and DAL for blocking any other routes that ALT may apply for in the US(although highly unlikely with what's going on right now) until the stopover is abolished.
When ALT bought those B767s for the LAX route DAL applied for the right to fly direct to Dublin using the rights on the route given to them when they bought Pan Am
but the Irish goverment....(also the ONLY shareholder in ALT, said....to DAL who had an L1011 ready for the route) "don't call us, we'll call you"....
The government delayed and delayed and eventually the L1011 went elsewhere and ALT never got the LAX route.
The B767's as i recall then were wet leased to Air Aurba and the ALT B767 drivers got to spend some nice days on the beaches in Aurba travelling via Amsterdam.
Now ALT lost their LAX route...plus 2 B767's and DAL never got to operate from JFK...
Both of them in a few years did get what both were looking for....although DAL still operates round robin flights via SNN.
Why should this happen....i have it on good authority that Air Canada would also operate direct to Dublin IF the SNN stopover was taken out.....but won't till then.....
So why doesn't the stupid ministers get off their arses and do something about it....
Wouldn't this create more revenue and interest in Ireland....and bring even more US carriers into Ireland and create a better choice on the Atlantic and save all the Paddys the trouble of going via LHR.....
What country in the world has this policy... i don't know....but the one thing i do know is as long as ALT and the Irish government are Shareholders alike....then Shannon stopover will remain....and leave all us Paddys the laughing stock of the aviation world......
Nice to see you with an actual opinion rather than just chirpping in with your usual c**p 2 lines.
Anyways...i say the Shannon stopover should go....but nobody in government will sign the papers if they really want to ever see the inside of Dail Eireann again.
It is such stupidity to have to stop or fly round robin flights via Shannon...and i agree with both CO and DAL for blocking any other routes that ALT may apply for in the US(although highly unlikely with what's going on right now) until the stopover is abolished.
When ALT bought those B767s for the LAX route DAL applied for the right to fly direct to Dublin using the rights on the route given to them when they bought Pan Am
but the Irish goverment....(also the ONLY shareholder in ALT, said....to DAL who had an L1011 ready for the route) "don't call us, we'll call you"....
The government delayed and delayed and eventually the L1011 went elsewhere and ALT never got the LAX route.
The B767's as i recall then were wet leased to Air Aurba and the ALT B767 drivers got to spend some nice days on the beaches in Aurba travelling via Amsterdam.
Now ALT lost their LAX route...plus 2 B767's and DAL never got to operate from JFK...
Both of them in a few years did get what both were looking for....although DAL still operates round robin flights via SNN.
Why should this happen....i have it on good authority that Air Canada would also operate direct to Dublin IF the SNN stopover was taken out.....but won't till then.....
So why doesn't the stupid ministers get off their arses and do something about it....
Wouldn't this create more revenue and interest in Ireland....and bring even more US carriers into Ireland and create a better choice on the Atlantic and save all the Paddys the trouble of going via LHR.....
What country in the world has this policy... i don't know....but the one thing i do know is as long as ALT and the Irish government are Shareholders alike....then Shannon stopover will remain....and leave all us Paddys the laughing stock of the aviation world......
Join Date: Aug 1999
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As I see it, there is a small number of options:
1) The US revokes our bilateral - unlikely.
2) The EU forces a change, as part of the condition for a guaranteed loan for EI, this change also being needed to complete the EU-US bilateral
3) US airlines, CO/DL threaten pullout until govt gets its act together - which may result in one US city (LAX?) being w/drawn
No2 seems most likely to me, although the EU is moving very slowly, perhaps because of intense Irish diplomatic moves. However, MO'R will be in BRU on Friday to push the case for a guaranteed loan and the issue may come up then. The EU will play hard ball on this and is by no means guaranteed to allow the guarantee. However, the ace card the Irish govt holds now is the Nice treaty, which was rejected in June. Unions have said, basically, no aid, no Nice.
If this does not result in the ending of the stopover, I would expect the US carriers, who must be fairly exasperated now, to look at their Irish operations and the likelihood of them being profitable through the Winter and Summer, in the current market conditions, and then present an ultimatum.
I have to disagree that any politician who "signs the papers" is out of Dail Eireann. Firstly, as much as the Shannon people might like to portray otherwise, it's them against everyone else. Dublin is the hub for other domestic routes - Donegal, Galway, Sligo, Kerry etc,- not Shannon. Also, more fundamentally, what we are talking about is not so much a stopover but a linkage. HOW does the removal of the current linkage (i.e. 1 for 1) hurt Shannon? This question simply has not been asked and only Mary Harney so far has asked it. We're back to 1992/3 again - the Shannon crowd is using a big stick and the governemnt is cowering.
1) The US revokes our bilateral - unlikely.
2) The EU forces a change, as part of the condition for a guaranteed loan for EI, this change also being needed to complete the EU-US bilateral
3) US airlines, CO/DL threaten pullout until govt gets its act together - which may result in one US city (LAX?) being w/drawn
No2 seems most likely to me, although the EU is moving very slowly, perhaps because of intense Irish diplomatic moves. However, MO'R will be in BRU on Friday to push the case for a guaranteed loan and the issue may come up then. The EU will play hard ball on this and is by no means guaranteed to allow the guarantee. However, the ace card the Irish govt holds now is the Nice treaty, which was rejected in June. Unions have said, basically, no aid, no Nice.
If this does not result in the ending of the stopover, I would expect the US carriers, who must be fairly exasperated now, to look at their Irish operations and the likelihood of them being profitable through the Winter and Summer, in the current market conditions, and then present an ultimatum.
I have to disagree that any politician who "signs the papers" is out of Dail Eireann. Firstly, as much as the Shannon people might like to portray otherwise, it's them against everyone else. Dublin is the hub for other domestic routes - Donegal, Galway, Sligo, Kerry etc,- not Shannon. Also, more fundamentally, what we are talking about is not so much a stopover but a linkage. HOW does the removal of the current linkage (i.e. 1 for 1) hurt Shannon? This question simply has not been asked and only Mary Harney so far has asked it. We're back to 1992/3 again - the Shannon crowd is using a big stick and the governemnt is cowering.
