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Aer Lingus suspends pilots & ops (merged)

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Aer Lingus suspends pilots & ops (merged)

Old 22nd May 2002, 13:43
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Red face Aer Lingus suspends pilot

Earlier today the Aer Lingus Chief Pilot suspended a captain for failing to operate to a new set of Working Conditions that have not been agreed between the company and IALPA.

This enforcement is basically a tearing up by management of the current agreement that exists between both parties.

Sadly no respect is being shown for agreements or the law - by a State owned company and it's managers.

The suspension is reportedly without pay.

Industrial Action is sure to follow.
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Old 22nd May 2002, 14:07
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Ballot boxes being dusted off as we speak no doubt!!
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Old 22nd May 2002, 14:40
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Could someone tell us what "working conditions" are being imposed? What FTLs are being used and how do they compare with the existing agreeement? Also what pay cuts are management seeking?
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Old 22nd May 2002, 14:57
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now remember to take your shoes off, you wanna make sure you see all of both your feet as you pull the trigger - dont miss a pinkie
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Old 22nd May 2002, 15:57
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The pilots have recently given huge cost savings through deferring a pay award, and through the acceptance of a voluntary severance package for some of it's members.


The company have now demanded that crews be scheduled to their maximum admin manual limits - 14 hours, along with a lot of other changes - loss of days off. loss of leave entitlements, etc...

Aer Lingus has never been the best for money or conditions - but the current demands are beyond just about every other airline out there.

Just ask some of the 50+ pilots that have lesft in the last couple of years.
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Old 22nd May 2002, 16:58
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If it's effectively a change to the guy's contract, he has to approve it and sign it. Only then is it enforceable. They cannot change the pilots' contracts without their agreement (enforced or otherwise).

So, on the surface, and with not a lot to go on, so far it sounds like unlawful dismissal.
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Old 22nd May 2002, 17:01
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Jo.......less of the one liners and more facts. Aer Lingus have treated their pilots with derision, ridicule,lied about facts and broke agreements to the point that as management as a whole have a farcial relationship with the staff. I for one am very sorry to see Aer Lingus pilots treated so badly. If management get their way AL pilots will be the cheapest in Europe and are nearly there any way. Some similarities are when Lan Chile bust their pilots union. I expect support for these guys not warnings where you take a p*ss.
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Old 22nd May 2002, 19:20
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If conditions are so bad, then leave. For everyone outside being a pilot when the going gets stupid, we get going, either changing companys or career. If pilots did not cling onto 'seniority' and moved to the more common place meritocrisy then this is an avenue you would have.

Aer Lingus is in an awful state right now, a strike is just what is needed to get rid of those last few high yield passengers, keeping the whoile thing moving. With the ridiculous Shannon stop, it is as easy and as quick to fly to MAN or LHR and connect to a flight there - more and more people do it every day.
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Old 22nd May 2002, 20:03
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Jongar,

Aer Lingus pilots have been acknowledged by the AEA to exceed the industry average in terms of efficiency for many years.

Currently Aer Lingus is enjoying a period of the highest ever load factors. And they are managing this with 1700 less staff than a year ago.

So Jongar, what awful state is Aer Lingus in? Perhaps you know something that the rest of us don't.

As for the Shannon stop - how do you blame that on the pilots?

And as for everyone leaving- fifty have already done so this year, with a lot more to follow.


Bearcat,

the big fear - if they bust us, then every other association and group in Europe will follow.


Captain Stable
- just about sums things up. I heard their union - IALPA is going to hold a token 24 hour stoppage. Seems a rather pathetic gesture somehow.
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Old 22nd May 2002, 20:24
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If I didn't know any better, I'd say you were talking about CX. Now all that is left is to fire a bunch of guys. Yikes!!! This is getting f*cking ordinary!
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Old 22nd May 2002, 21:07
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CX went Union busting
LAN Chili went union busting
Willie Wanka has gone union busting in Ei


Spot the common thread?


OneWorld



Aiming to become WorstWorld
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Old 22nd May 2002, 21:14
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Angry

tonyryan, you hit it right on the nail!
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Old 22nd May 2002, 22:58
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Captain Stable

so far it sounds like unlawful dismissal.
Suspension (with or without pay) is suspension, not dismissal. Unless of course you are thinking about constructive dismissal, which if memory serves is more a British thing, and less effective than it used to be.

They cannot change the pilots' contracts without their agreement (enforced or otherwise).
Can anybody actually confirm that this is the case under Irish law...???
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Old 22nd May 2002, 23:17
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The Captain suspended refused to accept a 10 hour rest period. This is contrary to the 13 hours specified in the agreed working conditions.

By tomorrow, it looks like he will be joined by another 2 at least.
This is purely a union busting exercise by WW. Those of you out there in other airlines, especially oneworld members should take note.

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Old 22nd May 2002, 23:39
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Capt. Ted Murphy has been closely involved with what has been going on at CX for quite a while now. It seems that Aer Lingus is taking notes from CX and starting to try on a union bust of their own.

I would suggest all the members of your pilots union get ready for a nasty fight. It's been almost a year now since some of our 49ers have been at work. Have a look at the Fragrant Harbour forum, it can predict the future.
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Old 23rd May 2002, 01:11
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Yep...and the news there is all BAD, especially for "union" guys.
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Old 23rd May 2002, 01:17
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Unhappy

come on all ye alt comrades.........speak out of character will yus...tell the world what it's all about........a chief pilot that might as well stick to play'in the piano.as opposed to making decisions...why don't ye all stand up for those who have the balls to make a stand, butler you ain't one with any balls of your own...hang in there steve m...........u to colin and padraig.......we are all watching from afar to, see what your made of......


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Old 23rd May 2002, 05:13
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Angry Aer Lingus suspends pilot

Well I couldn't agree more. What Cathy did is really a shame. It's the boys there not doing anything? I suggest AL pilots to stick together and organise something....like unofficially declaring all flights by buddy pilots to go on high drag approaches and etc...... Show u mean business.
WHAT DO U SAY??
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Old 23rd May 2002, 09:10
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The most appaling part of all this is that the Chief Pilot / Flight Operations Manager is a guy who was once the life and soul of the place - well liked and respected.

Unfortunately he now appears to value his personal friendship with WW so much that he is willing to suspend a classmate of 24 years standing and lose all the respect and even other friendships.

Might I suggest that he remove the "Chief Pilot" from his title as he no longer has the support of his pilots?

Let's wait and see how many of his former colleagues and friends invite him around for a BBQ this year - or ever again.
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Old 23rd May 2002, 11:18
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Exclamation Strike Notice

At 1730z on 22nd May 2002 Irish ALPA served strike notice on Aer
Lingus to take place at 0001z 30th May for 24 hours following the suspension of an Aer Lingus Captain who followed IALPA's directive not to operate to the work rules which were rejected by 99% of IALPA members in a secret ballot.

In this instance the Captain, with 24 years unblemished service, refused to operate during his 13 hour rest period which management have reduced to 10 hours without agreement.
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